Giant 2014...nearly all 650b

stuisnew

Surprised nobody has posted about this yet. ..

http://m.bikemag.com/gear/news-giant-go ... with-27-5/

http://m.pinkbike.com/news/650B-For-All ... Bikes.html

Amazingly frank from Giant. Most startling is admission that they will phase out 29 "in two years"...

supersonic

The way some are talking they are going to have you believe 29er were the biggest red herring of the decade. Oh dear Specialized!

rockmonkeysc

supersonic wrote:

The way some are talking they are going to have you believe 29er were the biggest red herring of the decade. Oh dear Specialized!

Thats exactly why im sticking with 26" for a few more years until I know whats staying.

supersonic

And me. The manufacturers are just getting ridiculous now with it.

rockmonkeysc

Next year they will be selling the sharper steering characteristics of the new 26" wheels.

supersonic

GT are worst with this, pretty much proclaiming their new 'AOS/Pathlink' suspension (ie Mongoose Freedrive) suspenion will only work with 27.5 - then they put a smaller tyre on the rear, the reasons being they don't want the wheel too big. Eh?!

cooldad

So they decided 650B is nicer to ride than 29er. I'll be sticking with my 26er until it dies anyway.

Kowalski675

While Juskaitis notes that Giant will continue to offer 29ers in 2014, he maintains that 27.5 is the future for the company. “We have not killed 29 in 2014, but it is minimized,” explains Juskaitis. “We are not going to turn off the tap entirely this year, but we do have plans to phase it out over time.”

"Phasing out" 29ers already? Well, the new big thing didn't last very long then, did it? :roll:

97th choice

I'm trying to convince myself I need a 'spare' 26" Trance from Paul's cycles, their stock can't last forever

foy

Supersonic you always have your finger on the pulse when it comes to anything about mountain biking. Is all this 29er and 27.5 wheel stuff just pure marketing bullshit. I must admit that i was mega shocked when specialized dropped their entire 26 er range last year. The thing i just do not understand is that if you talk to bike folk in the know they keep telling us that 29ers are selling like hotcakes and that they are the future in wheel size. So why are giant santa cruz and trek now plugging the 27.5 as the next best thing. I am very confused by all this just like many others.

stubs

I have often wondered why if they wanted a tyre size between 26er and 29er did they choose the 650B which was an old French size no one else used why didnt they go with the old British 26 x 1 1/4 or 26 x 1 3/8 sizes which are much closer to a mythical 27.5.

adamfo

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Thats exactly why im sticking with 26" for a few more years until I know whats staying.

It's 650b and 29ers. Look no further than this months Interbike show. Virtually all the new models are these sizes fom Canyon, Scott, Lapierre etc.

foy

The thing that really strikes me about 29ers is that they just dont look right, they look totally stupid and the geometry just does not look right either. I tried one once at delamere forest and it was like driving an articulated lorry, and i would not have a 29er given to me for free.

slindborg

I'm sure some of it will be from tyre and wheel manufacturers, and then the bike oem's too.

IMHO its only a good thing that there is more than one wheel size, its a good thing that some oem's are picking one size, some are picking a mix.... Choice is great and there is no wrong answer ever. You don't get this level of internet carnage when car makers use different wheel sizes

Kowalski675

slindborg wrote:

IMHO its only a good thing that there is more than one wheel size,

Not if your fancy new bike with 4 figure price tag is the MTB equivalent of Betamax, Laserdisc or Video 2000 in a couple of years time...

stuisnew

slindborg wrote:

Choice is great and there is no wrong answer ever. You don't get this level of internet carnage when car makers use different wheel sizes

Car analogy is not particularly relevant imho as there isn't a universal size. But if on the back of heavy marketing and reviews you bought a new car that ran on something other than petrol say, and then got told a year later 'Hey petrol was the best thing after all' there would be carnage!

Not sure anyone who invested in 24 inch wheels for downhill or those weird egg shaped chainrings would agree that "there is no wrong answer ever"...

rockmonkeysc

foy wrote:

The thing that really strikes me about 29ers is that they just dont look right, they look totally stupid and the geometry just does not look right either. I tried one once at delamere forest and it was like driving an articulated lorry, and i would not have a 29er given to me for free.

29ers definitely have a place. I don't really like them but they are faster and they are noticeably different to 26".
650B is so close to 26" that it feels the same to ride.

slindborg

HD-DVD was the right choice well it got me swordfish in HD before blu-ray could.

If something is a fad and fails then it tends to early on in its life, according to wiki hese pesky big wheels have been about since the 90's if not the 80's..... That's no fad, that's just a slow changing market and the clever marketing chaps making the most of each possible phase.

Ofcourse giant will say the 29er isn't going anywhere if they have committed to 650b for a few years, if they didnt say that then they would invariably lose sales to those wanting a 29er.

Ps petrol and diesel is the rigt answer

paul.skibum

slindborg wrote:

HD-DVD was the right choice well it got me swordfish in HD before blu-ray could.

If something is a fad and fails then it tends to early on in its life, according to wiki hese pesky big wheels have been about since the 90's if not the 80's..... That's no fad, that's just a slow changing market and the clever marketing chaps making the most of each possible phase.

Ofcourse giant will say the 29er isn't going anywhere if they have committed to 650b for a few years, if they didnt say that then they would invariably lose sales to those wanting a 29er.

Ps petrol and diesel is the rigt answer

Of course the big wheels have been around for ages - road bikes run them - as for the 650B they were around pre war I believe but that doesn't make them part of a slow changing market it just means some one picked one up and went ooh I wonder.....

Giant and Spesh chucked their hats in the 29er ring pretty vigorously a couple of years back to see one of the big players ditching it now makes me think that Spesh cant be far behind - 650B at least makes some sense to me but I still like my 26er!

supersonic

foy wrote:

Supersonic you always have your finger on the pulse when it comes to anything about mountain biking. Is all this 29er and 27.5 wheel stuff just pure marketing bullshit. I must admit that i was mega shocked when specialized dropped their entire 26 er range last year. The thing i just do not understand is that if you talk to bike folk in the know they keep telling us that 29ers are selling like hotcakes and that they are the future in wheel size. So why are giant santa cruz and trek now plugging the 27.5 as the next best thing. I am very confused by all this just like many others.

A lot of it is now marketing crap. I like choice - but removing 26ers is absurd. It has all stemmed from Specialized - sure Bontrager/Trek/Fisher toyed with 29ers in the mainstream, but it was Spesh who really took it onboard and pushed it hard. Their sales increased, so others jumped on the bandwaggon for a slice of the pie. However not all wanted to compete direct, and so we have 650B. Some changed to this, now others don't want to get left behind (ie are afraid they cannot sell) so are changing too, hence the destruction of 26ers, which accentuates the problem further. I am absolutely in now doubt that for a lot of manufacturers it is nothing to do with giveing us the best bike, but is all about sales.

Amazing coincidence that the new sizes already happened to exist and are the most popular adult size wheels?... Not seen any data models from anyone comparing a number of sizes. Sure we need standards for the reason fork/wheel/tyre manufacturers are not going to make dozens of different sizes of each model. But the existing fork/wheel/tyre standards are here because of what bike manufacturers told them they wanted (or one or two did). They could have used their R and D to test any size to start. And now we end up with this ludicrous 27.5 moniker (which is not in the middle of the sizes).

However - there is no doubt that some people do like the new kit. Nothing against that, but I am against the manufacturers taking away tried and tested stuff that people still like, and not looking at a broad range of sizes but using what is already there. An extra dose of crap appears as now some are trying to get rid of 29ers, some who took them aboard to start! A triple piece of "lets get them to buy something new" pie for them!

adamfo

Giant's Global Product manager said " .....26-inch for sure, but 29-inch will be dependent on market feedback"

http://m.pinkbike.com/news/650B-For-All ... Bikes.html

Hedging his bets in other word. My guess is many larger European manufacturers decided sometime back to consolidate on 650b and 29ers in hardtail and short travel FS form.

I noticed there were some basic areas in the press release. Quote:

"The larger the diameter of a wheel, the greater the contact patch of the tire. A larger contact patch results in better traction—which improves acceleration, deceleration and cornering. 27.5 wheels provide a contact patch that is similar to 29-inch wheels."

In fact, assuming the same weight and tyre pressure, the total contact patch area is the same regardless of tyre size. Basic physics. What changes is the shape of the contact patch. The bigger tyre has a longer contact patch hence more traction. What Giant have probably done is assume the 29er is always heavier.

adamfo

I'm a fan of 29er hardtails and 29 short FS bikes but the 29er Trance always looked a bit unbalanced to me. The Trance 650b looks better.

2013 trance x1 26"


trance 27.5 140mm travel


2014 trance 29 120mm



2013 anthem 26"


anthem 27.5 100mm


2014 anthem 29er 100mm

downhillbike

still rather have a 26er

RandG

downhillbike wrote:

still rather have a 26er

I'm staggered by folk who say this, and there are a few.

It's like they are stuck in a time warp or stubborn to change, like old folk with video recorders or mobile fones.

I wonder how many of those same folk said they wouldn't have suspension forks or disk brakes, and have have both :roll:

lbalony

It is confusing time. Bought my Norco Sight then the designer announced that its probably not going to be made next year. Just the 29er & 650b. I think 26 & 29 have a place. I cannot comment on 650b as not tried one. It does seem rather close to 26 though?

Anyway I bought my bike 6 months ago so has a good few years left in it yet so hopefully will have all settled and everyone will have favoured Betamax or Vhs!

lbalony

RandG wrote:

downhillbike wrote:

still rather have a 26er

I'm staggered by folk who say this, and there are a few.

It's like they are stuck in a time warp or stubborn to change, like old folk with video recorders or mobile fones.

I wonder how many of those same folk said they wouldn't have suspension forks or disk brakes, and have have both :roll:

I am 5ft6 and fine on my 26er! Tried a 29er and I preferred my 26er. If I rode canal paths and xc for speed id probably invest in a 29er. But I love my 26er for my fun all mountain attempt at riding!

I might get a 29er though on cyclescheme as its a 1k bike for 600ish and rather have a 29er than a road bike. Be good for fitness during the week locally.can save the best (26er) for the trail centre outings then

YeehaaMcgee

I love this bit, from the Pinkbike link...

Can we expect to see 29 and 26-inch wheels eventually disappear in Giant's consumer-priced bikes in the near future?
· 26-inch for sure, but 29-inch will be dependent on market feedback. That said, if the market progresses the way we believe it will, 29-inch will be phased out in approximately two years....again, totally dependent on market feedback.

So, they'll accept market feedback on whether or not to make 29ers, but they'll ignore market backlash about 26"?
Yeah, that, right there, is why there's a sudden abundance of big wheelers, and like Sonic says, it has zero to do with R&D, they just picked another convenient size off the shelf.

supersonic

RandG wrote:

downhillbike wrote:

still rather have a 26er

I'm staggered by folk who say this, and there are a few.

It's like they are stuck in a time warp or stubborn to change, like old folk with video recorders or mobile fones.

I wonder how many of those same folk said they wouldn't have suspension forks or disk brakes, and have have both :roll:

I'd still have a 26er. I have enough experience to decide this. 650b and 700c are not always better, thought we'd all established this.

YeehaaMcgee

I have a 26er, and a 700C. The 26er is by far the most fun to ride, although the 700C is undoubtedly faster over mild terrain.

WindyG

Reading through this from Giant's site http://www.giant-bicycles.com/technology/tech27-5/94/ the gains from going to 27.5 are not really enough to justify ditching 26" wheels, I would rather have the lighter faster accelerating wheel, I just can't see the real world gains a 27.5 has to offer and I doubt many riders would.

97th choice

Based on research, and actually riding bikes, (an often overlooked, but necessary step in purchasing!) I came to the conclusion that a hardtail 29er was better for long, non technical xc runs and commuting. Whilst a decent 26" full suss still represents the most fun you can have, on technical trails. I have no idea if it may be marginally slower than an 29er or a 650b but I do know that i mostly ride a bike for fun, not to achieve marginal efficiency gains at the expense of everything else.