Really must learn to do bike repairs....

beau selector

Hi everyone,

First time posting on this part of the site....

Took my bike into my LBS this morning to be told that the chain, rear cassette & front chainrings all need changing. The rear chainring is an 8 speed 11-28, which seems to be harder to get hold of than an 11-25 for example, while the front is 50-34 compact. Including labour this came to around £200.

This was slightly disappointing since these components are little over a year old & have probably only done a thousand or so miles, the last 8 months having been somewhat quiet since parenthood drastically reduced my available time for riding (though hopefully this will start moving the other way shortly!!) I guess reasons for what seems to be such rapid wear might include my riding style (too much time in the bigger chainring at low cadence though I'm not sure this is the case) or lack of care for the chain (though I'd like to think I clean it pretty regularly but maybe not regularly enough).

Needless to say if this is happening every thousand miles or so then the cost is soon going to add up, so I guess there are two things that I can do about it. The first, as alluded to above, is to look at my riding style & care for my bike - any advice here gratefully accepted. The second is of course to learn how to do the job myself. As someone with little experience of bike maintenance (save for cleaning, tyre changes & the odd gear adjustment) how hard should it be to do this? Is there a great deal to learn about the different parts & components required or is it as simple as chainset, rear cassette, chain & tools?

Apologies if this is covered in other topics - a quick search didn't show up anything but I guess I could have missed it.

dnwhite88

If you avoid 'cross chaining' (running big at the front and back or small front and back) this will cut down the wear on the components as will keeping them clean. I find little and often is much better than waiting til everything is covered in crap. Bike maintanence is relatively simple and YouTube will teach you everything you need to know

steve1312

Problems stem from chain stretching and wearing out the gears and chian rings buy a chain wear tool for a few quid and regularly check the chain for wear. Replace the chain when required will save a fortune as you'll only need a new chain and not full drive train

beau selector

Cheers for the replies so far. I forgot to mention my general level of cack handedness with these things but I guess with plenty of patience & looking at any videos many times over I'll get there eventually & there's always the LBS to fall back on if I go wrong. I'm quite conscious about cross chaining so hopefully that's not the cause. As for the rest I guess it's not been little enough & often enough up to now so thanks for that bit of advice. Ditto the chain tool; prevention better than cure & all that.

clickrumble

Did they tell you why this lot needed changing? Seems fairly low mileage for major component changes such as these. From my own experience, which isn't too long yet, I have been able to do most jobs on the bike with the aid of a Park Tools set and a bike stand. I can find most of what I need to know from a combination of this and other forums, utube and manufacturers' websites.

doug5_10

If you've just had your entire drivetrain replaced after 1000 miles, I would say your LBS has pulled a MASSIVE fast one I'm afraid! Even with little maintenance, I would very much doubt anything but the chain needed replacing after that mileage. +1 for chain tool/ruler and replacing chains at .75% wear will get 2-3 chains to every cassette. Chainrings last for 10,000 miles plus and through several cassettes.

beau selector

There was a pretty clear difference between the bigger chainring (very sharp looking indeed) and the smaller one (still looked in pretty good condition) while the chain wear tool had plenty of room for movement as well. Last time I was out I noticed the chain slipped quite a lot too so I'm pretty sure it needed replacing too.

I agree that it does seem like low mileage considering all 3 components were changed 1,000 or so miles ago & the guy did ask whether I spent most of my time in the bigger chainring (to which the answer is 'yes' as I rarely use it on any flat roads.) Hopefully checking the chain regularly as well as cleaning it more often will help. While we're on the subject does anyone have any magic formula for actually cleaning a chain cleaner as mine gets pretty filthy I find getting inside to clean it pretty tricky?

beau selector

doug5_10 wrote:

If you've just had your entire drivetrain replaced after 1000 miles, I would say your LBS has pulled a MASSIVE fast one I'm afraid!

Disappointing if so & another reason to learn to do all this myself. The bigger chainring did look pretty worn though (assuming I'm right in thinking very sharp looking teeth are a sign of this) which was the reason that they gave for needing to replace it.

16mm

The big chainring often has profiled teeth to help shifting. These can look like worn or broken teeth.
Take a close look at
http://cdn.media.cyclingnews.com/photos ... le_600.jpg
Do you have the chainring that was replaced?

If the chain really was skipping on the same sprocket then I'd imagine your chain and cassette were worn.

Have you got the parts that were removed?

night_porter

Although I agree with doug5_10 that apart from the chain these parts should not have needed replacing I did a quick check of the cost of the components and they are:

11-28 8 speed cassette £16.79 (Wiggle)
8 speed chain £10.19 (Wiggle)
Shimano 2300 8 speed full chainset with cranks £39.70 (mailorderbikes)

parts cost £66.68

You could get a complete toolkit for about £27.99 (Halfords) which would have all of the tools required to make the changes.

Total cost £94.67

Please please please find another bike shop, you have been had over.

16mm

I don't think it's fair comparing online prices to LBS prices, esp places like wiggle. The lbs will pay more from the distributor for a start.

Plus the labour costs at LBS are usually much less per hour than a car garage.

The prices seems OK ish, the question is if the work was required or not?

keef66

For comparison, my bike has just done 5000 miles, and I'm on the 5th chain but the original cassette and chainrings. I probably replace the chain a bit earlier than I need to, but it extends the life of the other components.

I suspect it will need a new cassette next time I replace the chain

Kimble

i actually agree with both nightporter and 16mm... night porters costs look right (good research there) and it is unfair to comparew online costs v lbs (apples and oranges).
With a basic toolkit like http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/TOJWTK/jobsworth_tool_kit
you can do most any job (yes some of the metal is a bit soft (pedal wrench) and there are countless better ones but starting out this ticks most of the boxes and is a neat handy toolkit..) on the parts that wear often espc if you have a vice grip and cable cutters already.

I would also question if the work needed doing or not... chains should last at least 2k (kilometres), cassette 4k, chainrings (8k) depneding on quality... e.g. shimano 105

night_porter

If your lbs pays more than I pay for parts, which I am 100% certain they do not, then tell them to buy from Wiggle and get the parts cheaper.

I commute on a road bike with 9 speed Tiagra and have ridden about 20,000 miles on 2 chainsets, 2 cassettes and 4 chains. 1,000 miles is nothing and I have no doubt these parts did not need changing.

However, my point was how much you could save yourself even with buying a toolkit which would only need buying once.

slowbike

night_porter wrote:

1,000 miles is nothing and I have no doubt these parts did not need changing.

Hmm - if the chain checker had room for manoeuvre then that at least needed changing - it had probably worn the cassette too. The chainring may have been fine - but without pics it's difficult to tell.
I left changing my first chain too long and had to replace the cassette at the same time. I know now - which is why it's replaced more often.

night_porter wrote:

However, my point was how much you could save yourself even with buying a toolkit which would only need buying once.

Indeed - tools to change a chain & cassette are cheap and the job is simple enough...

beau selector

OnYourRight wrote:

1. Ignore comments above suggesting you didn’t need things replaced and that your bike shop ripped you off. If even your old chain was skipping then you had extreme wear on the sprockets and probably the chainrings too. (Normally only new chains skip.)

2. Are you sure you did only 1000 miles, and that the bike was new before you got it? That would be an unusual (but not unheard of) wear rate. Does the bike often get wet? 1000 miles is only about thirty 30-mile rides. No chance you’re underestimating how much you rode?

3. The toothed wheels at the back are called sprockets and together they form a cassette. You called them chainrings earlier, which confused some posters. Chainrings are at the front. Were the sharp-looking teeth at the front or the back?

4. If you mostly use one sprocket at the back (the large one, I think you said), then naturally the wear rate is much higher than if you spread the load over several gears – or even across two sprockets (which would halve the wear rate). Wear in any component spreads across the rest of the drivetrain quickly.

I think it does need replacing tbh - no question about the chain & comparing the outer chainring with the one in the photo above the teeth certainly look a lot sharper on mine. Probably better to look forward & make sure I look after it all better whether that's checking for wear more often or looking at the way I ride, not to mention changing the components myself, which doesn't sound excessively difficult judging by the advice I've had so far.

I don't think I've massively underestimated the difference - I'm going by the odometer on my bike computer which reset to zero when the battery was changed around the same time as the chain & cassette. The chainset is a little newer though only a couple of hundred miles or so I think.

As far as riding goes I do spend most of the time on the outer chainring unless I'm going uphill & again I'm probably in the same 2 or 3 sprockets the majority of the time, so maybe I need to look at this & see if my cadence is too high and I need to use bigger gears when I can.

Thanks to all for the advice anyway, the willingness of people to share advice & wisdom is one of the many good things about cycling isn't it?

Tom Butcher

Well I'm pretty certain the chainrings (front rings) didn't need replacing at 1k miles. I've never had a cassette that didn't last at least 3k miles even purely winter mileage with limited maintenance, and chains should easily last longer than 1k though some may choose to change them then to prolong the life of their drivetrain.

OK so if the OP rides in one sprocket that's going to accelerate wear - but the fact the shop has also replaced the chainrings makes me doubt that anything actually needed replacing. The slipping chain was more likely just poor indexing or maybe a damaged link.

pdw

My commuter is on about 12,000 miles, and is onto its third chain, but original chainrings and cassette.

Most chain checkers are very unreliable, as they conflate roller wear (which doesn't matter) with pin wear (which does).

Changing all of these components is trivial, so definitely learn to DIY for the future. Measure your chain using a ruler or tape measure. Change the chain when it gets to 0.5% "stretch" and it'll be a very long time before you need to change anything else.

beau selector

This might help solve an argument - pictures of the offending components. Would you be replacing them in this state of wear? As before thoughts & advice welcomed....

andrewjoseph

difficult to tell, but i would say that chainring looks ok. almost impossible to tell on the cassette.

i only changed my mtb outer ring last week after 7 years/ 7000km riding in all weathers, because it was starting to drop the chain when i hit big bumps.

jacknorell

Hard to tell with those components. However, they don't look that worn from the photos, just in need of a degreasing / clean.

1,000 miles is a lot less than I've gotten from XT MTB chains, when I was living in Bristol (mud/clay and lots of rain). Admittedly, did do decent cleaning regimen, but that's still harsher by far than most people's winter road bikes deal with. Commuters should see even less wear.

I think you may have had stiff links in the chain and poor indexing causing slips.

Or, you did some extreme wear on those bits.

keef66

I'd say the outer chainring is worn; the teeth look pretty pointy in places. Impossible to say from that pic of the cassette, but if the chain was worn and you've done that to the chainring, I suspect under all that crap is a worn cassette too.