10m TT training

CoutinhoRed

Sorry I created this subject in another thread but realised its at home here.

Basically looking to start competing in time trials, preferably 10 mile time trials.

My training is really unstructured being I only have two different types of sessions - 100km @ medium effort, and 50km @ medium/comfortably hard effort. Both sessions involve hills as I live near Surrey.

So what sessions are ideal for this event?

LegendLust

CoutinhoRed wrote:

Sorry I created this subject in another thread but realised its at home here.

Basically looking to start competing in time trials, preferably 10 mile time trials.

My training is really unstructured being I only have two different types of sessions - 100km @ medium effort, and 50km @ medium/comfortably hard effort. Both sessions involve hills as I live near Surrey.

So what sessions are ideal for this event?

This is a good starting point - http://www.timetrialtraining.co.uk/

maryka

If you never ride 10-30 min really hard in training, you'll find it difficult to do that well in a race.

Start doing intervals at 90-95% of max effort (for the duration) for 10, 15, 20 min at a time. Rest for a couple of minutes between. Focus on pacing nice and steadily, not going out super hard for 5 min then blowing up in the final 5 min.

Also work on your position, try to get as out of the wind as possible -- narrow and compact on the bike.

CoutinhoRed

Thanks for the advice. I've got a turbo trainer but am reluctant to use it in this season, but if it means training better than I will. As for trying to be as compact on the bike as possible - I tried aero bars but hated them!

maryka

CoutinhoRed wrote:

Thanks for the advice. I've got a turbo trainer but am reluctant to use it in this season, but if it means training better than I will. As for trying to be as compact on the bike as possible - I tried aero bars but hated them!

You don't need a turbo to do 20 min intervals, you just need a decent stretch of road or a loop. In fact, it's probably better at this point to do your intervals on the road as you can work on position and skills as well as fitness.

VaVaVeteran

Surrey's A3 and A31 both offer opportunities for you to race 10 mile TTs. Once you've done so, you'll better understand the kind of intensity you will need to train at in order to improve. http://bit.ly/TTsGood is where I blogged a little about time trialling. You should persevere with getting comfortable on the aero bars. At the speed you'll be doing they will make a vital difference to helping you cover the distance faster for the same expenditure of energy. Clubs such as the Charlotteville and VC Godalming & Haslemere might be good for you. I will leave you with this thought: the kind of training you need to do in order to be fast at 10 mile time trials will be extremely uncomfortable for the legs and the lungs. Enjoy!

andysol

The old saying if you want to ride long train long, go fast train fast (but for the distance you are targeting). A 10 TT is basically balls out for 20-30 mins.
Intervals certainly can you you improve, i used sufferfest videos, repeated the TT course each week and watched my average speed. I pushed it to improve by 0.25-0.5mph each week initially until you reach an impase.
TT's are bloody hard, painful and good fun.
Enjoy
Any

ilovemytinbred

Just doing tts regularly as suggested has to be the first step. In parallel you need to get used to using aero bars and adopting a decent position. Most people have a terrible position, if you give it a bit of thought you will be ahead of the game.

I am all for shorter stuff, but don't rule out longer rides too. I gained a lot from longer stuff and it really works for some people. That is really the thing, what works for some does not work for others.

I am an average tester who has been at it on and off for a couple of years. I like to do quite a few miles early in the season and then do quite a lot of work at a pace just under (90-95% power) what I can sustain for an hour under race conditions. I like a single block of 45 mins. This hurts, some people prefer 2x20 but I do better with a single block. It is mentally very hard to do especially on a turbo but your ability to suffer can be trained! Later I layer a couple of sessions a week at 95-100% hour power, again 45 mins. I would not jump straight into doing this as it can mess you up if you are not careful. Finally I concentrate on 20 min stuff at 10 pace and some 1 minute stuff with any longer rides being very easy. Then I try and go as fast as I can with a number on my back.

SteppenHerring

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If you want a friendly open 10 to start with, then the Addiscombe Open 10 on August 31st would be nice. It's in the afternoon (first rider off 14:01). The CTT Internet Entry makes it super easy to get in. It's a very simple course (G10/42 - lovely new tarmac on the return) and there will be cake lovingly hand made by Joyce and Amy (and maybe myself).

The only way to get used to riding TTs is to ride them. I can push myself on the turbo but it's not the same if you haven't got a guy with a beard and a stopwatch at the end.

RyanV49er

I've started working with a coach this month, focussing on road racing at E12 level. One of the things I've been forced to work on is my lactic tolerance, something needed for getting into breakaways, bridging gaps, and also in 10 mile TTs. The main focus seems to be over two stages: Firstly, you drill it for between 5 and 15 minutes to build up lactic acid. Then you put in shorter max interval efforts with residual fatigue to force your body to get better at working under lactic acid. I'm not sure if this is perfect for 10TTs, but it's working for me so far for road racing, and seems to make a lot of sense.

Hope that helps.

ugo.santalucia

what do I need to enter a 10 TT? Do I need a British Cycling membership? Or just buy the insurance on the day?

maryka

ugo.santalucia wrote:

what do I need to enter a 10 TT? Do I need a British Cycling membership? Or just buy the insurance on the day?

If it's a British Cycling TT (there aren't many) then yes, standard BC membership rules apply.

Most TTs are Cycling Time Trials which means entering is a bit more complicated though the online entry is available for many. You need to enter them 10-14 days in advance -- each event will have a closing date, so check first -- and you need to be a member of a CTT-affiliated club. And have a checkbook if there's no internet entry.

See the calendar here, Google for course codes around where you live. E, F, G, and H are the London-based ones.
http://www.cyclingtimetrials.org.uk/Eve ... fault.aspx

ugo.santalucia

maryka wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

what do I need to enter a 10 TT? Do I need a British Cycling membership? Or just buy the insurance on the day?

If it's a British Cycling TT (there aren't many) then yes, standard BC membership rules apply.

Most TTs are Cycling Time Trials which means entering is a bit more complicated though the online entry is available for many. You need to enter them 10-14 days in advance -- each event will have a closing date, so check first -- and you need to be a member of a CTT-affiliated club. And have a checkbook if there's no internet entry.

See the calendar here, Google for course codes around where you live. E, F, G, and H are the London-based ones.
http://www.cyclingtimetrials.org.uk/Eve ... fault.aspx

SO, no way of entering if you are not in a CTT affiliated club?

maryka

ugo.santalucia wrote:

maryka wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

what do I need to enter a 10 TT? Do I need a British Cycling membership? Or just buy the insurance on the day?

If it's a British Cycling TT (there aren't many) then yes, standard BC membership rules apply.

Most TTs are Cycling Time Trials which means entering is a bit more complicated though the online entry is available for many. You need to enter them 10-14 days in advance -- each event will have a closing date, so check first -- and you need to be a member of a CTT-affiliated club. And have a checkbook if there's no internet entry.

See the calendar here, Google for course codes around where you live. E, F, G, and H are the London-based ones.
http://www.cyclingtimetrials.org.uk/Eve ... fault.aspx

SO, no way of entering if you are not in a CTT affiliated club?

You could do a club event as a guest of the club, but you can't do an open event without being a member of an affiliated club, no.

See http://www.cyclingtimetrials.org.uk/Inf ... fault.aspx under Events.

xscreamsuk

ugo.santalucia wrote:

maryka wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

what do I need to enter a 10 TT? Do I need a British Cycling membership? Or just buy the insurance on the day?

If it's a British Cycling TT (there aren't many) then yes, standard BC membership rules apply.

Most TTs are Cycling Time Trials which means entering is a bit more complicated though the online entry is available for many. You need to enter them 10-14 days in advance -- each event will have a closing date, so check first -- and you need to be a member of a CTT-affiliated club. And have a checkbook if there's no internet entry.

See the calendar here, Google for course codes around you live. E, F, G, and H are the London-based ones.
http://www.cyclingtimetrials.org.uk/Eve ... fault.aspx

SO, no way of entering if you are not in a CTT affiliated club?

yes, there are loads of club events every week up and down the country. All are entry on the line, usually about £3.00 and you don't need to be a club member.

Just have a google for club events in your local area. Many club websites have links to all the club events in their area as well.

ugo.santalucia

Thanks, that's more like it

ugo.santalucia

xscreamsuk wrote:

All are entry on the line, usually about £3.00 and you don't need to be a club member.

Ahhh, I thought I was right in saying that 3 quid is the normal entry for TTs... I remember it was 3 quid when I was in Amersham RCC and we were organising a few 10 milers. I had a recent discussion about the high price of Richmond Park TT, in return for no refreshments or anything (high prizes, apparently)... somebody said 11.80 quid was average... :shock:

maryka

ugo.santalucia wrote:

xscreamsuk wrote:

All are entry on the line, usually about £3.00 and you don't need to be a club member.

Ahhh, I thought I was right in saying that 3 quid is the normal entry for TTs... I remember it was 3 quid when I was in Amersham RCC and we were organising a few 10 milers. I had a recent discussion about the high price of Richmond Park TT, in return for no refreshments or anything (high prizes, apparently)... somebody said 11.80 quid was average... :shock:

Don't think you can really compare club 10s to the RP TTs, they are a special event in a special place with special permission to hold them. They sell out quite easily so you can save your 10 quid without any worry that it's too expensive to ride.

The average club 10 is only 3 quid but if you just show up at one with no prior warning, you may not get to ride it -- depends on the club and course. My club's club 10 requires pre-entry (via our forum) and there's no EOL though you do pay on the night. Other clubs may be more lenient, it's up to the timekeeper I guess.

ugo.santalucia

maryka wrote:

Don't think you can really compare club 10s to the RP TTs, they are a special event in a special place with special permission to hold them. They sell out quite easily so you can save your 10 quid without any worry that it's too expensive to ride.

Agree, my point was that someone said it was an average fee for a time trial and at the time it did sound strange to me as I did remember differently. Then whether it is worth 11.80 or not is a completely different matter and one I don't want to go into... better to put a lid, before opening an un-necessary can of worms....

Monty Dog

In terms of nearest club TT's to the Southwest of London, you're going to have head out this neck of the woods - Tuesdays and Thursdays on the A31 at Bentley or Wednesdays the A3CRG events on the A3 near Liss. Farnborough and Camberley also run some on the A30 near Hartley Wintney. Haven't done one for a while, so someone might correct me with more up to date info.

ugo.santalucia

Monty Dog wrote:

In terms of nearest club TT's to the Southwest of London, you're going to have head out this neck of the woods - Tuesdays and Thursdays on the A31 at Bentley or Wednesdays the A3CRG events on the A3 near Liss. Farnborough and Camberley also run some on the A30 near Hartley Wintney. Haven't done one for a while, so someone might correct me with more up to date info.

Thanks Monty, not sure I can do mid week ones, but let's see... if you are entering one with the GIos, let me know, I'll be on my Sannino, Red Vs Blue like in table football?

maryka

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Monty Dog wrote:

In terms of nearest club TT's to the Southwest of London, you're going to have head out this neck of the woods - Tuesdays and Thursdays on the A31 at Bentley or Wednesdays the A3CRG events on the A3 near Liss. Farnborough and Camberley also run some on the A30 near Hartley Wintney. Haven't done one for a while, so someone might correct me with more up to date info.

Thanks Monty, not sure I can do mid week ones, but let's see... if you are entering one with the GIos, let me know, I'll be on my Sannino, Red Vs Blue like in table football?

Ah I've just twigged who you are... the Kingston Wheelers/Kingston Phoenix have one more club 10 this season, it's a Saturday afternoon (Aug 17) but not on a very fast course so not sure if that's what you want? It'll be posted on the forum shortly, probably won't be full.

pilot_pete

If you keep turning up on the line at club TTs to ride you will always be welcomed. However, after a few you will probably get asked about 3rd party insurance. Like I said, newbies are welcomed and this is overlooked for a few, but really is a requirement if you want to keep riding them. BC or CTC membership covers you, amongst others I am sure...

PP

SteppenHerring

Pilot Pete wrote:

If you keep turning up on the line at club TTs to ride you will always be welcomed. However, after a few you will probably get asked about 3rd party insurance. Like I said, newbies are welcomed and this is overlooked for a few, but really is a requirement if you want to keep riding them. BC or CTC membership covers you, amongst others I am sure...

PP

Join a CTT affiliated club. The membership fees will be paid back instantly by discounts at bike shops.

And enter the Addiscombe Open 10 on August 31st.

ugo.santalucia

SteppenHerring wrote:

Join a CTT affiliated club. The membership fees will be paid back instantly by discounts at bike shops.

And enter the Addiscombe Open 10 on August 31st.

I have been in a club for 5 years, then moved and my resolutino is to stay out of clubs! I don't enjoy riding in a pack anymore and I don't particularly like the club dynamics... as you say I could pay a mamebership for the sake of entering TTs, but I'd rather avoid if possible.
As for discounts, I don't remember the last time I walked in a bike shop with the idea of buying something... must have been a long long time ago

ilovemytinbred

If you do testing regularly then part of joining a club is helping out at events etc. We need people to contribute as the events only exist because of volunteer helpers. It is not a lot of work once or twice a year, but it is essential. The same is true of cx etc.
Otherwise all we will be left with is sportives....

SteppenHerring

ilovemytinbred wrote:

If you do testing regularly then part of joining a club is helping out at events etc. We need people to contribute as the events only exist because of volunteer helpers. It is not a lot of work once or twice a year, but it is essential. The same is true of cx etc.
Otherwise all we will be left with is sportives....

Tell me about it.

[insert usual rant about the same few people doing all the work]

ugo.santalucia

Right,
First 10 TT 22nd of September, Great Missenden... £ 2.50 including tea and cake... seems rather good value... need to have a crack at a sub 27 min... :shock:

simon_e

SteppenHerring wrote:

ilovemytinbred wrote:

If you do testing regularly then part of joining a club is helping out at events etc. We need people to contribute as the events only exist because of volunteer helpers. It is not a lot of work once or twice a year, but it is essential. The same is true of cx etc.
Otherwise all we will be left with is sportives....

Tell me about it.

[insert usual rant about the same few people doing all the work]

Same here.

Clubs have to pay to affiliate to BC or CTT to run races or time trials and you can't enter time trials on a 'come and try it' basis for long so please don't take the p*ss. CTT takes £2 per rider levy so for 50p the club puts on an event and even supplies you with tea & cake!

I am as group-averse as anyone (I prefer doing my own thing) but joined after doing a time trial and loving it. They just won't happen without the volunteers. Club membership encompasses so much more than just the Sunday club run. And you don't want to know how much work is involved in Go-Ride accreditation.

ugo.santalucia

Simon E wrote:

SteppenHerring wrote:

ilovemytinbred wrote:

If you do testing regularly then part of joining a club is helping out at events etc. We need people to contribute as the events only exist because of volunteer helpers. It is not a lot of work once or twice a year, but it is essential. The same is true of cx etc.
Otherwise all we will be left with is sportives....

Tell me about it.

[insert usual rant about the same few people doing all the work]

Same here.

Clubs have to pay to affiliate to BC or CTT to run races or time trials and you can't enter time trials on a 'come and try it' basis for long so please don't take the p*ss. CTT takes £2 per rider levy so for 50p the club puts on an event and even supplies you with tea & cake!

I am as group-averse as anyone (I prefer doing my own thing) but joined after doing a time trial and loving it. They just won't happen without the volunteers. Club membership encompasses so much more than just the Sunday club run. And you don't want to know how much work is involved in Go-Ride accreditation.

Simon, I was in a club for 6 years and got a bit involved in organising stuff... we did go through the GO Ride accreditation, which I am not quite sure why the clubs feel like they have to be part of... frankly I find it rather pointless, other than a "charitable" exercise. I just don't want to be involved with the love/hate dynamics of being in a club and the inevitable frictions a person with many opinions like myself is likely to cause... basically I can't be bothered to deal with those who dislike me... I suppose I could pay a fee and never be seen around, but if I can avoid and pay saying 1-2 pounds extra to enter a TT, I prefer that way. I don't think I will be chasing 10 miles TT around the country on a weekly basis. I might end up doing 5-6 in one year, just to see if I can improve... I am not after the perfect conditions to post a stunning time. I will never win a TT or get anywhere close to the boys on disc wheels

ugo.santalucia

26:40 this morning... not bad for my 1980 steed... more importantly a minute faster than my mates...