2014 29er Fuel Ex 8 vs 9?

johnmcl7

I've narrowed down my choice in bikes to the new Fuel Ex 29's, I've mainly settled on the 8 due to the large price increase up to the 9 (£2500 vs £3400) which I don't think is worth it for my use but thought it was worth checking first to see if there is something on the 9 that would make it the better buy long term. I know the 9 has the full Deore XT groupset whereas the 8 is mainly SLX bits but my current bike is a fairly basic hardtail with mostly Deore bits (2012/2013 Trek 4900 Disc) and it's done pretty well so far as it's all worked reliably without issue despite me giving the bike a pretty hard time.

I can see there are other improvements on the 9 in the wheels and the front fork but I can't see them being worth the £900 upgrade but would be interested to hear people's thoughts. My riding is very general, I generally find the 4900 is good but I'm struggling on rough downhill sections particularly, after trying out a few bikes I was surprised at how much more confidence inspiring I found the full suspension bikes hence that's why I want to invest in one.

Thanks,
John

cooldad

Links might help.

johnmcl7

I'm looking more for advice from people that are familiar with the bikes in question however these are the bikes:

http://www.trekbikes.com/uk/en/bikes/mo ... _ex_8_29/#

http://www.trekbikes.com/uk/en/bikes/mo ... _ex_9_29/#

John

thelonegroover

Upgrades from Fuel EX 8 29
Fox Factory DRCV Shock and Fox Factory fork w/Kashima coat
Bontrager Rhythm Elite TLR wheels
Shimano XT crank & brakes
Shimano XT Shadow Plus drivetrain
RockShox Reverb Stealth dropper post
I'm also not sure the upgrades are worth it, personally I don't think you'll notice. Spend the £900 on something else.

Kowalski675

I've ridden the EX9 29er (back to back with the EX9 26er) and it did feel very good to me (even with my lack of experience, compared to the Rumblefish Pro I had for a few days you could feel straight away how much development's gone into making 29ers ride more like 26ers in the last year), but I doubt that I'd notice much (if any) difference between that and the EX8 (apart from the useful dropper post, which you could buy separately), given my lack of ability and experience. If it was me I'd buy the EX8 (unless you're loaded and money's no object). That metallic grey on the EX8 is really nice too. I'd be tempted towards the new Remedy EX8 though (which sits between the two Fuels, price-wise).

poah

get the ex 8 and fit a coil shock


have you tested both to see if the ride any different?

the kashima coat is nothing fancy and not worth the extra cash, the XT stuff is slightly lighter. for me a dropper post is not an extra worth paying for.

Kowalski675

POAH wrote:

the kashima coat is nothing fancy and not worth the extra cash

It's not just the Kashima coating that differs - the 9 has the Factory damper, higher spec than the Evolution on the 8.

One thing to note is that (for now at least) the production EX9s have the older version of the Rhythm Elite wheelset (about 200g heavier), rather than the new lighter version with rapid drive hub that they said they'd be coming with, so the difference in wheel weight might be less than you'd think.

johnmcl7

Kowalski675 wrote:

I've ridden the EX9 29er (back to back with the EX9 26er) and it did feel very good to me (even with my lack of experience, compared to the Rumblefish Pro I had for a few days you could feel straight away how much development's gone into making 29ers ride more like 26ers in the last year), but I doubt that I'd notice much (if any) difference between that and the EX8 (apart from the useful dropper post, which you could buy separately), given my lack of ability and experience. If it was me I'd buy the EX8 (unless you're loaded and money's no object). That metallic grey on the EX8 is really nice too. I'd be tempted towards the new Remedy EX8 though (which sits between the two Fuels, price-wise).

I was initially looking at the Rumblefish as some sites are selling the high specced Elite which uses the Deore XT groupset for a similar price to the Fuel Ex 8 29 however I was leaning towards the Fuel Ex as it seems to get more favourable reviews over the Rumblefish. My local bike shop can't order it in so that's it out of the equation.

The Remedy 8 is a bit pricier as I think its spec (aside from the longer travel) is similar to the Fuel Ex 8, I haven't tried any of the Treks out but on trying similar ones I thought 120mm seemed about the sweet spot to me as I'm concerned about losing too much of the speed of the hardtail.

John

Kowalski675

Johnmcl7 wrote:

Kowalski675 wrote:

I've ridden the EX9 29er (back to back with the EX9 26er) and it did feel very good to me (even with my lack of experience, compared to the Rumblefish Pro I had for a few days you could feel straight away how much development's gone into making 29ers ride more like 26ers in the last year), but I doubt that I'd notice much (if any) difference between that and the EX8 (apart from the useful dropper post, which you could buy separately), given my lack of ability and experience. If it was me I'd buy the EX8 (unless you're loaded and money's no object). That metallic grey on the EX8 is really nice too. I'd be tempted towards the new Remedy EX8 though (which sits between the two Fuels, price-wise).

I was initially looking at the Rumblefish as some sites are selling the high specced Elite which uses the Deore XT groupset for a similar price to the Fuel Ex 8 29 however I was leaning towards the Fuel Ex as it seems to get more favourable reviews over the Rumblefish. My local bike shop can't order it in so that's it out of the equation.

The Remedy 8 is a bit pricier as I think its spec (aside from the longer travel) is similar to the Fuel Ex 8, I haven't tried any of the Treks out but on trying similar ones I thought 120mm seemed about the sweet spot to me as I'm concerned about losing too much of the speed of the hardtail.

John

The Elite is the lower spec Rumblefish. It's the Pro (at £3250) that has the XT brakes and drivetrain. Both models are currently available discounted from Evans. I had a Pro for a few days, played on it at Gisburn and Stainburn:



As much as I liked the Rubberfish (as it affectionately became referred to) - and I didn't want to give it back - I'd take the new Fuel 29er in preference. Even in my untrained hands, you could really feel the difference that a year's development has made in terms of making them ride more like a 26er. Compared to the 'Fish the Fuel felt shorter, livelier, more responsive and easier to throw around. The 'Fish was great, with beautifully plush and well controlled feeling (to me) suspension, and steamrollered over everything you pointed it at with those monster truck wheels, but when it came to twistier singletrack and tight turns (climbing or descending) you could feel the length of it. Great bike (and far, far better than me), but the Fuel EX9 just felt better. Riding the EX9s back to back in 26 and 29 flavour I would've been hard pushed to make a buying decision.

The Remedy EX8 29er is £2799, so sits between the Fuels you're considering and (as you say) is comparable to the Fuel EX8 spec-wise. Like you say, a 120mm 29er does seem a good goldilocks figure when it comes to trail use, I'd happily have either hanging in my garage, and both are way better than anything I could do with them, but the Remedy is the one the first test ride reports (if you hold any sway by such things) are getting more excited about (one test saying that it's actually more nimble than the outgoing Remedy 26er), while they're saying that the Fuel is very good, but not exceptional (which I guess is much like the 26" Fuel, which is a very capable and sorted bike that suits those of us who don't have the ability to shred the trails like a pro, nor the nerve to throw it down really gnarly descents, but will still do those things if you put a good rider on it).

That's my take on things anyway, for what little it's worth. As I've said, I'm just a newbie without the ability or experience to split hairs between bikes that are better than me, but I thought I'd just chip in my experiences, having ridden the Fuel.

And that sparkly metallic grey and red colourscheme on the EX8 is very nice... But then again, so's the black with the gorgeous metallic blue logos on the Remedy... Buy one of each, lol...

johnmcl7

Thanks for the detailed post and you're right, I meant the pro - I find it very confusing that Trek have the Elite as the lower option as to me Elite implies the absolute best. There's no Evans near me but I think it's good the RF isn't really an option as everything I hear about the Fuel sounds like it's the better one for me. What bike(s) do you have or planning to buy?

As for the Fuel vs Remedy, after doing some test riding (although not the Treks unfortunately, they weren't at the event) I was initially keen on a lightweight hardtail 29er but having ridden a few I preferred having the full suspension but not too much. I find the hardtail is quick compared to some of the other bigger full suspension bikes, I did find even the 120mm felt a bit sluggish for pedalling but worth it for the better downhill and rough performance.

John

Kowalski675

Johnmcl7 wrote:

Thanks for the detailed post and you're right, I meant the pro - I find it very confusing that Trek have the Elite as the lower option as to me Elite implies the absolute best. There's no Evans near me but I think it's good the RF isn't really an option as everything I hear about the Fuel sounds like it's the better one for me. What bike(s) do you have or planning to buy?

Aye, I thought their nomenclature was a bit daft too - Elite implies it's the top level. I've got a couple of Evans not too far away, but I went to the one further away (Castleford) 'cos it's so much easier to get to (Leeds' one way sysyem is a ballache), has plenty of free parking, and a lot more space to play on the bikes. I tried the EX8 26er, Norco Sight 2SE and Zesty 314 there. The EX9s I tried at Chevin Cycles in Otley (v helpful, friendly chaps), and the Rubberfish was a demo bike from All Terrain Cycles (also v helpful, friendly chaps). I have a 2007 Carrera Kraken, and I've just bought a Boardman Team FS a few weeks ago (bit of a different direction price-wise to the bikes I'd been testing, but at £850 it just seemed to good a deal to pass up, even if I want to upgrade in a year or so (once the dust from the whole wheel size debate has settled).

As for the Fuel vs Remedy, after doing some test riding (although not the Treks unfortunately, they weren't at the event) I was initially keen on a lightweight hardtail 29er but having ridden a few I preferred having the full suspension but not too much. I find the hardtail is quick compared to some of the other bigger full suspension bikes, I did find even the 120mm felt a bit sluggish for pedalling but worth it for the better downhill and rough performance.

John

The 140mm travel Remedy is definitely erring towards more aggressive riders (and riding), and there's no point having the extra travel if you're not going to use it. Depends what you want to do with the bike, horses for courses and all that. For general trail riding 120mm does seem to be a nice goldilocks figure on a 29er (I'm sure some of the usual suspects will be along to shoot me down with their omniscience in due course, but that's my opinion, based on my own experiences). The 29ers do have noticably more inertia to get rolling, but once they're in motion they don't half roll along well (I was 5mph faster for the same effort on the same stretch of fire road descent, compared to my Carrera), and they really do roll over roots and rocks like a monster truck.

johnmcl7

I was all set to order the Fuel Ex 8 this week but after a ride last night was re-thinking the Remedy, one of the groups I go cycling with favour longer travel bikes even though the routes are similar to the other group I go with who have more of a mix of bikes. I was with the longer travel group last night and thinking that you don't lose much on the Remedy, it looks very slightly heavier and is a little more expensive so perhaps it is the better buy in the long run as I have no plans for racing or competition.

Then again I've gone from hard tail to 100mm full suspension to 120mm full suspension so have to stop somewhere, the Fuel Ex is going to be much more capable than the current hardtail.

John

jairaj

What kinda of terrain are you going to be riding?

I tried the Fuel EX and Remedy last year and was impressed with both especially the Fuel EX as it felt very confident even on steep and technical trails and you wouldn't normally associate a 120mm bike with that.

The Remedy was nice but just a bit too slack and heavy for me. I ride mostly in woodsy areas and whilst the trails can be technical they are usually smoothish as the ground is made from soil and I felt the Fuel EX gave the better balance. If lived out in the Peak district where my local trails are littered with big rocks and steep terrain I would maybe think about the Remedy.

But for trail centre type stuff red or black grade and natural trails without loads of big rocks I think the Fuel EX makes more sense.

Kowalski675

jairaj wrote:

What kinda of terrain are you going to be riding?

I tried the Fuel EX and Remedy last year

He's talking about the new 29ers though (26" Fuel is 130mm now, btw)

jairaj

The concept and intent of both the bikes are still the same whatever wheel size you choose. So I think my reasoning is still valid.

Kowalski675

jairaj wrote:

The concept and intent of both the bikes are still the same whatever wheel size you choose. So I think my reasoning is still valid.

Can't agree with that. The bikes you rode are completely different models to the bike's he's considering. Different wheel size, different geometry etc. They may sit in the same niches in the model line up, but riding the 26ers isn't relevant to choosing between the two 29ers.

jairaj

Kowalski675 wrote:

They may sit in the same niches in the model line up, but riding the 26ers isn't relevant to choosing between the two 29ers.

I'm not saying the Fuel EX 29er is a great bike just because I like Fuel EX 26er. I'm saying the design intent of both bikes is the same so they'll be similar. They won't be exactly the same otherwise what's the point in two bikes?

The Fuel EX 26er is a great trail bike and is more than just a XC race bike with longer suspension. Similarly the Fuel EX 29er will be designed to be a trail bike and not just a 29er XC race bike with longer suspension.

Apply that to the Remedy range too. I thought the Remedy 26er was too much bike for me (for lack of a better description) preferring the more balanced climb / descend ratio of the Fuel EX. Ergo the Remedy 29er which shares the same design intent as the 26er will also be too much bike for me.

Depending on what the OP replies back with the type of terrain they usually ride they may prefer the better all rounder that is the Fuel EX range or they may prefer the slightly more biased towards descending of the Remedy range.

johnmcl7

I agree the 2013 and 2014 Fuel/Remedy bikes are quite different even though they keep the same name, they have changed position as the Fuel now takes over from the Rumblefish.

Anyway, I popped down to the bike shop and ordered a Fuel Ex 8 this afternoon as I knew otherwise I'd be endlessly debating this and getting nowhere. The 8 vs 9 was fairly straight forward in the end as I was thinking the Fuel Ex 8 will be plenty for what I want and if do put upgrades on it, they're unlikely to be far less than £900 and I've the freedom to choose what I want. Although I had a last minute rethink about the Remedy after riding out last night on some rough stuff with other people on long travel bikes, the Fuel Ex 8 is still going to be a big step on over the current hardtail and when I did do some test riding it was the 120mm bikes I liked.

Thanks for the advice, just have to wait for it to arrive now

John

Kowalski675

Johnmcl7 wrote:

I agree the 2013 and 2014 Fuel/Remedy bikes are quite different even though they keep the same name, they have changed position as the Fuel now takes over from the Rumblefish.

It rides better than the 'Fish though. I don't think you'll be disappointed.