Got shouted at by a cyclist, what would you do?

First.Aspect

Okay, so I live on a single track road where the only passing places are gates across fields.

In my car, with a 25ft single scull on the roof, I followed a guy on a bike today for about 3 or 4 minutes, and he passed about half a dozen spots to pull out and let me past. Eventually I gave him a small toot of the horn because it wasn't clear whether he knew I was there, and he unleashed a torrent of wild gesticulating and "***k offs" at me and pulled over.

Clearly he thought there was enough room to pass safely, so I drove past him (driving along the verge to do so) and tried to point out that I was driving along the verge, it wasn't safe to pass and that when I cycled on single track roads I let people past periodically when convenient. He said, "What do you want me to do, pull over?"

I could see that he had a power tap and so was "training". This is clearly hyper important and stopping would have distorted his data.

Should I have (a) sat there for another 10 minutes (b) just driven past, like Colin McRae (c) D-locked him (d) some other option I hadn't thought about (e) just done what I did.

tailwindhome

What speed was he doing?

How long is the road?

First.Aspect

TailWindHome wrote:

What speed was he doing?

How long is the road?

I don't know, 8-12mph up longish hill, 15 max on the flat because he was puffed. The nearest two lane road is about 5 or 6 miles away in the direction we were travelling. I ride primary on that road, and make it obvious when I'm about to pull over. People usually say thanks.

The car following me chose option (c).

rick_chasey

I'd look at him like he was a bit mental, say I probably cycle more than he does and tell him to chill out.

But that's probably not very responsible. It's probably what I'd actually do.

First.Aspect

Rick Chasey wrote:

I'd look at him like he was a bit mental, say I probably cycle more than he does and tell him to chill out.

But that's probably not very responsible. It's probably what I'd actually do.

I did tell him he needed to calm down a bit. He told me to ***c off again.

sloppyschleckonds

Was he riding a Cervelo?

roger_merriman

i'd probably do much the same, Some folks are just burks.

I drive a largish van for work, it's a underpowered heavy beast and with a full load of guys in their wheelchairs it's not really nippy! do now and then get cyclist trying to wave one past even when there is oncoming traffic....

itboffin

SloppySchleckonds wrote:

Was he riding a Cervelo?

Clearly not because if he was he'd have his butler say it, duh

Cleat Eastwood

First Aspect wrote:

This is clearly hyper important and stopping would have distorted his data.

Just as you waiting a bit longer would have harmed your journey I suppose - you're a tit.

First.Aspect

No, Cleat, say what you really think.

How long would you have waited? I'd have been following him for 3 miles. I think we was pissed off because I wasn't overtaking him. Hence the wild "well pass me then" gesticulations. So my dilemma was passing dangerously and offroading in a 3 series, or following an aggitated cyclist for 3 miles.

ManiaMuse

I wouldn't toot your horn in that situation. It's almost certain that it won't be interpreted in the same way as you intended.

How much further to go was there on the track? You said you'd been following him for 3/4 minutes but now you say 3 miles?

First.Aspect

ManiaMuse wrote:

I wouldn't toot your horn in that situation. It's almost certain that it won't be interpreted in the same way as you intended.

How much further to go was there on the track? You said you'd been following him for 3/4 minutes but now you say 3 miles?

Fair point about the horn. As I say, he'd given no indication he knew I was there, so I thought he might be listening to music or something. His initial response suggests he was irritated that I was just hanging back there and he wanted me to pass. Which is what he said, between expletives. So, my hunch is that the beep of the horn merely brought irritation forward.

I followed him for about 3 minutes - about half a mile up a steep climb, then a bit of rolling terrain. My destination was probably a further 2 and a bit miles (not three - just googled it). At the rate he was going, I would say I'd have ended up following him for about 12-15 minutes in total, unless he pulled out. Normal journey time is about 6 or 7 minutes.

I guess not the end of the world, but longer by far than I've been followed or ended up following under similar cirumstances.

rick_chasey

Cyclist is a tw@t.

Don't give it a second thought.

/endthread.

First.Aspect

Rick Chasey wrote:

Cyclist is a tw@t.

Don't give it a second thought.

/endthread.

Thanks! Thread ended.

sketchley

Hmmm. Honestly I would have sat patiently behind the cyclist... As at the end of the day life's too shirt to get wound up over 15 mins......

Ouija

Man, i hate it when cars refuse to overtake and trundle behind you for any length of time. More so when you feel that there is more than enough room to overtake and especially if other cars HAVE overtaken you on the same stretch of road but you suddenly find yourself with a 'timid' driver. I find it less irritating to have them confidently whizz past you, narrowly missing you with their inside wing mirror, than slouch along behind you. Especially on straights where you can see there is no oncoming traffic.

Why?

Mainly because as soon as i hear a car coming up behind me on a narrow country lane i immediately move over until i'm about an inch from the curb/grass/gravel, riding through every damn pot hole in gods creation, consoling myself that it'll be over in a moment, just as soon as they pass... which will be in just another moment.................................. right about now..................................... ok,........ maybe now........................................................................................................................................................... any second,.............................................................................................their obviously working up their courage, it'll be just about now....................................................................................................................... Oh, for petes sake..... Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! *F*ck#!er's.

I wouldn't let it go on for three minutes. After 60 seconds i'd have slammed all on, got off the bike, jumped onto any verge and cursed the driver for being a big giant pansy.

The ones who are so scared of cyclists they actually drive right over onto the other side of the white line on wider roads, straight into oncoming traffic to get round you also wind me up. I don't take up that much space...

HebdenBiker

Ouija wrote:

Man, i hate it when cars refuse to overtake and trundle behind you for any length of time. More so when you feel that there is more than enough room to overtake and especially if other cars HAVE overtaken you on the same stretch of road but you suddenly find yourself with a 'timid' driver. I find it less irritating to have them confidently whizz past you, narrowly missing you with their inside wing mirror, than slouch along behind you. Especially on straights where you can see there is no oncoming traffic.

Why?

Mainly because as soon as i hear a car coming up behind me on a narrow country lane i immediately move over until i'm about an inch from the curb/grass/gravel, riding through every damn pot hole in gods creation, consoling myself that it'll be over in a moment, just as soon as they pass... which will be in just another moment.................................. right about now..................................... ok,........ maybe now........................................................................................................................................................... any second,.............................................................................................their obviously working up their courage, it'll be just about now....................................................................................................................... Oh, for petes sake..... Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! *F*ck#!er's.

I wouldn't let it go on for three minutes. After 60 seconds i'd have slammed all on, got off the bike, jumped onto any verge and cursed the driver for being a big giant pansy.

The ones who are so scared of cyclists they actually drive right over onto the other side of the white line on wider roads, straight into oncoming traffic to get round you also wind me up. I don't take up that much space...

Well in that case, drivers can't really win, can they. If they are patient, cautious and give us plenty of room, we want to curse them for being a "pansy". If they pass us too close or toot their horn, they're a knuckle-dragging bully.

OP - I would not have tooted the cyclist. Whatever you thought you were trying to communicate, sounding the horn is always taken as a sign of aggression.

Either you did actually have room to pass and you were just being a pansy (see above! ), or you should have sat behind him patiently, like you would have done had he been a horse, a milk float, a tractor, a roadsweeper, or any other slow vehicle.

Personally, when cycling, I pull in and wave traffic through if it's been a minute or so, but if I choose not to do that, I should not have to expect drivers sounding their horns at me.

veronese68

25 ft scull on the roof? You should have accelerated up behind him then braked hard causing the front of the car to dip. The front of the scull would have dipped more giving him a polite tap on the shoulder.that would have been fine I'm sure.

gavbarron

First Aspect wrote:

So my dilemma was passing dangerously and offroading in a 3 series, or following an aggitated cyclist for 3 miles.

Is a 3 series not capable of a little rough terrain then? He wasn't agitated till you turned up beeping your horn (and probably sitting two inches off his rear wheel in true BMW fashion).










Sorry I know I'm not helping but my son woke me up hours ago and I currently hate the world :twisted:

First.Aspect

Here's the road.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=eh23+4 ... 5,,0,12.01

I don't know - from thr driver's seat, it felt too close. It feels too close when I'm being passed, so I take primary and pull out when I can.

The verge is okay in some places, badly undermined in others. I had a boat on the roof so off roading wasn't really on the cards.

15 minutes, really?

ugo.santalucia

Pretty sure the cyclist has opened another topic in the road section, moaning about you... I don't think all these car vs bike topics are going anywhere to be honest... :?

roger_merriman

Ouija wrote:

Man, i hate it when cars refuse to overtake and trundle behind you for any length of time. More so when you feel that there is more than enough room to overtake and especially if other cars HAVE overtaken you on the same stretch of road but you suddenly find yourself with a 'timid' driver. I find it less irritating to have them confidently whizz past you, narrowly missing you with their inside wing mirror, than slouch along behind you. Especially on straights where you can see there is no oncoming traffic.

I've been waved on by cyclists when there is oncoming traffic and i'm driving the work van which is big, cumbersome and slow. I tend to drive back making it clear i'm not hasseling and I'll over take when I can which is never normally more than a min or so any how.

First.Aspect

Can't find the thread in the road section. Can someone point me towards it? Perhaps I can have a civil conversation without being told to ***k off.

markhewitt1978

The problem was sounding your horn. The cyclist was well aware you were there, and so in this case he's interpreted your horn as "GET THE **** OUT OF MY WAY", which he wasn't likely to take well!

When on single track roads I will pull over when it's convenient for me to do so, some gates etc might be full of gravel so I won't stop, that said there's not many roads where you can't pull over within about a minute or so. He might have been going for a segment time so would be reluctant to slow.

rjsterry

Much as the rational part of my brain knows that a car horn is actually used for its intended purpose - "I'm behind you!" - its use as a sort of electronic four letter word top signal the drivers annoyance and impatience is so widespread (at least in London) as to make this the default assumption. I also find people who won't come past difficult, but then I get it the other way as well. I'll slow to let someone out of a turning, and start muttering to myself when they don't take me up on my kind offer... only to realise that there's someone behind me who definitely isn't letting them out. In answer to the OP, I'd probably mutter a lot, and then realise I was being a bit unreasonable afterwards. I just need to be more patient, and leave the house in plenty of time.

On a related note, you can see the logical conclusion of the them and us approach in the latest Critical Mass, where two cars decided to ram their way through, knocking several people off, and one driving over one of the cyclists "...like a speed bump...". I can see this escalating if someone starts swinging a D-lock.

http://road.cc/content/news/89451-hit-and-runs-reported-london-critical-mass-ride-video

Worrying stuff

First.Aspect

Yes the horn probably riled him. In my defence he didn't shoulder check and gave no indication he'd seen me. I wasn't following very closely.

There aren't any pull ins really, other than gate entrances. It's an old estate road which has been taken over by the council. If you meet another car you have to reverse (unless it's an astra, in which case stop close eyes and hope).

Edit: are people really telling me to follow the guy for 10 minutes? There are loads of places for someone to peel out and let cars past but none long enough to overtake unless he cooperated. Follow the road on streetview if you want. Trust me, he didn't want me there for 2 minutes let alone 10.

davis

Cyclist was a bit of a chopper for not pulling over fairly early, IMO.

I ride on lanes like this for as much of the commute as possible. Cars almost always appreciate it when I pull into a turning/drive/gate entrance, and if I indicate prior to doing it they can very often time their overtake well enough so that I don't have to stop. Even easier if it's uphill because I don't climb at 25 mph.
No need to cycle like a douche, and everyone goes about their day.

I don't even think the horn was necessarily out of order -- it's there to make people aware of your presence, and if he didn't give any indication that he knew you were there... (Not that I want to argue one way or t'other about the etiquette of how to [mis]use your horn in public [fnarr]).

Ouija

davis wrote:

I don't even think the horn was necessarily out of order -- it's there to make people aware of your presence, and if he didn't give any indication that he knew you were there... (Not that I want to argue one way or t'other about the etiquette of how to [mis]use your horn in public [fnarr]).

Car horns are like forum posts without emote icons. You can't be sure of the intent.

Maybe car manufacturers should consider building cars with two selectable horn sounds. One an aggressive honk, the other a friendly chime or bong to allow the driver to give an indication as to their intent.

bushu

wading through all this i must say i do fear most the driver that sweeps right across to the oncoming lane, if they aren't confident to overtake should they really be driving a car, probably in a faux 4x4 and late for something! Do you really think these drivers could react well if anything happened?

I usually commute in the gutter as the bloody island pinch points keep traffic & mainly lorries behind on hills, wouldn't want to hold up the traffic that i once sat in. I find less prats inch close to the curb at the junctions riding like this

From experience though, it's the confident drivers which are the worst almost clipping the bars with mirrors. Ex's, friends & colleagues i've no idea how they have a license but, shouldn't! :shock: I dont fear these as I'll probably be dead

there are many many POV :? this was leading on to cycle infrastructure, but i don't want to be stuck in pootle lanes either as imho driving culture would resent a road bike on the road even more..

Gallywomack

It is possible to toot non-aggressively. Just do a short, cheery little toot - just requires the slightest of touches on the horn. I use it when people don't notice the lights have changed - nothing worse than some boorish nobber in the queue letting out a long, impatient blast when somebody hasn't moved off within about a second.

Of course, this bloke seems like a bit of a nobber himself for not pulling in, no doubt your very presence there was a source of irritation to him and I'd hazard a guess that he'd have reacted angrily to whatever you did.

First.Aspect

Okay, so to use of horn etiquette... I did the v. short double toot. His response was about the same as one time when I heard screeching tyres and turned round to see a 4x4 with a trailer trying to overtake me into oncoming traffic over a blind crest and bailing out seconds before killing someone.

I've lived in Devon, where the motorists and cyclists both know they can't get past. In the west Highlands, even slow motorists pull over to let others past. I was pretty patient, I wasn't following closely. Why was this guy exempt from simple manners?

Honestly, the more I think about it the more I'm satisfied that the guy I was following was an utter to$$er. He probably gets the bus or train to work and cycles HARD at weekends, to the Rocky soundtrack.