Black Rims, white spokes

curium
curium Posts: 815
edited July 2013 in Road buying advice
I'm looking into getting a pair of hand built wheels. I don't know enough about wheels to specify in minute detail but I know what I'm looking for aesthetically. Black rims, black hubs and white spokes.

The only white spokes I can can find from a quick google are DT competition.

I have no idea on hubs except I would like them to be black and reasonably long lasting.

I currently have a set of Easton EA30s which came with my cube peloton race. I love the look of them but am coming to the view that they are not robust enough. I've have had to have them trued for no obvious reasons and last Thursday another cyclist crashed into me, scoring the rim across the front wheel brake track and putting a slight bend into one of the front wheel spokes. There are 24 pokes on the front, radial and 24 on the back, cross 2 and radial.

I weigh 85kg and commute 25 miles a day from SE3 to N19 London. I like riding up hills despite being nothing special according to Strava. I ride sportives and go to France every year to ride Mont Ventoux and some of the Alps.

What wheels would you spec me for a £300 and a £500 budget.

Cheers!

Comments

  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,321
    You won't find many builders who want to buy white spokes (only come in boxes) for one build... but if you supply them.
    That also limits the choice of hubs, as those with narrow holes will most likely scratch white spokes during the assembly. I would say Novatec 171/172 are probably the best candidates.
    However, I know the guys at Brick Lane Bikes pretty well and I am sure if I ask them for some of the white spokes they use for their builds, I can get them as singles. They are not DT, but they are stainless, so they are not bad spokes. Give me a shout if interested and I can see if that's possible.
    Or ask BLB to build you a set of wheels, they do that of course.
    Of course limiting your choice in this fashion is the wrong approach to a bespoke set of wheels, but horses for courses, as they say

    An appropriate read from my blog

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/con ... shionistas
    left the forum March 2023
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    I would not buy white spokes as I have would never use the remainder so a full box would have to charged for.

    Right and wrong who knows the answer to that question but as to which is a cheaper option then that is easier to answer. For a 85 kg rider get a 28 spoke rear wheel mininium if a stiff rim is used more spokes is always more reliable than less. Archetypes on Miche or Novatec A171/F172 hubs would be a good option with balck or silver spokes. silver are cheaper. If a lighter rims are desired then the DT Swiss RR415 on the front (28H) and RR465 (32H) are another good option but the builder MUST respect the maximum tension limit of the rims of 1100N Stick to that it is a good rim exceed it and it may be a crap rim in that you risk cracking. I have used alot of RR415's now and no issues yet.

    Black archetypes on Miche primato's 24F/28R is quite popular and look good to. Of course the Novatec and Miche hubs are avilable in silver too ad what wrong with silver?
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • curium
    curium Posts: 815
    O dear. I had thought that one of the advantages of a custom built set of wheels, along with the serviceability, would be the ability to specify a unique look that was not available off the shelf but I'm basically hearing that black or silver spokes, with black or silver rims and black, white or silver hubs are my options.

    Feels a bit limiting but I guess I should be thinking about the ride quality and wheels that stay true!

    What about nipples? Any room for customisability on nipples? I don't want to compromise the wheel but a big part of deciding to go for a custom wheel set was the thought that I could get something really unique.

    How much extra would I be looking at if I really wanted white spokes and where would be the best place to source them? Would I be creating a nightmare for myself if I ever needed a replacement spoke?

    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    An appropriate read from my blog

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/con ... shionistas
    An interesting read which confirms my fears. I think being new to this I have previously approached wheels from the point of view of aesthetics, logos that appeal and catchy colours...as well as reports of how stiff and light they are

    I notice on your blog that you do use DT Swiss Competition spokes so your objection is to the colour rather than the spoke's characteristics, correct?
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,321
    curium wrote:
    O dear. I had thought that one of the advantages of a custom built set of wheels, along with the serviceability, would be the ability to specify a unique look that was not available off the shelf but I'm basically hearing that black or silver spokes, with black or silver rims and black, white or silver hubs are my options.

    Feels a bit limiting but I guess I should be thinking about the ride quality and wheels that stay true!

    What about nipples? Any room for customisability on nipples? I don't want to compromise the wheel but a big part of deciding to go for a custom wheel set was the thought that I could get something really unique.

    How much extra would I be looking at if I really wanted white spokes and where would be the best place to source them? Would I be creating a nightmare for myself if I ever needed a replacement spoke?

    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    An appropriate read from my blog

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/con ... shionistas
    An interesting read which confirms my fears. I think being new to this I have previously approached wheels from the point of view of aesthetics, logos that appeal and catchy colours...as well as reports of how stiff and light they are

    I notice on your blog that you do use DT Swiss Competition spokes so your objection is to the colour rather than the spoke's characteristics, correct?

    The only circumstance where it makes sense to use white spokes is if you want a single speed set of wheels... one size of spoke only, you buy a full box end of the story. Otherwise you are looking at two or three different sizes, hence a hell of a lot of money, as any box retails for 70 pounds or so, on top of my head.
    You can get coloured nipples at extra cost, they are a waste of money and they can and probably will seize on the spoke threads... they are a downgrade, but so are most bicycle components, nothing new there.
    There are a number of decent white rims, if you want to have the opposite combination (white rims and black spokes). DT Swiss, Velocity and Halo (kinlin) do make rims in white at virtually no extra cost, so that is a possibility.
    left the forum March 2023
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    Absolutely nothing wrong with DT competition spokes (in silver), great spokes. It is the colour process that compromises the spoke.

    Same with nipples. A good brass nipple is the dogs, add colour and it detracts from the component.

    Unfortunately people often want a 'look' rather than a good set of wheels.
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • curium
    curium Posts: 815
    I am guilty of this :(

    I'm now considering the stealthy all black look. I don't want silver, I just don't...
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,321
    curium wrote:
    I am guilty of this :(

    I'm now considering the stealthy all black look. I don't want silver, I just don't...

    Something like this is "stealthy" on a budget

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/med ... ail/16/451

    I can't recommend the combination highly enough
    left the forum March 2023
  • Bozman
    Bozman Posts: 2,518
    smidsy wrote:

    Unfortunately people often want a 'look' rather than a good set of wheels.

    Black rims and white spokes, a "look"? It sounds like the cycling equivalent of The Fast and the Furious.
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    edited July 2013
    Bozman wrote:
    Black rims and white spokes, a "look"? It sounds like the cycling equivalent of The Fast and the Furious.

    I never agreed it was a good look.

    Silver goes with anything

    Edit: Pics removed - no point having them twice.
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • Bozman
    Bozman Posts: 2,518
    smidsy wrote:
    Bozman wrote:
    Black rims and white spokes, a "look"? It sounds like the cycling equivalent of The Fast and the Furious.

    I never agreed it was a good look.

    Silver goes with anything

    Gold rims
    9149845987_8a154c391d_z_d.jpg

    Black rims
    8389636853_3b90cd55a9_z_d.jpg

    I should have made it clear, I wasn't saying that you agreed I was just using the "look" quote.
  • grim168
    grim168 Posts: 482
    Broke a wheel on my new scott last week. Leisure lakes lent me some eastons while scott send out a new pair. White spokes look cool. Looks really good when you look down at front wheel as you ride along.
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    grim168 wrote:
    White spokes look cool. Looks really good when you look down at front wheel as you ride along.

    Natural selection at its best - I just hope you do not take an innocent person with you when you go! :lol:
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • grim168
    grim168 Posts: 482
    Yep I do miles and miles looking down... Nobody look around at scenery as they ride?
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    If you can do either of these then you are not trying hard enough. :P

    People often comment on this or that when out but all I can see is blurred images as the effort required just to keep up is so demanding :evil:
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • mechanism
    mechanism Posts: 891
    If you really want white spokes then ignore the naysayers. I think they can look OK

    dsc0279fn.jpg

    (From http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=115893)
  • giant_man
    giant_man Posts: 6,878
    Mechanism wrote:
    If you really want white spokes then ignore the naysayers. I think they can look OK

    dsc0279fn.jpg

    (From http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=115893)
    yeah great very nice, but hardly on a budget though ...
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    Mechanism wrote:
    If you really want white spokes then ignore the naysayers. I think they can look OK

    dsc0279fn.jpg

    (From http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=115893)

    Yuck, that looks cheap! Like someone painted the spokes with white emulsion paint!
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • Bozman
    Bozman Posts: 2,518
    Mechanism wrote:
    If you really want white spokes then ignore the naysayers. I think they can look OK

    dsc0279fn.jpg

    (From http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=115893)

    I rest my case, it looks like an 17 year old has sold his over pimped Saxo and started work on a road bike.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,321
    Bozman wrote:
    Mechanism wrote:
    If you really want white spokes then ignore the naysayers. I think they can look OK

    dsc0279fn.jpg

    (From http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=115893)

    I rest my case, it looks like an 17 year old has sold his over pimped Saxo and started work on a road bike.
    On Weightweenies everybody love them... :wink:
    left the forum March 2023
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    Surely the white paint adds weight! :-)
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • sloppyschleckonds
    sloppyschleckonds Posts: 8,019
    smidsy wrote:
    Surely the white paint adds weight! :-)

    Did you ever sell those horrible white wheels you had?
    I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles
  • smidsy
    smidsy Posts: 5,273
    Indeed I did :)

    The Gold Pianni Tubs and Black Ambrosio Excellights posted earlier are my current wheelsets.
    Yellow is the new Black.
  • curium
    curium Posts: 815
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    curium wrote:
    I am guilty of this :(

    I'm now considering the stealthy all black look. I don't want silver, I just don't...

    Something like this is "stealthy" on a budget

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/med ... ail/16/451

    I can't recommend the combination highly enough
    Would they be adversely affected if the spokes were white instead? :wink:
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,321
    curium wrote:
    ugo.santalucia wrote:
    curium wrote:
    I am guilty of this :(

    I'm now considering the stealthy all black look. I don't want silver, I just don't...

    Something like this is "stealthy" on a budget

    http://paolocoppo.drupalgardens.com/med ... ail/16/451

    I can't recommend the combination highly enough
    Would they be adversely affected if the spokes were white instead? :wink:

    Yes, they would cost you a hell of a lot more... roughly speaking 100 pounds more, which is about 40% more. Also, Shimano hubs have rather narrow holes, white spokes might end up scratched. One can use Novatec hubs which have larger holes and avoid the problem... it is still a very expensive cosmetic upgrade.

    EDIT: it is actually a lot more than that... you need 2 boxes: one 290 and one 288 mm, they do retail at 150 pounds each.
    You can get away using 288 all round, hence only one box, with longer nipples on the front and rear non drive side, but it is a big compromise... which is the worst thing to do if you go bespoke. The market is probably full of crap wheels with white spokes, no need for me (or other) to build some bespoke ones
    left the forum March 2023

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