British public is wrong about 'nearly everything' apparently

rick_chasey

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 97821.html

Good fun.

Democracies eh?

Does raise an important issue re governance.

rhext

I'm not sure about governance. To me it raises more important questions about education and reporting. Why would you not believe that crime is rising when all the media channels you see compete with each other to present more and more graphic horror stories to you? 'Immigration numbers not as large as you think' isn't going to get much space on the front page either.

The article makes the point at the end that we need better understanding of how to see through the misinformation - and that means education. As for reporting, however, I almost dispair. You can't control the press, because that's just disastrous. But I do wish that they could sort out some sort of decent professional code of ethics for themselves obligating them to actually research and present the facts, and to balance the constant stream of bad news with at least some good! The BBC tries to research and present facts (bless 'em), but they still largely subscribe to the 'it's not news unless something horrible has happened' view.

daviesee

Eh?

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

70% of benefit claims are fraudulent? Is that really what they are saying? I doubt it.
And 24 + 34 = 58 so they can't even add up. :?

PS:- If we are so wrong, does that include who we elect? :twisted:

Kerguelen

daviesee wrote:

Eh?

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

70% of benefit claims are fraudulent? Is that really what they are saying? I doubt it.
And 24 + 34 = 58 so they can't even add up. :?

PS:- If we are so wrong, does that include who we elect? :twisted:

I must confess it took me a few moments to see what you did there.

Mind you I have not had my morning LD50 dose of coffee yet.

rolf_f

daviesee wrote:

Eh?

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

70% of benefit claims are fraudulent? Is that really what they are saying? I doubt it.
And 24 + 34 = 58 so they can't even add up. :?

PS:- If we are so wrong, does that include who we elect? :twisted:

Behave!

Nice to see an article that quantifies the sheer stupidity of the population - I suspected it was bad but not this bad - People think that 31% of the population are recent immigrants (though the article doesn't indicate how the survey data is processed which is a pity and mildly ironic under the circumstances!) :roll:

iPete

Do remember, as cyclists the great British public think we ride because we can't afford road tax & like tight fitting clothing.


One of those statements might be true.

bigmat

I've often thought that what this country needs is a good dictator. Blair is the closest we have come, sadly he turned out to be a bit of a tw*t.

Wrath Rob

daviesee wrote:

Eh?

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

70% of benefit claims are fraudulent? Is that really what they are saying? I doubt it.
And 24 + 34 = 58 so they can't even add up. :?

PS:- If we are so wrong, does that include who we elect? :twisted:

Eh? Not seen what you've done there, unless you're taking the piss 70p out of £100 is not 70%, its 0.7%, which is indeed 1/34th or a factor of 34, of the £24

On your election point though, I think you're bang on.

markhewitt1978

I dunno I think it somewhat shows a lack of numeracy rather than anything else.

daviesee

Wrath Rob wrote:

daviesee wrote:

Eh?

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

70% of benefit claims are fraudulent? Is that really what they are saying? I doubt it.
And 24 + 34 = 58 so they can't even add up. :?

PS:- If we are so wrong, does that include who we elect? :twisted:

Eh? Not seen what you've done there, unless you're taking the wee-wee 70p out of £100 is not 70%, its 0.7%, which is indeed 1/34th or a factor of 34, of the £24

On your election point though, I think you're bang on.

Stupid is as stupid does. And I get to vote. :twisted:

Gallywomack

Saw that and the headline made me chuckle - like something out of Private Eye!

davmaggs

The most basic of market research courses talks about bias being caused by the communication method chosen to question people.

In this case, how many informed people would waste time speaking to MORI on the phone?

UndercoverElephant

Well of course they're wrong about everything. Think how stupid the average person is, well half of the population are even more stupid than that!

dhope

UndercoverElephant wrote:

Well of course they're wrong about everything. Think how stupid the average person is, well half of the population are even more stupid than that!

Even more stupider.

Stevo_666

Surely slightly ironic that a left of centre newpaper publishes a view that the 'man in the street' is totally misguided and by implication a bit dense?

Or does this follow soon after polls showing the majority of people want the UK out of the EU and/or the Lib Dems support falling through the floor?

Initialised

I read this on the RSS a few days ago.

For a less biased spin I suggest reading the original: http://www.rssenews.org.uk/2013/07/rss- ... tatistics/

tailwindhome

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

I'm not sure I believe that statistic.

I'd be interested in seeing the calculation.

Job-seekers allowance: 29% of people think we spend more on JSA than pensions, when in fact we spend 15 times more on pensions (£4.9bn vs £74.2bn).

I would have thought that the %age of fraud on JSA would be significantly higher than on pensions.

Including pensions in the overall fraud calculation would dilute the overall % considerably.

Numbers eh?

The Rookie

Lies, damn lies and statistics.....

Worded properly you can make statistics say almost anything, like cmaiming 1/3 of all road deaths were due to speeding (Tony Bliar) when it was only about 12% were it was a contributory factor and less than 8% where it was one of only two factors or better.

DavieSee, I doubt you get to vote, how do you find the polling station?

merkin

It strikes me that the pensioners are a bunch of scroungers who sit about watching Jeremy Kyle, loose women and Australian soap operas while depriving the nations job seekers, teenage mothers and recent immigrants of benefits. All while supping top of the range Twinings Tea and laughing at the rest of us as they blow their wrinkly noses on £50 notes.
Makes my blood boil!
Regards, Angry from Little Whinging

daviesee

The Beginner wrote:

....
DavieSee, I doubt you get to vote, how do you find the polling station?

Just messing.

rick_chasey

People believe what they want to believe and are good at cherry picking stuff that suits their agenda and forgetting stuff that doesn't.

rolf_f

TailWindHome wrote:

"- Benefit fraud: the public think that £24 of every £100 of benefits is fraudulently claimed. Official estimates are that just 70 pence in every £100 is fraudulent - so the public conception is out by a factor of 34."

I'm not sure I believe that statistic.

I'd be interested in seeing the calculation.

Why is it that you don't believe that statistic?

veronese68

Very difficult statistic to prove or disprove. If every fraudulent claim is known it should be easy to stop the fraud. But they're not all known and it's not easy to stop them. So it's a guess rather than a fact.

desweller

Veronese68 wrote:

Very difficult statistic to prove or disprove. If every fraudulent claim is known it should be easy to stop the fraud. But they're not all known and it's not easy to stop them. So it's a guess rather than a fact.

It's an estimate...

SteppenHerring

DesWeller wrote:

Veronese68 wrote:

Very difficult statistic to prove or disprove. If every fraudulent claim is known it should be easy to stop the fraud. But they're not all known and it's not easy to stop them. So it's a guess rather than a fact.

It's an estimate...

What it's based upon is the DWP investigating a proportion of cases to the max and then extrapolating. So it's pretty accurate. Or at least more accurate than the shite made up by the papers.