Which Wheel set?

napoleond

pinarellokid wrote:

well i learned i need to get a pair of custom wheels and that im going to be building them myself.

so thanks for that.. just need some advice on strong hubs for a heavy rider 32h ones. and which spokes to choose and im all sorted with my shopping list..

Campag Record or Shimano DA are pretty damn fine. For a bit of customisation colour wise Pmp are excellent strong hubs, cheap but good are Hope. Get some Sapim laser spokes and the jobs a good 'un.

spanielsson

NapoleonD wrote:

Campag Record or Shimano DA are pretty damn fine. For a bit of customisation colour wise Pmp are excellent strong hubs, cheap but good are Hope. Get some Sapim laser spokes and the jobs a good 'un.

Sapim Race, not Laser

smidsy

Hope hubs, well engineered and British.

DT Swiss Competition spokes.

napoleond

spanielsson wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

Campag Record or Shimano DA are pretty damn fine. For a bit of customisation colour wise Pmp are excellent strong hubs, cheap but good are Hope. Get some Sapim laser spokes and the jobs a good 'un.

Sapim Race, not Laser

Doh! Always get mixed up with them...

I've had DT comps before too, very robust...

drlodge

FWIW, I've got Record 32H hubs, Sapim Race spokes (lasers on the front) and Excellight rims. Pretty similar to what's been mentioned above, and they're great wheels.

pinarellokid

drlodge wrote:

FWIW, I've got Record 32H hubs, Sapim Race spokes (lasers on the front) and Excellight rims. Pretty similar to what's been mentioned above, and they're great wheels.

what do they weigh in at when finished??

i do like the idea of of campy hubs as im a campag man,
but are they not cup and cone bearing in record hubs still??
prefer the idea of sealed cartridge bearings again as i currently have them in my Khamsin wheels

upto now my shopping list is
Excellight rims
Sapim Race spokes
and novatec / miche hubs,, not sure which others to choose.
i do like the idea of hope hubs but they are around £200 a pair

drlodge

pinarellokid wrote:

drlodge wrote:

FWIW, I've got Record 32H hubs, Sapim Race spokes (lasers on the front) and Excellight rims. Pretty similar to what's been mentioned above, and they're great wheels.

what do they weigh in at when finished??

i do like the idea of of campy hubs as im a campag man,
but are they not cup and cone bearing in record hubs still??
prefer the idea of sealed cartridge bearings again as i currently have them in my Khamsin wheels

I have no idea what they weigh, I don't its that important - they're reasonably light, bullet proof and should last years.

And why on earth would you want sealed bearings instead of cup and cone? These hubs are as smooth as silk and will out last any sealed bearing hubs.

napoleond

drlodge wrote:

pinarellokid wrote:

drlodge wrote:

FWIW, I've got Record 32H hubs, Sapim Race spokes (lasers on the front) and Excellight rims. Pretty similar to what's been mentioned above, and they're great wheels.

what do they weigh in at when finished??

i do like the idea of of campy hubs as im a campag man,
but are they not cup and cone bearing in record hubs still??
prefer the idea of sealed cartridge bearings again as i currently have them in my Khamsin wheels

I have no idea what they weigh, I don't its that important - they're reasonably light, bullet proof and should last years.

And why on earth would you want sealed bearings instead of cup and cone? These hubs are as smooth as silk and will out last any sealed bearing hubs.

I freaking LOVE my lo pro wheels, extralight front hub, Campag rear. They weigh about 1450g, a little less but near as dammit.

smidsy

I have Ambrosio Excellight rims on Novatech hubs with DT Comp spokes and the ride is silky smooth (especially with the Vittoria tyres and latex tubes). Built by Ugo




I also have some Pianni Tubular rims on Hope Pro 3 hubs with Alpina Riaggi Spokes. Built by Peter Matthews. Yet to ride them but wow they are light.

pinarellokid

I have Ambrosio Excellight rims on Novatech hubs with DT Comp spokes and the ride is silky smooth (especially with the Vittoria tyres and latex tubes). Built by Ugo

What do these weigh in at ?? If you don't mind me asking !!! I think this is the set up for me

napoleond

I would estimate about 1750g for that set.

simon_masterson

Marcusww wrote:

surely there is some safety factor in there - most engineering safety factors should easily allow for this - anyway I am going to gamble and if I end up with mangled wheels then hey hoe an expensive lesson.

There is a 'safety factor': they're designed for the weight of the people that use them. That person is generally much lighter than the 85kg or so that's generally prescribed as the limit, so the margin for 'error' is quite large.

dennisn

NapoleonD wrote:

Thus concludes yet another what wheels? thread.

The usual "Op asks for advice, recieves plenty, discards it all and goes with what his heart was set on in first place."

I'm thinking that what you say is very true. Once someone sees and or reads the advert's about a certain set of wheels it would seem to be pretty much set in their minds what they want. Chiming in on a forum and asking is not anything that will change their minds.
I say buy the wheels for the looks / bling you like or the color scheme matching set or the ones that promise you a podium spot or deep dish because everyones got them or for the brand name or to be unique(handbuilt). Just buy them. If they do or don't work out you will have learned a lesson. Yes, maybe a hard lesson but you'll never forget it.

mikelskas

I was 16 stone (224lbs) last year and was getting fed up of the Alex Rims that came with my bike constantly going out of shape. I went and bought some Fulcrum 5s and never had a problem again. They say if you are over 104kg you should check them a bit more regularly but like I say I've never had a problem.

smidsy

pinarellokid wrote:

I have Ambrosio Excellight rims on Novatech hubs with DT Comp spokes and the ride is silky smooth (especially with the Vittoria tyres and latex tubes). Built by Ugo

What do these weigh in at ?? If you don't mind me asking !!! I think this is the set up for me

I have not weighed then but Ugo.Santalucia will doubtless know. I have 32/32 so not built for light weight in mind. They are not weeny but not that heavy either. Also the real weight is in the hubs so not as noticable.

They are my do everything wheel so it was about compromises.

pinarellokid

They are what I'm going to go with I'm sure
Just hoping they will be a better wheel than my factory khamsins
Not that I can complain a out them other than the weight

I do like the noisy click on them

Are the novatecs a quiet freewheel or noisy ??

smidsy

Not quiet but not Hope loud, I would say average noise. In fact noise is the wrong word as it suggests unwanted sound. It is a reasurringly gentle clicking.

I have done 3000 miles (including 1 small crash, sorry Paolo) on them in all weathers and they are still smooth as butter and as true as the day they arrived.

smidsy

Ambrosio claim 430g for the rim so thats 860 pair

Front hub claim 235g

Rear hub 268g

DT Comp Spokes 384g (for 64)

Gives a rough total of 1747g. so Nap was pretty on the money.

Need to add rim tape and Skewers on top too.

pinarellokid

All sounds good to me and easily serviceable

smidsy

Totally serviceable and all components are readily and cheaply (compared to factory) available should you need to repair at any time.

Go for brass nipples too, those pesky alloy ones tend to seize and can suffer stress fractures in time.

napoleond

Always go brass nips!!

pinarellokid

if im honest id give my left bollock for red nipples
but common sense says no ..

ahh well brass it is

junglist_matty

smidsy wrote:

junglist_matty wrote:

Rubbish,
I use Mavic Ksyrium Equipes, I'm 95k & ridden them just over 4800 miles since Sept last year, in all conditions, over my fair share of pot holes, deep drains, road bumps, and they're still running fine & perfectly true.

Your individual experience is irrelevant to my opinion.

There will always be good and bad examples, that does not make the product any more suitable for a given set of parameters.

It simply means you have done very well.

I take back my original post! Must have jinxed it because on Sunday out on a ride, the rear wheel popped a spoke, completely destroyed the rim, and the adjacent spokes had cracks on the rim, a pretty major manufacturing failure! Just ordered some Open Pros on 105 hubs to replace them with the higher spoke count should be hardier... and if they do break, cheaper to fix than having to buy a new wheelset as you can easily source spare parts!

smidsy

Sorry to hear that JM and top marks for coming back here and owning up.

I bet your hand builts will be a much more reliable and comfortable prospect. As you say much cheaper to fix should the worst happen.

Enjoy.

pinarellokid

just to throw this into the mix pretty much set on Ambrosio Excellight rims.
but for the same money is it worth considering H plus son Archetype rims ???
seem to have a similar great following but the main difference i can see is the width being much wider..

is this worth considering of are the Ambrosio better

smidsy

The H plus son are another great rim. The v profile gives a slightly deeper section too.

Excellight are liked by club racers if that is any use?

pinarellokid

i like the idea of a deeper rim, but what sticks out as different is the width.

the H plus sons are much wider apparently giving a better tyre profile leading to easier rolling and more comfort

they are very similar in weight so no real difference there, it says in the blurb they are a very classy looking rim also..

any other comments before i hit the GO button to help me decide

cheers

Sprool

NapoleonD wrote:

Thus concludes yet another what wheels? thread.
The usual "Op asks for advice, recieves plenty, discards it all and goes with what his heart was set on in first place."

Slightly cynical but also quite amusing. You have to balance this against the amount of conflicting info you get on forums, the fact that anyone is at liberty to spout with experience and authority no matter how well or poorly founded it is, that and the huge choice of components make decisions more complex than they ever used to be.

smidsy

pinarellokid wrote:

any other comments before i hit the GO button to help me decide cheers

From my wheelbuilder of choice.
"Now everybody wants the H plus Son archetype... they are wider, they are slightly deeper than your average rim (around 25 mm instead of 20), with a rounded V profile, they look stunning and they ride well. Wheelsmith has come out with his own combo and Strada basically advise them to everybody. It comes in full black, which looks good on carbon bikes, but mind you, the rim surface will wear out revealing the alloy and this happens quickly or slowly depending on a number of factors"

If I had not got my Pete Matthews Tubulars at a great price I would have got H Plus Son for my best wheels.

Throbbe

Marcusww wrote:

surely there is some safety factor in there - most engineering safety factors should easily allow for this - anyway I am going to gamble and if I end up with mangled wheels then hey hoe an expensive lesson.

Speaking as an engineer, that's not really how it works.

You seem to be implying that If a 90kg is OK, and there's a 10% safety factor, then a 99kg rider will have no problems, but a 100kg rider will be breaking spokes like there's no tomorrow.

There will be a correlation between loading and rate of failure, and the graph will almost certainly not be a straight line. Somewhere on that curve, the manufacturer will make their mark on what failure rate they feel is OK without damaging their reputation, and select the weight on that basis.

That's a gross oversimplification of course, and assumes all other things are equal, but the fact is that you (and I) sit some way up that curve, and in those circumstances I'd look for a wheel that had been built to take account of my weight.