Whisky

daviesee

A slight diversion but I am sure no one will mind.
If there are any rum drinkers (or anyone else for that matter) out there that haven't found the whisky for them then try the Balvenie Caribean Cask.
Single malt whisky matured in rum casks. Very different and very smooth.

rolf_f

daviesee wrote:

edhornby wrote:

I don't like penderyn either, it falls apart in the glass as BillG says, and I'm not a fan of some of the big brands either as glenmorangie and glenlivet don't really do it for me, lots of people rave about jura but I'm ambivalent about that too (I'm english btw but have no nationalist tendencies)

I do like the bigger peaty islays - like ardbeg bowmore bruichladdich, there is also a tesco own brand islay that I am convinced is a well known make (can't remember which) but relabelled. ledaig is great for the price

Little known fact thanks to Brian at thewashingmachinepost who is based on Islay. There are 9 distilleries on Islay and anyone with a passing interest will have heard of all of them. If a supermarket has honestly labelled a whisky as an Islay single malt then it has to come from one of them, re-labelled and cheaper.

It's even easier when the supermarket has it's own label Skye malt!

Despite generally favouring the Island malts, I do like Springbank. But mostly I drink the very obscure Cameron Brig.

Daz555

Independence around the corner? It's time England stood on its own two Whisky feet!

http://www.englishwhisky.co.uk/whisky-s ... ish-whisky

They have some lovely top quality whisky.

ugo.santalucia

Oban

meanredspider

Well, if you wanted to be quite topical and touching, buy a copy of the very recently late Iain Banks' "Raw Spirit" which is a fabulous book all on its own - his search for the perfect dram and a tour of Scotland's distilleries.

Along with it you could buy a bottle of each of the two that he recommends:

Run-of-the-mill: Highland Park

Perfect dram of all: Glenfidich Havana Reserve

Agent57

See also viewtopic.php?f=40012&t=12795411

Like others, I think it's crucial to get an idea of what the recipient likes. Some people hate the strong peaty types, for example, while others (me) love them the most. I enjoy drinking Ardbeg, Laphroaig, Lagavulin and the like, but would find far less pleasure in, say, a Glenfiddich or Abelour to pick two random ones. Sure, they might appreciate it in terms of it being a high quality bottle, but that's not to say they wouldn't actually prefer a £40 bottle more in keeping with their tastes.

Also, as some have said I would take the notion that Speyside is "a safe bet" with a pinch of salt; I know I don't really like them overall, for example. (Although I do have a bottle of Glenfiddich Snow Phoenix, unopened.)

Perhaps if they can find out a type the recipient likes, you can then ask for similar ideas; or perhaps an older version of the same. e.g. if they like Glenfiddich 15, maybe Glenfiddich 21 would be a reasonable choice.

thiscocks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeovTxMwrhY

EKE_38BPM

Il Principe wrote:

...I dabble a little in Whisky...

I have vague memories of me, you and a few others staggering across Vauxhall Bridge swigging from a bottle of what was apparently quite good Whisky.

The memories are very vague, as memories after a night in the Morpeth.

daviesee

Agent57 wrote:

.....Also, as some have said I would take the notion that Speyside is "a safe bet" with a pinch of salt; I know I don't really like them overall, for example....

Speysides are recommended as the safe bet because they are not peaty. It is usually the peatyness that puts people off whisky. That is to say that it is safe, not best, as everyone has a different palate.
Each to their own, just enjoy! :P

First.Aspect

daviesee wrote:

Sketchley wrote:

First Aspect wrote:

Why would a valid recipient of a £100 bottle limit their tastes to peaty or not peaty?

Possibly worth getting some intel on what they currently have in the drinks cabinet and then the Scots Whisk Association would be a good place to start. Current in vogue are one offs - a single cask, at cask strength is pretty much unique. Even a single malt is a blend of various casks. Alternatively people go for something first put in the cask on the year of ones birth.

Beware though, whisky buffs tend to talk more science bollicks even than cyclists.

I think this is was my point too. It really doesn't matter what you get when spending that kind of money. A buff will enjoy a £100 bottle even if it isn't thier preference in terms of flavour. They will certainly appreicate the gift. Let's say they don't prefer peated whiskey but you buy them a Laphroaig 21 Year Old 1990 Directors' Cut which is very peaty. They will still enjoy it a lot. If they don't you shouldn't be buying them whisky at all....

The exception to this would be someone who reguarly pays £200+ for bottle. They would turn thier nose up at the wrong £100 bottle. But for the majority who drink 12 year old malts, at sub £40 a bottle, any £100 bottle would be heaven.

Disagrees......
I drink way more whisky than the recommended amount and I can assure you that I wouldn't thank you for any Laphroaig. There is so much difference in tastes in whiskey that they are practically different drinks.
Re a bottle from date of birth. Great idea. With a but.
I wanted a 1962 Macallan for my 50th but Daniel Craig had to drink it in Skyfall. The current price - @ £1000.

I confess that I too find the Ardbeg's and Laphroags of this world vile.

Peaty taste only got into whiskies in the first place because that's all they had to burn on the islands (that's what I thought anyway). Taking a nice sweet drink from, say, Seyside and adding ashtray tones just seems false, and makes me think its just single malt snobbery.

Someone once said to me "ah, that's a beginner's malt" with respect to a 16 year old Jura. I asked why and the answer appeared to me to be, in essence, because it tastes nice.

On this basis, drinking neat gin would seem to be the most advanced form of drinking possible. "Oh, you aren't still putting tonic in yours, are you?"

But.... I've still managed to choke down a bottle of Laphraog.... and a bottle of Ardbeg..... so I would still say, worth a check first, but unless you go to one of the more extreme malts, you'll probably be alright.

Underscore

Back to the original question, the most astonishing whisky that I have tasted at that price point is the Octomore 5.01. It is very peaty but much more balanced than some of the southern Islay distilleries tend to be: I tasted it at an Islay whisky tasting evening which included the similarly priced Ardbeg Galileo and the Octomore was, IM<HO, twice the whisky of the Ardbeg. Unfortunately, it was a limited edition so I don't know whether you will be able to find a bottle at the original price but, if you can, it's a belter!

_

Edit: P.S. I've tried a bottle of the Tesco Islay and I would put money on it being a Caol Ila. Others may disagree...

Tigger con carne

When my Dad was 60 I looked for a whiskey for him that was produced in the same year he was born. When I got an idea of how stupidly expensive it was going to be I thought better of it (I ended up getting a special bottle of Lagavulin which he still loved) , but you look for a bottle that was made the year the couple first got together if they've been together a long time or some other year that's significant to them maybe

meanredspider

Personally I can't stand Whisky - a waste of good Highland water. BUT, at the moment, the money that the Whisky industry is spending on construction/expansion due to the demand from China is keeping the local construction industry afloat - so it's not all bad.

unixnerd

Not heard anyone mention Glenfarclas yet, the 15 year old just lovely and by far my favourite dram. It's a sherried Strathspey with a wonderful aroma. For the real whisky buff a bottle of their cask strength "105" (62.5%) won't break the budget at 45 pounds. I'd also recommend anything from Tomatin.

Old Pulteney from Wick is a grand dram, the 21 year old won whisky of the year last year so is now very hard to get. But even the basic ten year old is a lovely dram often to be found around 20 a bottle that will appeal to most palates. The same can be said of Highland Park.

Around Christmas you want to have a bottle of Aberlour in your arsenal, whilst not an expensive dram at all it has a lovely spicy after taste that really suits the festive season.

sketchley

I appear to have come home with a bottle of Oban distillers edition from the whiskey shop on Piccadilly. Paid far too much for it but it is rather nice..... I wonder how much will be left by morning..... #drinkingalone

SteppenHerring

Hmm. I', quite partial to peaty but the Ardbeg 17yo isn't too much so. Not sure how much it costs though. The La-Frog quarter-cask one I had a couple of years ago was also much milder than the "normal". Some of them do require a drop of water to open them out a bit. It is acceptable to add water, but ice is an abomination in the eyes of the lord. Caol Ila cask strength is an example. Nice.

unixnerd

but ice is an abomination in the eyes of the lord

Indeed so! Whisky needs warmth to release the essential oils and develop a bouquet, ice stifles that. At least you don't use lemonade like our colonial cousins......

A lot of you mention the peaty island malts, not a fan myself. If you've not given the slightly sherried Strathspey malts a go it's worth a try.

First.Aspect

unixnerd wrote:

but ice is an abomination in the eyes of the lord

Indeed so! Whisky needs warmth to release the essential oils and develop a bouquet, ice stifles that. At least you don't use lemonade like our colonial cousins......

A lot of you mention the peaty island malts, not a fan myself. If you've not given the slightly sherried Strathspey malts a go it's worth a try.

see what I mean about whisky buffs talking more science babble than cyclists?
The clue with whisky is that it's clear. Nothing drops out of solution with ice. Ends up at tongue temperature one way or another.

daviesee

First Aspect wrote:

unixnerd wrote:

but ice is an abomination in the eyes of the lord

Indeed so! Whisky needs warmth to release the essential oils and develop a bouquet, ice stifles that. At least you don't use lemonade like our colonial cousins......

A lot of you mention the peaty island malts, not a fan myself. If you've not given the slightly sherried Strathspey malts a go it's worth a try.

see what I mean about whisky buffs talking more science babble than cyclists?
The clue with whisky is that it's clear. Nothing drops out of solution with ice. Ends up at tongue temperature one way or another.

Sorry but that's pure babble.
Whisky is not clear for a start.
It may end up at tongue temperature eventually but only if you hold it there long enough* and your taste will have been affected by then. Most food or drink has an ideal temperature to be tasted at whether it is hot, cold or room temperature. For whisky it is room temperature.

*There is a theory to hold whisky in the mouth for one second per year of casking. This may make sense as you might want to ged rid of the cheap stuff as soon as possible, whilst savouring a mature malt seems like a good idea. :P

First.Aspect

All my whisky seems to be clear, suggesting it's a solution of some kind. Not sure whats in it. Ethanol, water an some soluble impurities, some of which absorb light in the visible wavelengths, perhaps. Not sure though. Might contain magic pixie dust too.

Asking a whisky whisperer not to parrot whatever the person who told them about whisky to the tune of a magic flute, is like trying to explain the significance of the burgess shale to a 7th day Adventist.

daviesee

First Aspect wrote:

All my whisky seems to be clear, suggesting it's a solution of some kind. Not sure whats in it. Ethanol, water an some soluble impurities, some of which absorb light in the visible wavelengths, perhaps. Not sure though. Might contain magic pixie dust too.

Asking a whisky whisperer not to parrot whatever the person who told them about whisky to the tune of a magic flute, is like trying to explain the significance of the burgess shale to a 7th day Adventist.

Too obvious.

First.Aspect

daviesee wrote:

First Aspect wrote:

All my whisky seems to be clear, suggesting it's a solution of some kind. Not sure whats in it. Ethanol, water an some soluble impurities, some of which absorb light in the visible wavelengths, perhaps. Not sure though. Might contain magic pixie dust too.

Asking a whisky whisperer not to parrot whatever the person who told them about whisky to the tune of a magic flute, is like trying to explain the significance of the burgess shale to a 7th day Adventist.

Too obvious.

Go on then. How long does it take the temperature and various Lewis/Bronstead acid/base processes to equilibrate?
As a chemist, I've never heard anything convincing to suggest anything other than all versions of water/no water, ice/no ice end up at the same point in short order.

daviesee

First Aspect wrote:

Go on then. How long does it take the temperature and various Lewis/Bronstead acid/base processes to equilibrate?
As a chemist, I've never heard anything convincing to suggest anything other than all versions of water/no water, ice/no ice end up at the same point in short order.

I like my ice cream cold, my whisky at room temperature and my coffee hot. I don't need science to explain.

First.Aspect

daviesee wrote:

First Aspect wrote:

Go on then. How long does it take the temperature and various Lewis/Bronstead acid/base processes to equilibrate?
As a chemist, I've never heard anything convincing to suggest anything other than all versions of water/no water, ice/no ice end up at the same point in short order.

I like my ice cream cold, my whisky at room temperature and my coffee hot. I don't need science to explain.

That's fine. I like mine cold (initially). Why did you tell me that was "wrong"?

Science is so inconvenient, isn't it?

daviesee

First Aspect wrote:

That's fine. I like mine cold (initially). Why did you tell me that was "wrong"?

Science is so inconvenient, isn't it?

So you prefer it initially cold. So you admit that it being cold affects the taste. That was my point.
Drink it how you like. :P
Convention is for room temperature.

sketchley

Cold does effect the taste. Some science http://chemse.oxfordjournals.org/conten ... 9.abstract

This is why you put ice in magners, or chill white wine, it reduces the intensity of the flavour making it more palitable.

Tigger con carne

It's pretty much a no-brainer that temperature will affect the taste. Taste is due to a huge number of volatile compounds that will have different boiling points. Change the temperature and you will change the relative proportions of these in the mouthful, and at colder temperatures may not even evaporate at all so you'd lose that component of the flavour and aroma. Also, most people would have swallowed it before it had a chance to fully equilibrate to body temperature.

Similarly, adding a drop of water will change the solvent composition (namely water and ethanol) which will change the way the flavour components interact and evaporate. I had a debate with a Greek bar tender one time about adding water to good whisky. He was saying you shouldn't, I was saying (in not so many words) that this was macho BS and that you should because it tempers the flavour, especially in a warm climate. If you ever drink a near shot of something like Laphroaig or Cragganmore in somewhere like Singapore, it's like being smacked in the mouth by a sod of peat if you don't add a little drop of water because of the volatility of the flavours and the alcohol.

First.Aspect

The presumption is that doing x or y with this mystical liquid will dramatically effect what you taste. That's nonsense. Cold is a sensation I happen to prefer, but by the time the 5ml diffused over your tongue its all at the same temperature as it would have been. At that stage, how is what I taste any different?

Dilution could influence the taste, but even this presumes that there are equilibria which are anywhere near balanced, and which could be pushed one way or the other by further diluting. Is that the case? At 40% abv drink is about 80% water (very roughly). Is diluting by, say, a factor of two going to shift any equilibria which aren't already to one side? If not, how is the taste going to change?

Besides, I think opinion is split over ice/no-ice, etc. Take it how you like it, and don't pooh pooh people who (quite rightly) recognise that smoke/peat = vile, or who prefer it cold. Its like telling someone what art they should appreciate. Its annoying, particularly if it hasn't been thought through.

unixnerd

The point isn't the final temp on your tongue, but the initial temp in the glass. If it's too cold the whisky will have less aroma when you smell it prior to drinking it.

sketchley

unixnerd wrote:

The point isn't the final temp on your tongue, but the initial temp in the glass. If it's too cold the whisky will have less aroma when you smell it prior to drinking it.

It's more than that, it's also the intial temp of the tounge as well. If the liquid the first hits is cold it reduces certain flavour regardless of how it then warms up. Something that can be replicated by putting an ice cube on your tounge spitting it out then drink room temp whisky.