Converting Downtube shifters to STI

rubertoe
rubertoe Posts: 3,994
edited May 2013 in Workshop
I am in the process of Converting an old steel frame from Down tube shifters to STI.

What do I need for the cables? Guides etc?
"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills

Comments

  • freezing77
    freezing77 Posts: 731
    rubertoe wrote:
    I am in the process of Converting an old steel frame from Down tube shifters to STI.

    What do I need for the cables? Guides etc?

    If theshifters are braze on probably these to replace them and act as guides and stops.

    http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/shimano-alloy-braze-on-down-tube-cable-stops-with-barrel-adjusters-prod5511/

    5511.jpg
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    If you have not made up your mind already, I urge you to reconsider... Downtube shifters are zero maintenance and always work well. The same cables will probably last 20 years and you will never need to index them, if they are friction shifting.
    The STI will cost you a lot of money, they will be heavier, they will always give you some form of grief... on an onld bike it makes sense to stay on friction shifting. STI are only practical in traffic, as you don't have to take your hands off the bars... other than that, they are a waste of money/time
    left the forum March 2023
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    But can you get 10 speed DT friction shifters (I have seen the DA ones, I get confused if they are friction or indexed) and will they work with an indexed rear mech?

    Or am i missing something completely here?
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • freezing77
    freezing77 Posts: 731
    rubertoe wrote:
    But can you get 10 speed DT friction shifters (I have seen the DA ones, I get confused if they are friction or indexed) and will they work with an indexed rear mech?

    Or am i missing something completely here?

    The rear mech is not indexed shifters are.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    rubertoe wrote:
    But can you get 10 speed DT friction shifters (I have seen the DA ones, I get confused if they are friction or indexed) and will they work with an indexed rear mech?

    Or am i missing something completely here?

    The derailleur is not indexed, it just does what it is told to do by the cable. Friction shifters (old style) work with any number of sprockets... if you go for 10-11 you need a good hand to change sharply, but it is something you can develop quickly with a bit of practice.
    Indexed downtube shifters like Dura Ace can be run as indexed (with the number of gears they are set up for) or they can be ran as friction shifters, bypassing the ratchet. 10 speed DA downtube do exist and they are damn awesome
    left the forum March 2023
  • freezing77
    freezing77 Posts: 731
    To quote
    Precision engineered Dura Ace 10 speed down tube braze-on shift levers
    - Superior Dura Ace quality means reliability and durability
    - Easily fit to down tube and secure firmly for assured shifting
    - Fully compatible with 10 speed drivetrains
    - Can be used with double or triple chainsets
    - SIS indexed system compatible
    - Comes complete with SP41 gear cables, which are lubricated internally along their length with low-friction silicon grease to reduce cable friction
    - Weight: 76 grams per pair

    http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/shimano-dura-ace-sl-7900-10-spd-braze-on-down-tube-shifters-prod20304/
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Interesting,

    Maybe Now i'll have to build up two bikes. as I have just taken delivery of some 105 shifters!
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    rubertoe wrote:
    Interesting,

    Maybe Now i'll have to build up two bikes. as I have just taken delivery of some 105 shifters!

    You can always send them back...
    But yes, to answer your question, you do need those braze on converters, as shown above. I have a few of those which I bought for some reason a few years ago... not sure why, I probably thought they were going to disappear from the market soon...
    left the forum March 2023
  • drlodge
    drlodge Posts: 4,826
    I converted my Condor 531 frame to indexed shifters, but that was 7 speed (126mm OLN) and use a combination of 7-8-9-10 speed components e.g. Sora 8 speed shifters. If you have a 130mm OLN frame its a much easier proposition.
    WyndyMilla Massive Attack | Rourke 953 | Condor Italia 531 Pro | Boardman CX Pro | DT Swiss RR440 Tubeless Wheels
    Find me on Strava
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    rubertoe wrote:
    But can you get 10 speed DT friction shifters (I have seen the DA ones, I get confused if they are friction or indexed) and will they work with an indexed rear mech?

    Or am i missing something completely here?

    You can - it's just that indexed DT shifters aren't as nice as plain old friction shift. IMO indexing was an invention waiting for the STi shifter to happen. Without indexing, there is nothing to adjust once you've got the limit screws sorted - that's rather nice!

    I run dt shifters and STi type shifters. Neither is better than the other - just different with good points and bad points. The only time I really curse DT shifters is if I get caught out in the big chain ring on a steep climb; you can't really work a DT shifter whilst stood out of the saddle. But getting caught out is generally my own fault and it happens rarely anyway.

    I'd never in a million years convert a bike with DT shifters to STi.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • mr_eddy
    mr_eddy Posts: 830
    Just to add my two cents, I have both STI and Downtube bikes and without a shadow of a doubt I prefer the downtube bike, as others have said they are practically fit and forget. Also if you get index for the rear mech and friction for the front you will have the best of both worlds so you can trim off front mech rub when needed but still have quick index rear shifting.

    Also worth adding that unless you run the latest Shimmy 105 or above or campy then you will end up with cables all over the front of the bike like washing lines and it looks rubbish. Downtube shifters give a much cleaner look imo.

    My old 1992 bike still has the same gear cables and has NEVER missed a beat, and its only running middle of the range Shimmy 400EX stuff.

    If you do consider STI then have a look at Microshift as its good stuff, you still get unsightly cables everywhere but its cheap and lighter than the equivalent shimano stuff. Still not as light as Downtube shifters tho ! :)
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Damn you all.
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • keef66
    keef66 Posts: 13,123
    I fitted some NOS band-on downtube friction shifters to an old Peugeot my son was renovating. I love the simplicity and the fine-tunability on flat or undulating rides. STi's come into their own when making rapid, successive gear changes when hammering up a hill though.
  • mr_eddy
    mr_eddy Posts: 830
    Completely agree that STI are better when super fast shifting is required, One could argue that they are marginally easier too as you don't need to take your hand off the bars. Personally I still maintain that downtube shifters are a very viable option and in several areas are better (reliability, ease of setup, weight, cost).

    If it was me and I wanted to go to STI shifters then I would only pick stuff that offers under the tape cables to avoid the untidy look, this would mean at least the latest Shimano 105 or SRAM double tap (aquired taste), Obviously campy do it on all their gear but if we assumed that most mid level road bikes come with Shimano then you would also have to change other stuff like mechs, cassette etc.
  • rubertoe
    rubertoe Posts: 3,994
    Ok, So now i am thinking of keeping (but replacing) the DT shifters,

    Other than the DA 10 speed shifters any other recomendations for shimano (If that even matters) compitable DT shifters (10 speed).

    as an alternative what about Bar end shifters?
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got."

    PX Kaffenback 2 = Work Horse
    B-Twin Alur 700 = Sundays and Hills
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    rubertoe wrote:
    Ok, So now i am thinking of keeping (but replacing) the DT shifters,

    Other than the DA 10 speed shifters any other recomendations for shimano (If that even matters) compitable DT shifters (10 speed).

    as an alternative what about Bar end shifters?

    No, unless you want to go on ebay and get a set of vintage, get the DA... they are the best. Bar end shifters immediately add 20 years to your age and that's a fact!
    left the forum March 2023

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