SMIDSY??

24

Comments

  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Good job it was not a bike doing a right turn and you were not in your car overtaking at a junction!!!
  • heneghj
    heneghj Posts: 29
    As mentioned no solid white line (SO LEGAL), no oncoming traffic (SAFE)
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    heneghj wrote:
    Carbonator wrote:
    heneghj wrote:
    Not necessarily, if the road splits in to two further up and there is no solid white line in the centre then legally I can pass the traffic to turn right ahead as long as there is no oncoming traffic

    Not sure you can do that!


    Is overtaking illegal? as that is what it is

    It is the way you seem to want to do it :shock:
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    heneghj wrote:
    As mentioned no solid white line (SO LEGAL), no oncoming traffic (SAFE)

    The solid white line has nothing to do with anything really as you can cross them when overtaking stationery vehicles if no oncoming traffic.

    How was it safe if you had a crash?
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    heneghj wrote:
    Yeah I agree going down the right hand side is not the safest or smartest and I do in the most part try to avoid it. But the best part of bicycle commuting is the ability to avoid waiting in traffic.

    All in all, im as fine as i can be with a few bruises and you live and learn

    Yes your right being on a bike is good but there is a difference between avoiding traffic & not following the laws that apply to all vehicles. Like I said not trying to have an argument with you & do think that the vehicle pulling out (no matter if it was a lay-by or another road) should have paid more attention as the onus is on them to ensure they are not going to cause an accident by pulling out.

    Important thing is in this day an age that you came out of the accident & are able to tell the story
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • heneghj
    heneghj Posts: 29
    Anyway crisis over.

    Just spoke to my brother in law who is an accident claims advisor.

    I was established on the road and the driver came across me, therefore not my fault.

    Im not claiming as I said, I just want to make sure if she claims I dont get screwed
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Does your brother in law think you should claim?
  • heneghj
    heneghj Posts: 29
    haha hes a claims advisor. what do you think?
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    I'd say it's 50/50 at best ...

    The driver coming out from the left trying to turn right probably couldn't see beyond the vehicle that let her out. She was also possibly trying to see what was coming from her left to see if it was safe to proceed. She wouldn't necessarily have expected a cyclist to be overtaking the queuing cars ...

    You were overtaking - you must be vigilant whilst doing this - you're not in your own lane.

    As for which side to pass queuing traffic - it's my understanding that its better to do this on the offside (unless there is a lane clear to ride in). Drivers may not expect cyclists - but they should be more aware of riders (motor and push bike) coming past them. I'd only pass on the nearside if there was a wide enough space to ride comfortably down it and even then it would need to be with the utmost caution when coming to junctions as vehicles do turn left - and are likely do so without checking behind or alongside them.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    heneghj wrote:
    haha hes a claims advisor. what do you think?

    You should go for it then.

    Look, I am not looking for an argument either, but I just feel you were in the wrong and should feel a/ lucky to be unhurt b/ lucky she has not made a claim.
    There is no way a car could see a bike on the outside of a van until the car had pulled out in front of the bike.

    If someone had done what you did in a car and hit a bike, the consequences do not bear thinking about.

    I could have got it all wrong/be wrong, but as a car driver, cyclist and father, I feel it only right that I give my opinions to a question asked on a forum.
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Slowbike wrote:
    I'd say it's 50/50 at best ...

    The driver coming out from the left trying to turn right probably couldn't see beyond the vehicle that let her out. She was also possibly trying to see what was coming from her left to see if it was safe to proceed. She wouldn't necessarily have expected a cyclist to be overtaking the queuing cars ...

    You were overtaking - you must be vigilant whilst doing this - you're not in your own lane.

    As for which side to pass queuing traffic - it's my understanding that its better to do this on the offside (unless there is a lane clear to ride in). Drivers may not expect cyclists - but they should be more aware of riders (motor and push bike) coming past them. I'd only pass on the nearside if there was a wide enough space to ride comfortably down it and even then it would need to be with the utmost caution when coming to junctions as vehicles do turn left - and are likely do so without checking behind or alongside them.

    Kinda agree with this.

    Hard to tell with knowing which road junction & approach you and the car driver were taking but your overtake was not a safe one in the eyes of the highway code & the car drivers moving onto the main road would not safe as the driver clearly did not check properly that it was safe to pull out.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • Raffles
    Raffles Posts: 1,137
    you can always spot a solicitor, they are the ones running after ambulances with a legal aid application form in their back pocket , not a care in the world that everybody else pays with higher insurance premiums for deadbeat litigation that gets thrown out of court. so long as they get their costs all is well in their world :roll:
    2012 Cannondale CAAD 8 105
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Danlikesbikes wrote:

    Hard to tell with knowing which road junction & approach you and the car driver were taking but your overtake was not a safe one in the eyes of the highway code & the car drivers moving onto the main road would not safe as the driver clearly did not check properly that it was safe to pull out.

    Dan, are you saying that its possible to always check for a bike overtaking a van/4x4/lorry when pulling out in front of it?

    I try to always look in my mirror when letting someone out of a junction as I know they have no chance of seeing a bike shooting up the outside.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Unless you can see around corners your bonnet is going to be in front of the cyclist before you can see them I would have thought.
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Carbonator wrote:
    Danlikesbikes wrote:

    Hard to tell with knowing which road junction & approach you and the car driver were taking but your overtake was not a safe one in the eyes of the highway code & the car drivers moving onto the main road would not safe as the driver clearly did not check properly that it was safe to pull out.

    Dan, are you saying that its possible to always check for a bike overtaking a van/4x4/lorry when pulling out in front of it?

    I try always look in my mirror when letting someone out of a junction as I know they have no chance of seeing a bike shooting up the outside.

    No what I am saying is that its hard to tell without all the facts.

    From what the OP has said he was overtaking and the car driver was coming up the road and entering from a junction. What I don't know is if that junction was on the left and would be obscured by the traffic that the OP was overtaking in which case the car driver should have really been checking and looking to make sure if was clear.

    Or if the junction was on the right and therefore the driver should have had a clearer line of sight to their right to check for oncoming traffic & to the left, the way they were going as they clearly never checked this as there could easily have been other pedestrian traffic crossing the road or in this case a cycle coming down whether in the right place or the wrong place.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    My head hurts now.
    I thought it was simply a bike overtaking a line of cars with a break in the line where the woman pulled out doing a right turn?
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Danlikesbikes wrote:

    From what the OP has said he was overtaking and the car driver was coming up the road and entering from a junction. What I don't know is if that junction was on the left and would be obscured by the traffic that the OP was overtaking in which case the car driver should have really been checking and looking to make sure if was clear.

    Not sure what 'up the road' means, but if it were the case that the car was just doing a right out of a side road I do not think its always possible to check for a bike.

    As I said, your bonnet would be in front of the bike before you could see it.

    If there is nothing you can do in such a situation then it can only be the bikes fault surely?
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Carbonator wrote:
    Danlikesbikes wrote:

    From what the OP has said he was overtaking and the car driver was coming up the road and entering from a junction. What I don't know is if that junction was on the left and would be obscured by the traffic that the OP was overtaking in which case the car driver should have really been checking and looking to make sure if was clear.

    Not sure what 'up the road' means, but if that was the case I do not think its always possible to check for a bike.

    As I said, your bonnet would be in front of the bike before you could see it.

    If there is nothing you can do in such a situation it can only be the bikes fault surely?

    Yes sorry my use of up & down is perhaps a bit confusing, was using it as in the rider was going down the road & the car was moving up.

    Like I said its hard to tell without all the facts & being able to see the junction on google other.

    Without a reliable witness statement that either the 'driver pulled out without looking' or 'the driver was on their phone' or the other way 'the cyclist was going to fast'.

    Think assessing fault would be a hard one to prove either way in a court without knowing the full facts. Generally the user on the main road has right of way and anyone pulling out would need to ensure they were safe to do so, but is a fair point that perhaps the bikes overtake was not a sensible one and could be seen as contravening the highway code.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Raffles wrote:
    you can always spot a solicitor, they are the ones running after ambulances with a legal aid application form in their back pocket , not a care in the world that everybody else pays with higher insurance premiums for deadbeat litigation that gets thrown out of court. so long as they get their costs all is well in their world :roll:

    Aimed at me?
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    It sounds like, given that the OP has stated that there was no oncoming traffic, that they should have effectively taken the opposite lane. Rather than riding close to the white line, they should have moved further over to the right to increase visibility/ improve sight lines and also ensure that they were further away from anyone pulling out when they did pull out. Psychologically difficult to do though!

    Somewhat surprised that some people think it is OK to pull out on the basis that if they can't see anything coming then it will be safe! If you are pulling out to turn right infront of a stationary vehicle to your right ,which is obstructing your view, then I'd say that you should be inching out extremely slowly to make sure that you don't catch anyone coming up on the outside. There is an odd mentality developing that it is OK to drive even if you can't see where you are going (eg the scenario where someone driving directly into the sun hits a cyclist). It is surely the car driver who is primarily at fault here; even if a driver might think a cyclist would only filter up the inside, motorcycles are always filtering up on the right.
    Faster than a tent.......
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Danlikesbikes wrote:
    Carbonator wrote:
    Danlikesbikes wrote:

    From what the OP has said he was overtaking and the car driver was coming up the road and entering from a junction. What I don't know is if that junction was on the left and would be obscured by the traffic that the OP was overtaking in which case the car driver should have really been checking and looking to make sure if was clear.

    Not sure what 'up the road' means, but if that was the case I do not think its always possible to check for a bike.

    As I said, your bonnet would be in front of the bike before you could see it.

    If there is nothing you can do in such a situation it can only be the bikes fault surely?

    Yes sorry my use of up & down is perhaps a bit confusing, was using it as in the rider was going down the road & the car was moving up.

    Like I said its hard to tell without all the facts & being able to see the junction on google other.

    Without a reliable witness statement that either the 'driver pulled out without looking' or 'the driver was on their phone' or the other way 'the cyclist was going to fast'.

    Think assessing fault would be a hard one to prove either way in a court without knowing the full facts. Generally the user on the main road has right of way and anyone pulling out would need to ensure they were safe to do so, but is a fair point that perhaps the bikes overtake was not a sensible one and could be seen as contravening the highway code.


    How about forgetting about any facts and making a scenario up.

    So, single carriageway, one lane in each direction. Convoy of BT transits in slow moving traffic. One with two burly engineers in stops to let a fit milf out of side road to do a right turn. Lady pulls out at reasonable speed, thanks ogling guys and looks left to check road is clear, as it is she continues forward, and bang, cyclist was overtaking van at 30mph, hit her wing and flew over her bonnet.
    How was she supposed to have known the cyclist was there?
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Carbonator wrote:

    How about forgetting about any facts and making a scenario up.

    So, single carriageway, one lane in each direction. Convoy of BT transits in slow moving traffic. One with two burly engineers in stops to let a fit milf out of side road to do a right turn. Lady pulls out at reasonable speed, thanks ogling guys and looks left to check road is clear, as it is she continues forward, and bang, cyclist was overtaking van at 30mph, hit her wing and flew over her bonnet.
    How was she supposed to have known the cyclist was there?

    I guess the short answer is she would not have known if she couldn't see the cyclists? As for whether the pulling out safe or who was to blame think that @Rolf F makes a good point
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • heneghj
    heneghj Posts: 29
    in a quick response firstly who says I was doing 20 mph I was probably doing about 10-12 tops. Secondly the car at the junction was not a van, however I admit the view was somewhat obstructed.

    either way im not claiming and hopefully neither will she but
  • Raffles
    Raffles Posts: 1,137
    Danlikesbikes wrote:
    Raffles wrote:
    you can always spot a solicitor, they are the ones running after ambulances with a legal aid application form in their back pocket , not a care in the world that everybody else pays with higher insurance premiums for deadbeat litigation that gets thrown out of court. so long as they get their costs all is well in their world :roll:

    Aimed at me?


    Nope, I dont know what you do for a living Dan .

    With the focus on legal aid these days and efforts to vastly reduce the pot it comes from, there will be solicitors and counsel who bleed it dry quivering in their boots. So many pathetic cases hurled outta court without defense evidence even being heard and the ones laughing all the way to the cashpot are the solicitors who knowingly took it on and simply claim their costs for attending court in the knowledge its going to be over real quick.
    2012 Cannondale CAAD 8 105
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Over taking stationary/slow moving traffic on the outside of the lane that traffic is in on a bike is avant-garde, and as Planet Patrol once sang its a game you ' Play At Your Own Risk' if you are on a bike ;-)
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    heneghj wrote:
    in a quick response firstly who says I was doing 20 mph I was probably doing about 10-12 tops. Secondly the car at the junction was not a van, however I admit the view was somewhat obstructed.

    either way im not claiming and hopefully neither will she but

    Don't think anyone was suggesting anything with your speed?

    If you are concerned with the car driver possibly making a claim then you could always report it to the police so its done now. Then if in 2 months time you get a letter through the post from her solicitors at least you have reported it up front. As you said your brother is a claims handler so would have a chat with him about what your best to do if not making a claim but to protect yourself if someone claims from you, use his knowledge not some chaps/girls on the internet.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    heneghj wrote:
    in a quick response firstly who says I was doing 20 mph I was probably doing about 10-12 tops. Secondly the car at the junction was not a van, however I admit the view was somewhat obstructed.

    either way im not claiming and hopefully neither will she but

    Did you not read this bit of that post............."How about forgetting about any facts and making a scenario up" ?
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Raffles wrote:

    Nope, I dont know what you do for a living Dan .

    With the focus on legal aid these days and efforts to vastly reduce the pot it comes from, there will be solicitors and counsel who bleed it dry quivering in their boots. So many pathetic cases hurled outta court without defense evidence even being heard and the ones laughing all the way to the cashpot are the solicitors who knowingly took it on and simply claim their costs for attending court in the knowledge its going to be over real quick.

    I do agree with your statement above and the previous one - think I made as similar comment about out country becoming more litigious and ultimately we all end up paying for it in increased premiums & payments to councils to cover the costs.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • cookeeemonster
    cookeeemonster Posts: 1,991
    wow it seems 100% of motorcyclists (and some cyclists) are riding illegallly each day every day and that it's ok to drive a car without looking where you are going...or something.

    Love these threads :)
  • cookeeemonster
    cookeeemonster Posts: 1,991
    ps I was involved in an accident a few years back while on a motorbike - very similar circumstances (though the car was coming from a side road not a layby) and basically I made a claim and won.

    Thankfully I had a witness and ever since I've rode extra defensively (or just defensively) when passing slow moving or stationary traffic. Basically keep your speed down, watch for gaps in traffic and in buildings (as this indicates there may be a side road) and be prepared to brake

Categories