caught a coach doing this...

ricky1980

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oypA2NGFDJQ

Crouching Peeky

I am no defender of coach drivers. Personally thing coaches should be banned from central London, but no sympathy for the cyclist on this occasion. Goes through a red light on the wrong side of the road. Idiots like him give the rest of us a bad name

Phil_D

Not near enough if you ask me

Headhuunter

Crouching Peeky wrote:

I am no defender of coach drivers. Personally thing coaches should be banned from central London, but no sympathy for the cyclist on this occasion. Goes through a red light on the wrong side of the road. Idiots like him give the rest of us a bad name

Huh? You're comparing a cyclist and bike weighing about 80-100kg, a danger pretty much only to himself jumping a red light with an enormous, 100 odd tonne coach jumping a red and turning right across a junction?! I never understand this dogged focus on cyclists jumping reds on this site... There are far, far bigger things to worry about which this clip proves....

Long_Time_Lurker

I'm with CP on this one.
The dogged focus on RLJs is because on this site we like to assume that we are all law-abiding citizens who follow the highway code. Yet we are tarred with the same brush as the idiot commuters and BSO riders who show no common-sense when riding their bikes. It makes us angry when these people are used as examples as to why we should be legally required to have compulsory bike tests, insurance and bike identity plates.

And you won't be able to use that evidence objectively when you have cyclists doing something wrong too.
I know what you are saying (and you are right), but a bike-hating motorist will watch that video and immediately spot the cyclist going the wrong way dwon the road, 10 seconds before the coach even makes an appearance.

danlikesbikes

Long Time Lurker wrote:

I'm with CP on this one.
The dogged focus on RLJs is because on this site we like to assume that we are all law-abiding citizens who follow the highway code. Yet we are tarred with the same brush as the idiot commuters and BSO riders who show no common-sense when riding their bikes. It makes us angry when these people are used as examples as to why we should be legally required to have compulsory bike tests, insurance and bike identity plates.

And you won't be able to use that evidence objectively when you have cyclists doing something wrong too.
I know what you are saying (and you are right), but a bike-hating motorist will watch that video and immediately spot the cyclist going the wrong way dwon the road, 10 seconds before the coach even makes an appearance.

Was going to comment it myself as I saw it and though DOH. BTW I'm a cycling loving person for reference.

Kieran_Burns

Long Time Lurker wrote:

I'm with CP on this one.
The dogged focus on RLJs is because on this site we like to assume that we are all law-abiding citizens who follow the highway code. Yet we are tarred with the same brush as the idiot commuters and BSO riders who show no common-sense when riding their bikes. It makes us angry when these people are used as examples as to why we should be legally required to have compulsory bike tests, insurance and bike identity plates.

And you won't be able to use that evidence objectively when you have cyclists doing something wrong too.
I know what you are saying (and you are right), but a bike-hating motorist will watch that video and immediately spot the cyclist going the wrong way dwon the road, 10 seconds before the coach even makes an appearance.

All I saw was a RLJ idiot going the wrong way down the road and a bus pull out after he was over the line when the light was on greem

Headhuunter

Danlikesbikes wrote:

Long Time Lurker wrote:

I'm with CP on this one.
The dogged focus on RLJs is because on this site we like to assume that we are all law-abiding citizens who follow the highway code. Yet we are tarred with the same brush as the idiot commuters and BSO riders who show no common-sense when riding their bikes. It makes us angry when these people are used as examples as to why we should be legally required to have compulsory bike tests, insurance and bike identity plates.

And you won't be able to use that evidence objectively when you have cyclists doing something wrong too.
I know what you are saying (and you are right), but a bike-hating motorist will watch that video and immediately spot the cyclist going the wrong way dwon the road, 10 seconds before the coach even makes an appearance.

Was going to comment it myself as I saw it and though DOH. BTW I'm a cycling loving person for reference.

This is another thing I don't get. Why we feel that as cyclists we are all somehow responsible for each others actions and somehow it's our problem that we as some kind of homogeneous bunch should accept that others, be they pedestrians or motorists can judge us all by the actions of 1 cyclist!

No one judges all pedestrians by the actions of 1, nor do we somehow assume that all motorists speed, all motorists use mob phones or drink drive based on the actions of 1 driver or something we read in the paper, yet somehow it's OK for others to judge me based on what they saw some other guy on a bike further up the road doing...

We are all individuals on bikes not some kind of happy family all responsible for each other. It's the idiot motorists problem that s/he judges an entire class of road users based on 1 event, not mine...

We need to focus on the greatest danger on the road (like coaches going through red lights) not on the fact that some idiot in a car will victimise all cyclists based on some stereotypical view based on something s/he has read or seen once upon a time.

danlikesbikes

Headhuunter wrote:

This is another thing I don't get. Why we feel that as cyclists we are all somehow responsible for each others actions and somehow it's our problem that we as some kind of homogeneous bunch should accept that others, be they pedestrians or motorists can judge us all by the actions of 1 cyclist!

No one judges all pedestrians by the actions of 1, nor do we somehow assume that all motorists speed, all motorists use mob phones or drink drive based on the actions of 1 driver or something we read in the paper, yet somehow it's OK for others to judge me based on what they saw some other guy on a bike further up the road doing...

We are all individuals on bikes not some kind of happy family all responsible for each other. It's the idiot motorists problem that s/he judges an entire class of road users based on 1 event, not mine...

We need to focus on the greatest danger on the road (like coaches going through red lights) not on the fact that some idiot in a car will victimise all cyclists based on some stereotypical view based on something s/he has read or seen once upon a time.

Sorry but I disagree with you.

If the clip had shown a vehicle jumping the lights & going over the crossing at speed I would feel differently. However this clip specifically stands out to me as one vehicle user (the coach driver) possibly jumping the lights but we cant see if they were on a filter right green turn or not, plus another road user (the cyclist) going down the wrong side of the road with no reason & jumping the lights.

In terms of that cyclists safety I would feel awful, genuinely, if they were knocked off in that clip. But its on Youtube and will probably been taken as a clip used by the Daily Mail to highlight "rouge cyclists ignore the laws" or whatever they would choose as their headline.

I would not say that a motorist was an idiot to class cyclists based on 1 persons actions if it were in fact a very prevalent issue with cyclists. After all if cyclists were not RLJ and it was not common people would not really talk about it all that often so it must be happening as a common occurrence. Just looking the in rest of the commuting section for similar posts.

I'm not an idealist suggesting that all other forms of road users a innocent and we cyclists get an unfair image, but we do not help ourselves when we allow this to happen. I have often seen cyclists wizz past me whilst waiting on my bike at a junction then go up the inside of a stationary car and pull along side or sit in their blind spot, the lights go green and the car moves forward in a STRAIGHT line and the cyclists is banging on the car drivers window that the car driver is trying to kill them. Not going to defend either of the road users as the car should of course check their mirrors before pulling off, but the cyclist is hardly helping themselves either by their road actions.

ricky1980

The cyclist I circled that nearly got hit wearing yellow was not RLJ nor was he on the wrong side of the road. He went when our light went green. the dark cladded cyclist was half way into the junction while the lights were still on amber.

Headhuunter

Danlikesbikes wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

This is another thing I don't get. Why we feel that as cyclists we are all somehow responsible for each others actions and somehow it's our problem that we as some kind of homogeneous bunch should accept that others, be they pedestrians or motorists can judge us all by the actions of 1 cyclist!

No one judges all pedestrians by the actions of 1, nor do we somehow assume that all motorists speed, all motorists use mob phones or drink drive based on the actions of 1 driver or something we read in the paper, yet somehow it's OK for others to judge me based on what they saw some other guy on a bike further up the road doing...

We are all individuals on bikes not some kind of happy family all responsible for each other. It's the idiot motorists problem that s/he judges an entire class of road users based on 1 event, not mine...

We need to focus on the greatest danger on the road (like coaches going through red lights) not on the fact that some idiot in a car will victimise all cyclists based on some stereotypical view based on something s/he has read or seen once upon a time.

Sorry but I disagree with you.

If the clip had shown a vehicle jumping the lights & going over the crossing at speed I would feel differently. However this clip specifically stands out to me as one vehicle user (the coach driver) possibly jumping the lights but we cant see if they were on a filter right green turn or not, plus another road user (the cyclist) going down the wrong side of the road with no reason & jumping the lights.

In terms of that cyclists safety I would feel awful, genuinely, if they were knocked off in that clip. But its on Youtube and will probably been taken as a clip used by the Daily Mail to highlight "rouge cyclists ignore the laws" or whatever they would choose as their headline.

I would not say that a motorist was an idiot to class cyclists based on 1 persons actions if it were in fact a very prevalent issue with cyclists. After all if cyclists were not RLJ and it was not common people would not really talk about it all that often so it must be happening as a common occurrence. Just looking the in rest of the commuting section for similar posts.

I'm not an idealist suggesting that all other forms of road users a innocent and we cyclists get an unfair image, but we do not help ourselves when we allow this to happen. I have often seen cyclists wizz past me whilst waiting on my bike at a junction then go up the inside of a stationary car and pull along side or sit in their blind spot, the lights go green and the car moves forward in a STRAIGHT line and the cyclists is banging on the car drivers window that the car driver is trying to kill them. Not going to defend either of the road users as the car should have course check their mirrors before pulling off, but the cyclist is hardly helping themselves either by their road actions.

So your view is that all cyclists RLJ and you base this on the fact that people talk about it so it must be true?! I find that very strange to start with, however this isn't a discussion about RLJ-ing, it's a discussion about whether I as a cyclist should be grouped with all other cyclists and regarded as responsible for all other cyclists' behaviour.

What you have seen other cyclists do is not a basis for motorists and other road users to form some kind of stereotypical, prejudiced view on what YOU do and treat you accordingly! When you see some idiot in a tarted up VW hatchback speed down an urban road, do you say to yourself "bloody motorists, they all speed"? Of course not, you know that this is 1 young guy in his car and not representative of ALL drivers. If you were driving and you saw some guy in the next car on his mobile would you feel guilt and responsibility for his actions? No! So why as soon as I get on my bike am I somehow responsible for other cyclists' behaviour and it becomes somehow permissible that other road users should be allowed to judge me as a bad road user simply because they saw some guy on a bike jump a red the day before?

danlikesbikes

Headhuunter wrote:

So your view is that all cyclists RLJ and you base this on the fact that people talk about it so it must be true?! I find that very strange to start with, however this isn't a discussion about RLJ-ing, it's a discussion about whether I as a cyclist should be grouped with all other cyclists and regarded as responsible for all other cyclists' behaviour.

What you have seen other cyclists do is not a basis for motorists and other road users to form some kind of stereotypical, prejudiced view on what YOU do and treat you accordingly! When you see some idiot in a tarted up VW hatchback speed down an urban road, do you say to yourself "bloody motorists, they all speed"? Of course not, you know that this is 1 young guy in his car and not representative of ALL drivers. If you were driving and you saw some guy in the next car on his mobile would you feel guilt and responsibility for his actions? No! So why as soon as I get on my bike am I somehow responsible for other cyclists' behaviour and it becomes somehow permissible that other road users should be allowed to judge me as a bad road user simply because they saw some guy on a bike jump a red the day before?

I think you perhaps need to reread my post, take a deep breath & consider it a bit more.

I said that if cyclists (not all cyclist) were not RLJ'ing then it would not be as bigger issue as it is, there is no smoke without fire in this world & if a vast number of cyclists were not breaking this laws then the rest of us (you & me included) would not be tarred with the generalised image that a lot of people have.

Sorry if I did not make myself clear enough but I did not say ALL cyclists & therefore my statement is hardly strange.

Unfortunately you live in a world where people do make generalist comments about all walks of society, some of them based on fact & some based on pure fiction. However I think you perhaps need to calm down a little as despite you thinking that we are not all this together we are. There is no requirement for a cycling test, insurance, MOT or road tax license. Which unfortunately means that a small number of cyclists some nice & some not will ride their bikes in a poor fashion and give the rest of us the majority of cyclists a poor name.

Unfortunately your example of a tarted up VW was a poor one, as people do not think oh look all car drivers speed, but I bet they would form that image of all drivers with tarted up vehicles. As they would with white van drivers, sales reps, learner drivers, motor cyclists, HGV drivers & I'm sure as a grown up you can imagine the type of stereo type image they would conclude based on those sectors of car drivers. Whether they are true or not is another thing but you can't police peoples thoughts of a few drivers from one section causing their image to be tainted for the whole of that group.

I am not asking you to be responsible for other cyclists behaviour & didn't think that I was.

If I saw someone on a mobile phone of course I would not feel his guilt (as I am not guilty of that crime myself) but if I & he were both in reps cars (Audi/BMW) I would feel it a fair conclusion that other motorists might cast such aspersions on me based on another group.

I think perhaps you have a bit of a bee in your bonnet over other road users casting aspersions on you based on other cyclists behaviour & I do feel for you as it is a common criticism raised by others, but that just reinforces my point its not about how good you or I are in how we ride there are number of other cyclist that do us no justice. Do nothing about it, or do something about it thats your choice & I have no issues with which option you take.

Headhuunter

Danlikesbikes wrote:

I think you perhaps need to reread my post, take a deep breath & consider it a bit more.

I said that if cyclists (not all cyclist) were not RLJ'ing then it would not be as bigger issue as it is, there is no smoke without fire in this world & if a vast number of cyclists were not breaking this laws then the rest of us (you & me included) would not be tarred with the generalised image that a lot of people have.

Sorry if I did not make myself clear enough but I did not say ALL cyclists & therefore my statement is hardly strange.

It still appears a strange comment to me... Very assumptive, you say "IF cyclists were not RLJing...." it would not be an issue and "no smoke without fire" etc etc, so you're going along with the general stereotype that everyone else goes along with not based on facts and figures but based on a kind of "oh well, if everyone's talking about it then it must be happening" kind of attitude... How do you really know that this is a problem and not just a generlisation or stereotype perpetuated by the media etc?

Danlikesbikes wrote:

Unfortunately you live in a world where people do make generalist comments about all walks of society, some of them based on fact & some based on pure fiction. However I think you perhaps need to calm down a little as despite you thinking that we are not all this together we are. There is no requirement for a cycling test, insurance, MOT or road tax license. Which unfortunately means that a small number of cyclists some nice & some not will ride their bikes in a poor fashion and give the rest of us the majority of cyclists a poor name.

Again a bizarre comment, "there is no requirement for a cycling test, insurance, MOT or road tax license"..."means that a small number of cyclists....give the rest of us...a poor name".... So you're assuming that if cyclists were taxed (BTW road tax doesn't exist and is not a right to the road as we have outlined and discussed on this forum many, many times), insured and MOTed they would somehow be safer? Motorists do all these things and still manage to kill and injure around 4000 people on the UK's roads every year!

Danlikesbikes wrote:

Unfortunately your example of a tarted up VW was a poor one, as people do not think oh look all car drivers speed, but I bet they would form that image of all drivers with tarted up vehicles. As they would with white van drivers, sales reps, learner drivers, motor cyclists, HGV drivers & I'm sure as a grown up you can imagine the type of stereo type image they would conclude based on those sectors of car drivers. Whether they are true or not is another thing but you can't police peoples thoughts of a few drivers from one section causing their image to be tainted for the whole of that group.

I am not asking you to be responsible for other cyclists behaviour & didn't think that I was.

If I saw someone on a mobile phone of course I would not feel his guilt (as I am not guilty of that crime myself) but if I & he were both in reps cars (Audi/BMW) I would feel it a fair conclusion that other motorists might cast such aspersions on me based on another group.

I think perhaps you have a bit of a bee in your bonnet over other road users casting aspersions on you based on other cyclists behaviour & I do feel for you as it is a common criticism raised by others, but that just reinforces my point its not about how good you or I are in how we ride there are number of other cyclist that do us no justice. Do nothing about it, or do something about it thats your choice & I have no issues with which option you take.

I take your point about generalisations about specific motorist road users like white van men or youngsters in jumped up small cars but I still don't think this makes us as cyclists somehow responsible for our collective behaviour and somehow permits a general view that all or most cyclists jump reds and that it is somehow acceptable for motorists to be aggressive towards cyclists simply based on something they believe is true but in fact have not seen any proper evidence of.

I don't see why I as a cyclists should have a view or have to get up on my high horse about other cyclists' behaviour or somehow feel that motorists behaviour towards me is forgivable based on some perception of how I may or may not behave...

danlikesbikes

Headhuunter wrote:

(1)It still appears a strange comment to me... Very assumptive, you say "IF cyclists were not RLJing...." it would not be an issue and "no smoke without fire" etc etc, so you're going along with the general stereotype that everyone else goes along with not based on facts and figures but based on a kind of "oh well, if everyone's talking about it then it must be happening" kind of attitude... How do you really know that this is a problem and not just a generlisation or stereotype perpetuated by the media etc?

(2) Again a bizarre comment, "there is no requirement for a cycling test, insurance, MOT or road tax license"..."means that a small number of cyclists....give the rest of us...a poor name".... So you're assuming that if cyclists were taxed (BTW road tax doesn't exist and is not a right to the road as we have outlined and discussed on this forum many, many times), insured and MOTed they would somehow be safer? Motorists do all these things and still manage to kill and injure around 4000 people on the UK's roads every year!

(3)I take your point about generalisations about specific motorist road users like white van men or youngsters in jumped up small cars but I still don't think this makes us as cyclists somehow responsible for our collective behaviour and somehow permits a general view that all or most cyclists jump reds and that it is somehow acceptable for motorists to be aggressive towards cyclists simply based on something they believe is true but in fact have not seen any proper evidence of.

(4) I don't see why I as a cyclists should have a view or have to get up on my high horse about other cyclists' behaviour or somehow feel that motorists behaviour towards me is forgivable based on some perception of how I may or may not behave...

Sorry I think your perhaps twisting my words somewhat so you can tag on the words 'seems strange to me'

To clarify;

(1) Yes I live in the real world and am going along with the generalisation, but you will also note that I am a cyclist and see a minority of cyclists poor road behaviour as causing others to generalise the majority, so to answer your question I know its a problem as I have seen it with my own eyes.

(2) I not assuming, nor have I suggested that cyclists should undertake any testing or pay any form of tax for using the road, not sue where you get that from but you seem to have done a good job in trying to paraphrase my statement. I think you'll find that road tax does exist, or are you just being pedantic because I didn't call it a road fund licence or whatever we are meant to call it this week and I am fully aware that it is not a right to the road and never suggested that it was.

3) I have never suggested that other motorist should be aggressive to any other road users. Unfortunately people will and do make generalisations about other road users based on a small number whether you agree with it or not, but it happens its called life in a democratic society. I not sure how you can accept a generalisation of one section of road users (non cyclists) but no others (cyclists) but we are all entitled to our own opinion.

(4) Sorry don't know what your point is.

Not trying to be obtuse & happy to debate with anyone but if you answer to my point which has been the same all the way through is "oh that seems strange" then I'm sorry I can't help you anymore.

If you re-read my posts in this threat the common theme is that cyclists are rightly or wrongly generalised against because of a small (we really don't know the exact number) number of cyclists making poor decisions. Nothing more & nothing less.

If you condone, support, or simply have no opinion on these cyclists thats your choice. I do feel for you if you feel you are rightly or wrongly prejudged by car/van/lorry users but we all are.

ricky1980

Danlikesbikes wrote:

I said that if cyclists (not all cyclist) were not RLJ'ing then it would not be as bigger issue as it is, there is no smoke without fire in this world & if a vast number of cyclists were not breaking this laws then the rest of us (you & me included) would not be tarred with the generalised image that a lot of people have.

Dan, not sure if you are discussing this out of the context of the video.

But within the video, the coach driver has zero defence. Almost all of the potential victims in the video did nothing wrong. the coach just simply ignored the red light and the fact that traffic was moving. The driver just thought he was driving the biggest thing on the road and bullied his way through.

The small car I was next to, under normal circumstances, it would have sped off on amber light. It didn't because it was slightly advance of the light and he/she didn't notice the light change. Or the driver was simple slow in reaction, as the audio (which didn't play on youtube) shows the car beep when the coach almost finished the turn. anyway under normal circumstances, the car would have gone, the coach would have appeared in peripherial of one's sight and then into blind spot, and the coach would have T-boned the car.

So even under this circustances, if no one jumps the light, people could have still been hurt by the coach. If all cyclists DO NOT jump lights, cyclists will STILL be KILLED by other road users. The problem isn't with cyclists alone, the onerous is more on car/van/truck/bus/coach drivers as they are in control of something that can KILL.

danlikesbikes

ricky1980 wrote:

Danlikesbikes wrote:

I said that if cyclists (not all cyclist) were not RLJ'ing then it would not be as bigger issue as it is, there is no smoke without fire in this world & if a vast number of cyclists were not breaking this laws then the rest of us (you & me included) would not be tarred with the generalised image that a lot of people have.

Dan, not sure if you are discussing this out of the context of the video.

But within the video, the coach driver has zero defence. Almost all of the potential victims in the video did nothing wrong. the coach just simply ignored the red light and the fact that traffic was moving. The driver just thought he was driving the biggest thing on the road and bullied his way through.

The small car I was next to, under normal circumstances, it would have sped off on amber light. It didn't because it was slightly advance of the light and he/she didn't notice the light change. Or the driver was simple slow in reaction, as the audio (which didn't play on youtube) shows the car beep when the coach almost finished the turn. anyway under normal circumstances, the car would have gone, the coach would have appeared in peripherial of one's sight and then into blind spot, and the coach would have T-boned the car.

So even under this circustances, if no one jumps the light, people could have still been hurt by the coach. If all cyclists DO NOT jump lights, cyclists will STILL be KILLED by other road users. The problem isn't with cyclists alone, the onerous is more on car/van/truck/bus/coach drivers as they are in control of something that can KILL.

Yes my response is out of context to the video totally.

My response to the video was none other that the rider who appeared to RLJ.

Know what you mean about lights we have a few in MK that are pretty poor in terms of length and therefore gets lots of cars jumping or going through V late on amber & others going the other way early.

steve6690

ricky1980 wrote:

The cyclist I circled that nearly got hit wearing yellow was not RLJ nor was he on the wrong side of the road. He went when our light went green. the dark cladded cyclist was half way into the junction while the lights were still on amber.

The coach was nowhere near that cyclist. The camera angle flattens the sense of depth. TBH there isn't much to get het up about in this clip. The motorcyclist needs to get his head out of his arse and take some notice of what's going on around him, and in any case he comes gently to a stop - not an emergency stop.

ricky1980

Danlikesbikes wrote:

Know what you mean about lights we have a few in MK that are pretty poor in terms of length and therefore gets lots of cars jumping or going through V late on amber & others going the other way early.

i know the phasing of that set of lights very well. from one set going to red to another going red & amber, there is a 3 second gap. so basically the coach was sitting on red and decided he wanted to go.

I can see how MK situations are very dangerous even for cars. takes just 1 idiot driver to gun for the light to cause a major accident.

danlikesbikes

ricky1980 wrote:

I can see how MK situations are very dangerous even for cars. takes just 1 idiot driver to gun for the light to cause a major accident.

Thankfully I don't tend to drive the centre section all that often now - but do the 'taxi' duty for my other half & there are a 4 main junctions where you often see people flying across the junctions & one specifically where I have seen 2 motorcyclists knocked off in the last 6 months. Thankfully also the junctions in question have bike paths that are under the roads, sort of off to the side and where the junctions are they are bridges with the cycle path going under them.

Lance Jack

To be honest, it's not the worst driving I have seen. Can't say what was going through the drivers head, did he just mis time the lights and went through on amber/red? There was a lot of cyclists going up the side of him, in front of him, was he waiting for them to clear so he could clear the junction? Did he think, who cares, I am just going to drive through it ? What I thought was good was almost everybody see what was going on and held back, let him carry on and then carried on. It looked like just a normal (though it shouldn't be) day on British roads.

cedargreen

Probably not great driving by the coach but if this is the worst thing you you've seen you need to get out more. The coach is probably foreign (French?) and possibly lost/ confused. It's hardly causing a hazard because 1. it's enormous and 2. it's moving at the speed of continental drift. Just cos the lights are green doesn't mean you don't have to look out for huge slow moving vehicles, and if you can't spot them then maybe driving any sort of vehicle isn't really sensible. The driving that really scares me is the deliberately aggressive, impatient type and this doesn't look like that, so not worth getting too bothered about.

goonz

Not much wrong here apart from the coach taking that turn too late but it was obviously in the queue to get through plus its a foreign driver so taking the piss. The first cyclist takes the piss but everything else is fine.

The coach was no where near hitting that other cyclist, its just the way it looks on camera.

goonz

I nearly got taken out by a coach this morning. I was at the lights whilst they were red taking off my arm warmers and it went green, I was at the side of the road and the coach went by at at least 25-30mph only inches from my helmet!

To me thats much more dangerous than the coach in that video.

asprilla

Does anyone here drive on the continent?

If you do then you'll have seen how Belgians drive. I know the French don't bother pulling them over any more as they wouldn't have time to do anything else.

BigJimmyB

ricky1980 wrote:

The cyclist I circled that nearly got hit wearing yellow was not RLJ nor was he on the wrong side of the road. He went when our light went green. the dark cladded cyclist was half way into the junction while the lights were still on amber.

The coach driver jumped a red and should be in trouble for it, but sorry, if you look closely, the coach was nowhere near as close as you've said.

Not wishing to be pedantic and just for the record, a coach weighs around the 20-30 metric ton mark.