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Wheel Builders/Building

russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
edited April 2013 in MTB workshop & tech
Hi,
I have a nice set of Hope XC hubs i would like building into an XC wheelset. First of all anyone have any recommendations on what rim to go for? I currently run a stans tubeless conversion on my Fulcrums and i would liek to stay tubeless but would be happy to run a tape kit again. I like the look of Crest Rims but would like to weigh up the ulternatives before pushing the order button (any tips on cheapest place to buy them) I have never built a wheel before so may get a proffesional to do it. Does anyone know of someone around the Gloucestershire area thats built rims for them in the past? If so how much do they charge if i supply the parts? Obvioulsy not after an exact quote but some idea would help me decide to go for it and have a set built, or to teach myself how to build a wheel.

In fact are there any amature builders who would do it? I have always bought prebuilt wheels so i am new to this kind of bimbling.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Posts

  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,757
    Just built my own first wheel, crazily it was a doddle, it was easier than trying to true a badly buckled but truable wheel!

    Got it spoked up and then used an old fork (front wheel obviously) with a ruler taped to it to true it up, took about 2 hours in total.
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    did you buy a spoke tension gauge? I would just be scared i ballsed something up. I am pretty good at that sort of stuff normally and maintain/build all my own bikes so fairly technically minded. What i want is a light weight set of XC rims. I have 32 hole Hope XC hubs already built onto some havy rims with some really strong (heavy) stainless spokes. I would like to use the hubs on a much lighter rim/spoke combo so i can build up a decent quality/servicable wheelset but i don't want to have something that weights a to bolted to the bike, just because it says hope on it and matches my bikes colours. So if i do it i want to be confident its worth doing. I have factory standard Fulcrum Red Metal 10's on my Lapierre currently, they are fine for now but i would like to upgrade.

    What Rim's/Spokes would people recommend. Also what tools and books/guides will be needed?
  • mrmonkfingermrmonkfinger Posts: 1,452
    WTB make nice rims, they are tubeless ready like stans. Have a look at the frequency i-19.

    Roger Musson's book is a great reference for wheelbuilding.
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,757
    Russyh wrote:
    did you buy a spoke tension gauge?

    Also what tools and books/guides will be needed?
    No guage, ping with finger, listen with ear!

    Roger Musson's book.....

    And patience, the final truing can't be rushed, it's definately a case of more haste less speed, tweak a little at a time.

    Worst case a decent bike shop will only charge a tenner to final true a basically OK wheel!
  • warpcowwarpcow Posts: 1,448
    Russyh wrote:
    did you buy a spoke tension gauge?

    Also what tools and books/guides will be needed?
    No guage, ping with finger, listen with ear!

    Roger Musson's book.....

    And patience, the final truing can't be rushed, it's definitely a case of more haste less speed, tweak a little at a time.

    Worst case a decent bike shop will only charge a tenner to final true a basically OK wheel!

    100% this. I sat down a few months ago and built my first pair in over 15yrs. No stand or guages, just the frame a ruler, good spoke-key and some cardboard cutout guides (templates are in Musson's book). Scarily simple if you just take it easy. Musson's book is really excellent, and covers far more than most beginners will need but in a way that doesn't make it too advanced: best tip in it for me is that unlaced rims are already pretty round and true, when tensioning the spokes you're just aiming to keep them that way.
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,757
    warpcow wrote:
    best tip in it for me is that unlaced rims are already pretty round and true, when tensioning the spokes you're just aiming to keep them that way.
    This, I got them laced and true with all but zero tension, then just tensioned them up while keeping them true.
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    Cheers guys, i will buya copy of the book and start reading up.

    Anymore recomendations on some light weight 32 ideally tubeless rims suitable for XC riding? i will look into WTB rims.

    Russ
  • OuijaOuija Posts: 1,386
    You don't need a spoke tension meter. Most sets of mountain bike wheels require four completely sets of tension anyway (a different one for each side due to the dishing). And as someone who does own a tension meter, i can tell you that setting each spoke on each of the four sides to the same relative tension won't give you a round or straight wheel. They're only good for pre tensioning the spokes to roughly the correct tension, at which point you'll almost certainly increase the tension on some and decrease the tension on the other spokes on each respective side to get the wheel perfectly circular and perfectly straight.

    Trust me, you'll get the wheels rounder and straighter with a ruler and a set of forks to use as a truing stand.
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    Guys thanks for all the help. I will give it a go!

    So the next question is what spokes/nipples do i buy? Also really good do with some advice as to the best value vs. weight rims to go for!
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,757
    Russyh wrote:
    So the next question is what spokes/nipples do i buy? Also really good do with some advice as to the best value vs. weight rims to go for!
    Brass nipples, stnd length, almost any decent brand.

    That depends on how much you value light weight!
  • mrmonkfingermrmonkfinger Posts: 1,452
    Russyh wrote:
    So the next question is what spokes/nipples do i buy? Also really good do with some advice as to the best value vs. weight rims to go for!

    DT, ACI, or Sapim. All make good spokes. Get double butted spokes, nipples, get standard brass ones.

    Best value vs weight? Ryde Edge 7s, Pacenti TL28, or the WTB frequency, depending on what price you can find them for. Edge 7s probably cheapest but not tubeless ready.


    £32 for the frequency is a good price IMO:

    http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Mode ... elID=83910
  • The RookieThe Rookie Posts: 27,757
    Have some preloved Ryde Edge7 I've just built the front onto the hub, still to do the rear, rim was true, light (375g actual on my scales) and nice and stiff.

    Consider also Sun-ringle EQ21's (CRC have them for circa £35) which are similar weight, neither tubeless ready though.

    Budget?
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    I dont have a budget so to say. But i wouldnt want to spend much more than £100 in total for just the rims. Ideally i would like thm in white (tart) i know. The WTB Frequency rims look good value and seem o match all my spec (other than colour)
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    My mate has a set of these http://www.wiggle.co.uk/stans-no-tubes- ... -hole-rim/
    with hope hubs and he loves them, this is what i had been looking to purchase. But wondered if anyone had any little gems that me as a newbie would of missed?
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    Spoke tension guages are very usefule for ensuring that that the tension variation is low. That is the ideal. Listening by ear unfortuntunatley does not ensure low tension variation. Of course a deent wheel can be built without a tension gauge.

    Stans rims are the obvious choice but I like DT Swiss rims alot (XR350). Ryde rims are quite decent too.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    Do the do those XR350's in white?

    I have bought a copy of Rogers Mussons book, from the short ammount i have read so far it looks great.

    I think i have set myself on Notubes ZTR Crests in white 32h They seem to match my criteria or weight vs value vs strength. if i could get a set of rims for £100 i would buy them now so a little more homework needed on price prior to ordering.

    The next thing to sort will be spokes and nipples, anyone got any links?
  • Monty DogMonty Dog Posts: 20,614
    CRC do bundles of 18 spokes relatively cheap - generally cheaper than buying singly provided they do the right lengths.

    Sdeals.com do ACI double-butted for 20p each if price is the biggest consideration.
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    And I do Sapim Race (silver) for £0.45 each. Lots of spokes to choose from but use double butted. ACI are 2.0/1.7/2.0mm and work but I have fond sometimes they do not sit well in all hub flanges. Sapim Race are 2.0/1.8/2.0 just like the DT Comp and both these spokes are excellent. Also the Sapim will be available in 1mm increments in the lengths you need.

    Measure the ERD of the rim yourself not bease Stan's measrements cannot be trusted but because it will help you decide how to round the predicted spoke lengths. ERD can have a range of acceptable values and depending on where in the range you are will depend on how you round your predicted spoke lengths. Rounding down is generally better than rounding up.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    Thanks for all the help folks.
    I have now bought some rims. Notubes ZTR Olympics weighing in at a mind boggling 350g each.

    I am going to look into all of the above info and order some spokes over the weekend.

    Unless someone wants to offer me a deal on building the wheels up for me?
  • russyhrussyh Posts: 1,375
    Rims have arrived. Will order my spokes tonight i think. Also i guess i am going to need a decent spoke key. I have one of the univeral ones at the moment. What would people recomend for building wheels? I would prefer to do the job with the right tools.
  • Monty DogMonty Dog Posts: 20,614
    Park Tool or Pedros spoke keys are good - anything made from investment cast steel. Ones that engage on 4-sides are best, particularly for high-tensions / alloy nipples as they minimise rounding - but they can be a bit more fiddly to engage
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
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