orange 5

Stu Coops

The reality is that all makes of bikes in this price bracket will have it's critics and it's fans as spending this kind of cash we expect a lot and rightly so but in defence of Orange which i'm not a fan of to be honest purely from a looks point of view but all bikes have there niggles which annoy us in different ways.

I know people who won't buy a cracking bike if the paint job looks awful it's just preference and lets face Orange must be doing something right or they wouldn't be around this long and my mate rides a Five Pro and enjoys telling me my Zesty will snap if I hit a root. Each to his own.

Dirtydog11

Orange may not have done much with their single pivot system but they have modified their frames in other areas to make them lighter and stiffer and they have tweaked geometry and taken on new technology like added guides for dropper posts.

FTFY

supersonic

Very few single pivot bikes are actually made now - as in non linkage driven.

DodgeT

RockmonkeySC wrote:

DodgeT wrote:

These 2 threads are getting nearly as boring as working in orange's design office...

Well dust the cobwebs off your drawing board (I assume you don't have CAD yet) and start designing something more modern

Reply from Orange headquarters
"Thank you for your interest & comments mr Rockmonkey. We have reviewed them and think that they may help to improve our products. We have recently acquired some new fandangled personal computer system which will enable us to move ahead with frame manufacturing technology.
As we like to keep our potential customers informed of our companies dedication to "moving with the times" I have enclosed some photo's showing our current design tools, but one also showing the newly installed equipment. Oh and even one of our customer service department, always good to see who your dealing with
We look forward to many more happy years of creating bikes for you all."

rockmonkeysc

ooh, the Five replacement on that screen looks mega high tech.

toasty

tweaked geometry and taken on new technology like added guides for dropper posts.

Err, yeah about that, the Five got those guides a year before the Trance X. They also swapped to the newer slack head angle 4 years ago now? I'm sure the Trance will get a maxle on the back end next year and you'll be on here marvelling at the heights of technology they're pushing.

I love how you skirted away from "Overdrive 2" steerers and PF30 BBs. Have fun shopping for those!

The Rookie

Orange should team up with Marmite to do a limited 'Marmite' addition - love or loath it.....sheesh!

I seem that rarity that falls into neither camp (Love Marmite though!), I can understand it rides well (or at least those that 'get it' rate it highly), I can understand that their business model means they sell all they make, make enough money and are happy with that, what I can't accept is that they seem to be making little or no effort to buy in some selected frame tubing to save some weight, I reckon there is 300g in the downtube alone with some hydroformed butted tube.

DodgeT

Whatever happens, they're getting a lot of free press, on here at least. No such thing as bad publicity.

andy_welch

The Beginner wrote:

hat I can't accept is that they seem to be making little or no effort to buy in some selected frame tubing to save some weight, I reckon there is 300g in the downtube alone with some hydroformed butted tube.

Not sure it's quite what you are after but I think I read something in the blurb for the new Five29 about new lighter shock mounts and a lighter downtube. Presumably, if they don't start cracking in the wild, the lighter tubes will make it to the Five in due course.

The Rookie

Sounds a step in the right direction at least...not that a 5 is for me anyway (not because it's a 5, but because I'm an XC HT man).

mrmonkfinger

The Beginner wrote:

what I can't accept is that they seem to be making little or no effort to buy in some selected frame tubing to save some weight, I reckon there is 300g in the downtube alone with some hydroformed butted tube.

300g saving, on a 140mm trail bike? you sound like a XC HT kind of man to me...

and you know, this top tube looks suspiciously bendy, could it be hydroformed?




why yes!

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... o-10-36564

chez_m356

mrmonkfinger wrote:

The Beginner wrote:

what I can't accept is that they seem to be making little or no effort to buy in some selected frame tubing to save some weight, I reckon there is 300g in the downtube alone with some hydroformed butted tube.

300g saving, on a 140mm trail bike? you sound like a XC HT kind of man to me...

and you know, this top tube looks suspiciously bendy, could it be hydroformed?




why yes!

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... o-10-36564

hydroform that in halifax did they ?

toasty

They're not hydroformed, they're shaped though. Hydroforming is literally blasting fluid through tubes to shape them, these are panels, folded into shape. It's another silly buzzword to be honest. Even big companies like Niner managed to release top end light boutique frames without hydroforming until last year.



Doesn't seem like there would be a huge amount of benefit welding an aluminium panel into a tube shape, then blasting it full of water pressure. Why not shape it when it's flat? It's a completely irrelevant buzzword in the case of Fives, the flat panels are already butted as well.

Edit: Oh, you did say the top tube, hehe. I was refering more to the downtube remark

The Rookie

Toasty wrote:

Doesn't seem like there would be a huge amount of benefit welding an aluminium panel into a tube shape, then blasting it full of water pressure. Why not shape it when it's flat? It's a completely irrelevant buzzword in the case of Fives, the flat panels are already butted as well.

Because the wleding process used by Orange adds a shed load of weight for no strength, take one seamless butted round tube and hydroform into the current exterior shape - sorted.

mrmonkfinger

chez_m356 wrote:

hydroform that in halifax did they ?

Dunno, but...

http://www.orangebikes.co.uk/bikes/2010/five_s/ wrote:

Reynolds Technology, based in Birmingham, are the company that invented the concept of butted tubes back in 1898, so they know a thing or two about tubing. The Five, ST4 and Alpine 160 all feature custom Reynolds 6061 Hydroformed tubing.

The Beginner wrote:

Because the wleding process used by Orange adds a shed load of weight for no strength

specifically the welding process orange use? or just any kind of welding?

The Rookie

Any non seamless, the weld is always thicker than the sheet welded yet due to the nature of a welded tube adds no (Ok a meaninglessly small amount) of strength over seamless.

Clank

The Beginner wrote:

Any non seamless, the weld is always thicker than the sheet welded yet due to the nature of a welded tube adds no (Ok a meaninglessly small amount) of strength over seamless.

Not entriely true.

Depends largely on 1) welding process and 2) parent materials.

However, Orange use Tig welding - a combination of this and the aluminium alloys used means they need a filler wire to rebalance weld chemistry and to cope with any weld gap. This means a weld thicker than parent. So in this case, you are correct.

...but there are many other examples of parts welded with no increase in material thickness (steel tube for hydroforming, or sheet stock in TWBs being great examples).