Death

jejv

"As soon as I get to the bottom of this, I'll get the next plane."
"Death's at the bottom of everything, Martins. Leave death to the professionals."

"We should have dug deeper than a grave."

"Have you ever seen any of your victims?"
"You know, I never feel comfortable on these sort of things. Victims ? Don't be melodramatic. Look down there. Tell me. Would you really feel any pity if one of those dots stopped moving forever ? If I offered you twenty thousand pounds for every dot that stopped, would you really, old man, tell me to keep my money, or would you calculate how many dots you could afford to spare ?"

"Nobody thinks in terms of human beings. Governments don't. Why should we ? They talk about the people and the proletariat, I talk about the suckers and the mugs - it's the same thing. They have their five-year plans, so have I."
"You used to believe in God."
"Oh, I still do believe in God, old man. I believe in God and Mercy and all that. But the dead are happier dead. They don't miss much here, poor devils."



I'm not, on the whole, in favour of the death penalty. It's a bit too convenient for the agents of the state. If we'd hanged the Guildford Four and the Birmingham Six, or - say - Abdelbaset al-Megrahi, there might have been less interest in discovering what really happened.

But when the officers of a state indulge in mass killing, I'm afraid that only execution is appropriate. The people of Romania needed to know that Mr and Mrs Ceaușescu were dead. The people of Libya needed to know that Muammar Gaddafi was dead.

Today, in Britain, mass killers are free to shop in Waitrose. We give them Knighthoods and Peerages for their services to the state.




On Saturday, on the Today programme, Andrew Burnham said that he passed Professor Sir Brian Jarman's report to the Care Quality Comission (CQC).

Heh. What is this "CQC" of which Andy speaks ?

It was set up under Gordon Brown to replace the Healthcare Commission, the Commission for Social Care Inspection and the Mental Health Act Commission.
Err, with less funding.

The Chief Executive for the CQC was Cynthia Bower, former CEO of West Midlands Strategic Health Authority.
Which, funnily enough, was the SHA for the Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust...

As an exec with some - umm - reputation management issues - she looked like an ideal choice to manage the reputations of others.


Hope this is not too tedious for those who have been paying attention.

For the rest:
- Can't use search engine = Moron.
- Can't be bothered to use search engine = Moron.

ooermissus

I think you're a bit green about how the world works.

Long_Time_Lurker

I think you are misjudging your audience here.
You do realise this is Bike Radar, not the Socialist Worker?

EKE_38BPM

Power to the people!

rolf_f

Long Time Lurker wrote:

I think you are misjudging your audience here.
You do realise this is Bike Radar, not the Socialist Worker?

Yep! Can't be bothered to find the appropropriate forum to post this on = moron
(sorry, it was all a bit too tedious for me to pay attention! )

sketchley

DrLex

Has the OP been deleted?

<insert image of Grim Reaper playing Twister with Bill & Ted here>

jejv

More explicitly bikey angle ?
Always nice to have a story about an individual.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... njury.html

jejv

Sketchley wrote:

Yeah, that seemed to be the general drift of the Health Select Comittee, when it questioned Dame Jo Williams, former CQC chair, about Dame Jo and the CQC's treatment of Kay Sheldon.

dilemna

What a numptee to post such a thread on Bikeradar. Clue is in the name - a cycling forum ........... And they've posted it in Commuting with title "death" which can only mean one thing - another cyclist down .

What a knobber.

Agent57

I thought CQC was close-quarters combat.

dhope

Agent57 wrote:

I thought CQC was closer-quarters combat.

Cammy Quick Combination

gtvlusso

Is the OP accusing Cynthia Bower of being an assassin?

I think that we need more posts like this on bike forums.... :shock:

veronese68

gtvlusso wrote:

Is the OP accusing Cynthia Bower of being an assassin?

I think that we need more posts like this on bike forums.... :shock:

I think he was aiming more for mass murderer than mere assassin.

nicklouse

YES?

Monkeypump

It's a bike forum, moron. Although perhaps you mean C2C? I'm sure there are a few threads on here - try the search function.

team47b

"mass killers are free to shop in Waitrose"

Thank you I'll let them know:D

pete_s

dilemna wrote:

What a numptee to post such a thread on Bikeradar. Clue is in the name - a cycling forum ........... And they've posted it in Commuting with title "death" which can only mean one thing - another cyclist down .

What a knobber.

TBF the description for this particular forum is:

Come and join in the banter: discuss here anything you want, whether bike related or not!

MrSweary

team47b wrote:

"mass killers are free to shop in Waitrose"

But for some reason they tend to choose Tesco.. go figure.

jejv

dilemna wrote:

What a numptee to post such a thread on Bikeradar. Clue is in the name - a cycling forum ........... And they've posted it in Commuting with title "death" which can only mean one thing - another cyclist down .

What a knobber.

Sorry to disappoint you, Dilemma.

Perhaps you were expecting a tale of gore under a skip lorry at the Elephant & Castle.

I did post a dead cyclist link. Perhaps you missed it in a cross post.

The Daily Fail article is poor. You can learn more about that death elsewhere.

Love and Kisses,

J.

jejv

Long Time Lurker wrote:

I think you are misjudging your audience here.
You do realise this is Bike Radar, not the Socialist Worker?

Umm, did you read the quotes at the start of my post ?

I don't think I've been labeled as a "Socialist" before. Quite interesting.

Would you care to elaborate ?

jejv

Veronese68 wrote:

gtvlusso wrote:

Is the OP accusing Cynthia Bower of being an assassin?

I think that we need more posts like this on bike forums.... :shock:

I think he was aiming more for mass murderer than mere assassin.

And we haven't even gotten on to the CQC and Care Homes.

But folk like Cynthia Bower and Ian Nicholson are just the monkeys in this story.

Who are the Organ Grinders ?

Stay safe folks.

If you're in hospital over the weekend, make sure you have friends arround. Ask the nurses how much cash the hospital gets for putting you on the Liverpool Care Pathway.

Of course all this only matters if - for some strange reason - you care about those little people who have to rely on private insurance or the NHS for medical care, and can't afford, or more likely are just too spendthrift, to retain decent doctors.

raymondo60

The link to the article about the young lad who was sent home with a damaged spleen is awful. We listen to the reports about what happened in Staffordshire and don't appreciate the real-life tragedy involved.

jejv

Sketchley wrote:

Thing is, that was poor, Chris.

And I expect that you know that. What with you not being an obvious moron n'all.

In another context, Rick said something like "Play the ball, not the man".

What is it that You have to say about the Ball ?

Come on, speak up.

pangolin

msmancunia

jejv wrote:

Veronese68 wrote:

gtvlusso wrote:

Is the OP accusing Cynthia Bower of being an assassin?

I think that we need more posts like this on bike forums.... :shock:

I think he was aiming more for mass murderer than mere assassin.

And we haven't even gotten on to the CQC and Care Homes.

But folk like Cynthia Bower and Ian Nicholson are just the monkeys in this story.

Who are the Organ Grinders ?

Stay safe folks.

If you're in hospital over the weekend, make sure you have friends arround. Ask the nurses how much cash the hospital gets for putting you on the Liverpool Care Pathway.

Of course all this only matters if - for some strange reason - you care about those little people who have to rely on private insurance or the NHS for medical care, and can't afford, or more likely are just too spendthrift, to retain decent doctors.

Don't knock the LCP - thanks to the Daily Mail stirring up hysteria people see it as some kind of callous money-saving euthanasia policy.

My father was put on it, with my consent. It's an end-of-life strategy - designed to make someone's "end-of-life" as easy as possible. It pre-authorises medical staff to give medication to ease the suffering of someone who is dying, whether that's pain control, things to help them swallow, or sedation. My dad was semi-concious, scared and delirious, in dreadful pain, and fighting the inevitable every step of the way. The treatment he received on the LCP stopped him panicking, calmed him down, and took away his pain. I just wish it had been available when I was 23 and had to sit by the side of my mum's bed for almost 36 hours and watch helplessly and terrified as she died a long, slow painful death.

Just because you read something in the Daily (hate) Mail doesn't mean it's true you know.

rjsterry

+1 msm, although thankfully, I've not had any direct experience. Furthermore, comparing the failings of Cynthia Bower, David Nicholson and Mid Staffs NHS Trust, serious as they are, to dictators like Gaddafi and Ceaucescu is just ridiculous.

veronese68

I agree with you both, the first words of sanity on this thread. I don't believe anyone involved with the NHS sets out to kill people and I think the comparisons are insulting to put it mildly.
I've had too many dealings with the NHS for my liking. But I'm still here to tell the tale thanks entirely to the people that looked after me.

jejv

msmancunia wrote:

Don't knock the LCP - thanks to the Daily Mail stirring up hysteria people see it as some kind of callous money-saving euthanasia policy.

My father was put on it, with my consent. It's an end-of-life strategy - designed to make someone's "end-of-life" as easy as possible. It pre-authorises medical staff to give medication to ease the suffering of someone who is dying, whether that's pain control, things to help them swallow, or sedation. My dad was semi-concious, scared and delirious, in dreadful pain, and fighting the inevitable every step of the way. The treatment he received on the LCP stopped him panicking, calmed him down, and took away his pain. I just wish it had been available when I was 23 and had to sit by the side of my mum's bed for almost 36 hours and watch helplessly and terrified as she died a long, slow painful death.

Just because you read something in the Daily (hate) Mail doesn't mean it's true you know.

I have no criticism of the LCP. It seems - to me - to be a carefully thought through approach to palliative care.

In the circumstances you describe, it may well be the best treatment.

The problem is that there have been financial incentives for NHS trusts to implement it.

Which seems - umm - odd. I might naively think that the way to go would be to simply publish the evidence to the clinical experts. Because they're supposed to be used to reading and assessing research papers, and they'd probably act on it if it looked sensible.

The financial incentives look like money for killing people.

And there are other management incentives. If a patient death is coded as palliative care , the death does not count towards published mortality figures.

So there's a double win.

For you, the LCP was with informed consent.


As for suggesting that I read the Daily Fail, I demand satisfaction.

I will meet you in the carpark of your choice within the UK at any time of day or night.

Alternatively, Honour will be satisfied if you can demonstrate a subscription to Private Eye within the next two weeks.


The Daily Fail link I posted was a cowardly response by me to the early posts on this thread. As I said, it is covered better elsewhere.

jejv

rjsterry wrote:

+1 msm, although thankfully, I've not had any direct experience. Furthermore, comparing the failings of Cynthia Bower, Ian Nicholson and Mid Staffs NHS Trust, serious as they are, to dictators like Gaddafi and Ceaucescu is just ridiculous.

Thankyou. (Yes, really).

[I keep thinking Sir David Nicholson is called Ian. Sorry.]

Perhaps David and Cynthia failed to kill so many people simply because they had less power and less time.

Like Harry Lime, they seem to have had little concern for the little people.

What is terrible is not just the bogus statistics - familiar behind the old iron curtain - and the many thousands of unnecessary deaths - but the deliberate and systematic destruction of the lives and careers of those who have sought to make UK healthcare better. And the brutalising effect on less courageous healthcare workers.

David has repeatedly told terminological inexactitudes about gagging Gary Walker to the select comittee, and we have Tory MPs after his scalp. Sadly only metaphorically.

hunt has been making noises about gagging agreements.
But his noises would be more credible if he were to put - say - Ed Jesudason and Stephen Bolsin on the NHS Comissioning Board.

Trouble with the NHS Comissioning Board is it looks a bit like an extra layer of plausible deniability.

msmancunia

jejv wrote:

msmancunia wrote:

Don't knock the LCP - thanks to the Daily Mail stirring up hysteria people see it as some kind of callous money-saving euthanasia policy.

My father was put on it, with my consent. It's an end-of-life strategy - designed to make someone's "end-of-life" as easy as possible. It pre-authorises medical staff to give medication to ease the suffering of someone who is dying, whether that's pain control, things to help them swallow, or sedation. My dad was semi-concious, scared and delirious, in dreadful pain, and fighting the inevitable every step of the way. The treatment he received on the LCP stopped him panicking, calmed him down, and took away his pain. I just wish it had been available when I was 23 and had to sit by the side of my mum's bed for almost 36 hours and watch helplessly and terrified as she died a long, slow painful death.

Just because you read something in the Daily (hate) Mail doesn't mean it's true you know.

I have no criticism of the LCP. It seems - to me - to be a carefully thought through approach to palliative care.

In the circumstances you describe, it may well be the best treatment.

The problem is that there have been financial incentives for NHS trusts to implement it.

Which seems - umm - odd. I might naively think that the way to go would be to simply publish the evidence to the clinical experts. Because they're supposed to be used to reading and assessing research papers, and they'd probably act on it if it looked sensible.

The financial incentives look like money for killing people.

And there are other management incentives. If a patient death is coded as palliative care , the death does not count towards published mortality figures.

So there's a double win.

For you, the LCP was with informed consent.


As for suggesting that I read the Daily Fail, I demand satisfaction.

I will meet you in the carpark of your choice within the UK at any time of day or night.

Alternatively, Honour will be satisfied if you can demonstrate a subscription to Private Eye within the next two weeks.


The Daily Fail link I posted was a cowardly response by me to the early posts on this thread. As I said, it is covered better elsewhere.

Ever thought that those "financial incentives" might actually be payment to the hospital to ensure that there is enough staff who are properly trained in pallative care on duty to cover? Not to mention equipment for washing and bathing, special beds and mattresses to help avoid pressure sores, etc etc?

Don't read Private Eye anymore. New Statesman, Intelligent Life and the Grauniad for me.