Brakes - XT M785 or Formula RX

DodgeT

I want to get rid of the avids on my dh bike and can't decide between the 2 mentioned.
Both are coming out at similar price, so thats not an issue, its purely down to feel / performance.

I know that i'll like the XT's, i've ridden various shimano braked bikes and they always feel spot on. I have the new SLX on my enduro and they're great.

Safe bet would be to go with the XT's, but reviews of the RX's seem to say they're very good too.

My concern is i've ridden 2 bikes with Formula brakes, 1 with RX's and one with R1's and they both felt very wooden, almost like the brake lever was an on / off switch. Whereas the Shimano's always feel very progressive.

But, most reviews i've seen say that the formula's are very progressive / have good modulation, so is it simply a case that the 2 I rode weren't set up very well?

Have I answered my own question and should I go XT, or are the RX's worth a try?

Answers on a postcard please.

EH_Rob

I'd plump for XTs purely on the basis that I have them and they're ace.

Never had Formulas.

stubs

My experience of Formula RXs is that I could never quite stop the pads dragging, nothing wrong with the power just it bugged me the constant weesh weesh weesh. My XTs are silent just as powerful but are heavier than the RX.

On that basis I would say one type is so much better than the other its obvious which to go for.

I would toss a coin

DodgeT

My mate also mentioned about the dragging on his R1's.

hmmm.

Was there much in it weight wise between the 2?

EH_Rob

DodgeT wrote:

My mate also mentioned about the dragging on his R1's.

hmmm.

Was there much in it weight wise between the 2?

Aren't they going on a DH bike? If so, why does this matter?

DodgeT

I've just spent quite a bit of cash on lighter weight but still DH proof parts for my DH bike, so I don't just want to slap something heavy back on it if I don't need to.
Looking at info I can find, doesn't seem to be that much between them anyhow, but would be interested in stubs view as he has had both more importantly.

rockmonkeysc

If it's for a DH bike go for Shimano Zee or Saint. Braking performance is worth far more than a few grammes extra weight. A good brake will allow you to brake later and give you better control for drifting in to turns. They will be more consistent on long, fast runs. Also the Saint / Zee levers are mega strong and there would be nothing more depressing than snapping a lever on the first run of the day when you have paid for a day's uplift. Even DH racers with mega light carbon DH bikes still use Saint brakes rather than XT / XTR so the extra weight can't be a disadvantage.

DodgeT

Funnily enough, just trying to do a deal on a pair of M810's..

rockmonkeysc

Also worth considering Zee. They are virtually identical and only 30 grammes heavier. I got a pair for just under £200.

The Rookie

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Also the Saint / Zee levers are mega strong and there would be nothing more depressing than snapping a lever on the first run of the day when you have paid for a day's uplift. Even DH racers with mega light carbon DH bikes still use Saint brakes rather than XT / XTR so the extra weight can't be a disadvantage.

Aren't the Saint levers the XT body with SLX lever arm? Which would kind of blow that principle....

Agree with Saint or Zee though....if you are on a budget then personally I'd make up a set using
1/ XT servowave levers (M775) which go cheap as chips as lever only on ebay
2/ Zee/Saint 4 pot (not original Saint M800) front caliper for the power
3/ XT (or XTR) rear caliper for the weight with enough power at the rear wheel

If you are happy to mix and match and bleed it you can save a wedge of money over buying complete sets

lawman

Plenty of guys at uni use Xt's, a few on DH bikes and they are proper quick and have zero issues, you'll be fine with xt's and big rotors.

stubs

DodgeT wrote:

My mate also mentioned about the dragging on his R1's.

hmmm.

Was there much in it weight wise between the 2?

Didnt have both brakes at the same time so never did a back to back comparison. The Rx's I got off a mate who had bought a new bike and fitted his Hopes, I only had them for about 4 weeks and about 200 miles before I fitted them onto a build I did for a workmate. About 6 months after I got the XTs and have never regretted it.
Feel I would give to the XT I prefer the levers.
Power I would say the Rx just shade it but that could be pads or discs.
Modulation definitely the XT you never feel like your going lock up.
Noise definitely the XT the Rx scraped and did howl when wet.
Weight Rx they are about 100 gms lighter but the XT wont exactly bend your bars.
Looks the Rx are blingy compared to the understated XT.

Overall 51 to the XT 49 to the Rx it really is a choice between 2 blindingly good brakes. I would pick the cheaper of the 2.

rave81

Go for XT brakes... you won't regret it

supersonic

I'd look at Magura MT4.

ilovedirt

My Formulas were really good brakes, but pretty unreliable. My XTs have been fine so far, but I've only had them since christmas.

mcnultycop

supersonic wrote:

I'd look at Magura MT4.

I love my MT2s; the 4s look better again. Light, too.

DodgeT

After having gear issues at the weekend and never being completely happy with the sram setup, i'm now thinking slightly different.

I'm not the fastest dh rider, so I reckon even the SLX M675 would be fine for me, I have them on my enduro and they're absolutely fine, massive amounts of power.

So, could get a pair of these and then upgrade the X7 / X9 combo up to ZEE as they are a steal at rose.

So for roughly £180 I could have SLX brakes and Zee shifter/mech, as opposed to say £200 for ZEE brakes.

Better option yes/no?

stubs

You wont go wrong with that combo. I am a fan of Shimano so I will say it will be better but having tried X7 and X9 I reckon Shim is better SLX is waay better than X7 and much tougher than X9.

lawman

I agree with Stubs, Shimano everytime for me, just so much smoother, longer lasting and if you buy from ze germans much cheaper too, I outfitted my hardtail with full 1x10 xt-drivetrain minus cranks which I already had for about £150. Newer sram stuff just doesnt seem as well built and doesn't perform or last as well as Shimano, which is a crying shame because XX1 looks like a very good concept, but to hell with paying that much for it to fall apart in a years time

DodgeT

Question re Zee mech..

1 is OK up to 36teeth
1 is OK up to 28teeth

I'm running an 11 - 26 cassette, so both would be fine. Should I just go for the 36t capacity one incase I ever want to swap it onto another bike, or is there a huge reason why I should go for the 28t capacity one. They "look" the same.

Edit to say, bought the DH version,

richtpop

The Rookie wrote:

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Also the Saint / Zee levers are mega strong and there would be nothing more depressing than snapping a lever on the first run of the day when you have paid for a day's uplift. Even DH racers with mega light carbon DH bikes still use Saint brakes rather than XT / XTR so the extra weight can't be a disadvantage.

Aren't the Saint levers the XT body with SLX lever arm? Which would kind of blow that principle....

Agree with Saint or Zee though....if you are on a budget then personally I'd make up a set using
1/ XT servowave levers (M775) which go cheap as chips as lever only on ebay
2/ Zee/Saint 4 pot (not original Saint M800) front caliper for the power
3/ XT (or XTR) rear caliper for the weight with enough power at the rear wheel

If you are happy to mix and match and bleed it you can save a wedge of money over buying complete sets

I have M785 brakes but i am wanting just a bit more power.
can i just buy zee calipers to use with my m785 levers or will i need different hoses and banjo bolts ect.

mark~p

I have only used Formula and Magura, currently a mix of Louise (post 2007) and MT6. The MT is superb but is reflected in its price. The Louise just goes on and with nothing more than pad changes. Been on my current Hybrid for 18,000 miles in all weathers. Also pad type has a huge impact. Using EBC grades, red is awesome for stopping but be prepared to change them. For general use the gold last for ever but will also wear the disk. Green are ok, not so long lasting but don't hit your discs.

cycleclinic

Even Shimano Deore brakes are very good. I have the XTR just because but in reality the XT brakes offer the same level of performance.

Shimano do make the best disc brake sytems for road/CX or MTB bar none and nothing wrong with mixing and matching.

m_cozzy

I had 2009 xt brakes on my last bike. My latest has formula RX.
My initial reaction was that the RX were as good as the xt power wise, so high praise indeed.
In 4 years I had to do nothing with the xt's apart from new pads.
In 6 months the RX's have needed a bit of fiddling, letting some fluid out to allow new pads to fit & also removing the wheel & squeezing the pads together to adjust/reset lever free play.
However the new xt's look horrible, where as the formulas look really nice. (in my opinion of course)

cooldad

Not really, the new XT are streets ahead of older models, so your Formula are probably a bit sh1t, really.

ryanincontrol

I have both m785 and RX brakes.
Not had any problems with the RX but mainly due to the bike they're fitted with isn't used much.
The m785's on the other hand are the ones that have seen a lot of miles. I've owned them since 2012 and had changed pads twice since. The issues I had with the m785's are a sticky lever and leaking caliper. I must admit after the second pad change I used LHM oil instead of Shimano oil and that's when my problem started. Lesson learnt only use shimano oil as LHM is too viscous for the m785's system.
Maintenance wise, shimano wins as parts are readily available and cheap. Xt lever £23 and caliper £27 at crc.
Mind you the whole system only cost under £60 but I already have jagwire hoses so to me it wasn't necessary.