Campag Ultra-Torque to Power-Torque - Tools

hi.fry

I'm moving from a Ultra-Torque crank (Campag Mirage) to Power-Torque (Campag Veloce). Off with one, on with the other.
The variety of tools on offer is totally confusing - and potentially very expensive. To take off the Ultra it looks like I need and 6 notch bottom bracket tool (e.g. Park Tools BBT4) together with a 10mm long reach hex...
To put on it looks like a 16 notch (Park BBT9) bottom bracket tool and a short 14mm hex...
Total cost £50+. Am I right? Can I do it more easily or cheaply?

nicklouse

the tool for the cups is the same. the BBT4 will do.

http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-hel ... tra-torque

but service time

have a look

http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-hel ... wer-torque

bondurant

I'd stick with UT. But you don't want to hear that!

cycleclinic

To remove the U-T cranks you need a 10mm long reach allen key. To fit P-T you will need a 14mm allen key. To remove the U-T cup and fit the P-T cups you will need a external cup BB tool. The Park one is one of the better ones BBT-9 but the BBT19 for use with a torque wrench is even better. The 6 notch tool BBT-4 you are on about was used on some of the older square taper campag BB's.

To remove P-T you will need a P-T crank puller. Park and Cyclus make them. I think the cyclus tools is the better version but is more expensive. To replace the bearing on P-T you will need a P-T bearing puller for the DS crank. Ideally you will have use a P-T bearing press to fit the bearing but a suitable drift and a crown race setting pipe will do the job.

then again to do the bearing on U-T you need a U-T bearing puller as well. However P-T maybe tool intensive but the Veloce crank is light, low Q-factor, good looking and durable. I like it alot but I like the carbon centaur cranks more so got those instead.

rolf_f

Bondurant wrote:

I'd stick with UT. But you don't want to hear that!

So would I!! I recently changed the bearings on one of my UT Centaur cranks - bought the Park allen key and extractor which was a bit expensive but is done now. The actual process was quite straightforward. You can knock up extractors by modifying cheap ebay pullers but I don't begrudge the Park ones cost - I don't plan to not use UT so I'll get a few more uses out of the tool no doubt (it's a good reason not to get the really expensive bearings that last forever!).

Coach H

For ease of installation and maintenance I would absolutely stick to U/T

To my mind Campag have produced P/T to drive people into the higher spec chainsets that still use U/T.
Old Spec Veloce U/T on both of my bikes.

hi.fry

Thanks for your responses. All helpful. Tools on order and I shall ignore the stick with U/T comments - too late! New silver machined crank looks nicer, if nothing else in practice.... Thanks again.

rolf_f

Coach H wrote:

For ease of installation and maintenance I would absolutely stick to U/T

To my mind Campag have produced P/T to drive people into the higher spec chainsets that still use U/T.
Old Spec Veloce U/T on both of my bikes.

To be fair, it gives point to the higher spec chainsets. Before PT, the only sensible (ie non bling related) reason not to get Veloce was 11 speed (and that isn't necessarily a reason either!).

gfk_velo

For future reference, Campagnolo themselves now recommend the Cyclus tools for crank and bearing extraction.
At the Main UK Service Centre here at Velotech Cycling Ltd, we use a Facom U.301 flywheel puller, Campagnolo tools UT-FC090 and -095 to pull both alloy and carbon cranks, and VAR tools 13600 and 13700 top pull and refit the bearings.

We have had no problems at all with this combination.

Historically users have had problems with the Park Tool - we have heard of several breaking in use, although we don't of course know if that is *correct* use - a lot of mechanics forget to remove the narrow washer that lives under the head of the 14mm allen bolt from the LH crank before trying the extraction operation - this makes it impossible to correctly pull the crank.

Other users have had problems when using the flywheel pullers other than the Facom one we mention (which was Campagnolo's recommendation until recently) - the Facom puller actually "tightens up" on the crank as the puller is operated, whereas some other pullers, which are not designed to do this, so slip off the back of the crank, usually damaging it in the process.

PowerTorque was introduced to give group differentiation between the entry-level and the more advanced groups, and because it is quicker and more familiar for OEs to assemble at a factory level. It is also slightly simpler and therefore less costly to produce.

mattythemod

Having already got one of the extension plugs has anyone come across a non park Puller for removing the cranks at a more cost effective price ?

Coach H

gfk_velo wrote:

PowerTorque was introduced to give group differentiation between the entry-level and the more advanced groups, and because it is quicker and more familiar for OEs to assemble at a factory level. It is also slightly simpler and therefore less costly to produce.

The other info frm this post is great, thank you, but this is the important section :roll:

cycleclinic

I have to say the Cyclus P-T and U-T tools are so well made (I use them) that when I see the Park tools versions they just don't seem to be as easy to use or as quick. The cyclus tools do the job correctly withot any hassle. Worth the extra money for a shop maybe not for home mechanic. I have yet to try the Facom or Var tools version of these and I am unlikely too as the Cyclus tools work so well.

Thankfully P-T BB bearings do last well so at least replacements are not freqent which make a visit to the LBS (so long as they have the right tools) an viable proposition.

FoldingJoe

gfk_velo wrote:

For future reference, Campagnolo themselves now recommend the Cyclus tools for crank and bearing extraction.
At the Main UK Service Centre here at Velotech Cycling Ltd, we use a Facom U.301 flywheel puller, Campagnolo tools UT-FC090 and -095 to pull both alloy and carbon cranks, and VAR tools 13600 and 13700 top pull and refit the bearings.

We have had no problems at all with this combination.

Historically users have had problems with the Park Tool - we have heard of several breaking in use, although we don't of course know if that is *correct* use - a lot of mechanics forget to remove the narrow washer that lives under the head of the 14mm allen bolt from the LH crank before trying the extraction operation - this makes it impossible to correctly pull the crank.

Other users have had problems when using the flywheel pullers other than the Facom one we mention (which was Campagnolo's recommendation until recently) - the Facom puller actually "tightens up" on the crank as the puller is operated, whereas some other pullers, which are not designed to do this, so slip off the back of the crank, usually damaging it in the process.

PowerTorque was introduced to give group differentiation between the entry-level and the more advanced groups, and because it is quicker and more familiar for OEs to assemble at a factory level. It is also slightly simpler and therefore less costly to produce.

First time I tried to use the Park Tool to remove the non-drive side crank arm the black plastic sleeve that fits over the back of the crankarm shattered into pieces.

I resorted to just putting the toes of the puller directly under the crankarm itself, and that worked, although Holy Cow, was it stiff. I nearly gave up on trying to get the thing off.

After re-fitting and trying to remove a second time I had to resort to tapping (read bashing) the crankarm with a rubber mallet to work it loose.

It certainly isn't as easy, for me at least, as the park tools video makes out.

mattythemod

Love the idea of using a hammer on a brand new carbon crank !!!

FoldingJoe

mattythemod wrote:

Love the idea of using a hammer on a brand new carbon crank !!!

Don't worry, it's only Veloce!!

paul64

Very old thread and useful info but what torque wrench is good for Campag BB cups and UT chainsets as I finally start to change to Campag on all my bikes?