Elixir 3 pad replacement problem

PuttyKnees

I'm trying to replace the pads on my elixir 3s. I've replaced the pads themselves, but I'm having a bit of trouble getting a big enough gap between the pads to get my rotor in! I've pushed the piston as far back as I can by using a flat headed screwdriver, but I just can't get it back far enough to give enough space. Is there an easy solution to this? Pushing harder doesn't seem to be one!

pesky_jones

You may have too much fluid in the hose/caliper. I'm not sure that that is the problem, but it sounds like the pistons have nowhere to go.

If you can bleed them with a spacer in the caliper, or even with the caliper still on the rotor (just make sure the brake lever is pulled in) then this might solve the problem.

I'd wait and get some more opinions from other users before actually doing anything though!

EDIT: I think elixirs are self adjusting, so as long as you get the bleed right (roughly) - they should sort themselves out after a couple of squeezes to the lever

PuttyKnees

Yes, this was my initial thought too. Would a bleed need the bleed kit? Or could I just release a little bit of the fluid inside somehow?

cooldad

If there was space for the old pads when they were new, there's space for the new pads.
Stick a big screwdriver in (leave the pads in) and twist it like a big key so both pistons move at the same time.

pesky_jones

PuttyKnees wrote:

Yes, this was my initial thought too. Would a bleed need the bleed kit? Or could I just release a little bit of the fluid inside somehow?

I think you can release a small amount without a bleed, dont take my word for it though. You would do it just by oepening the bleed port screw on the caliper slightly...

If you were to bleed you would need a kit, but not necessarily Avids. I used this one, which i found brilliant:

http://www.epicbleedsolutions.com/produ ... plete-kit/

I think theres a charge for postage if under 15/16 quid, and the kit is 13 so you might as well buy another bottle of fluid or soemthing, and get postage free. same price in the end, but with an extra bottle of fluid.

PuttyKnees

Thanks for the link to the kit.

cooldad wrote:

If there was space for the old pads when they were new, there's space for the new pads.
Stick a big screwdriver in (leave the pads in) and twist it like a big key so both pistons move at the same time.

I did try this to move it back. One piston is now fully in, but the other still protrudes ~1mm. Giving it extra welly seems to have no effect, or at least doesn't stay where I shoved it.

Chunkers1980

Bleeding/releasing fluid would be a last resort. Push piston back and try and get the pads and disc in and use them

bazza333

Everytime I have fitted the 1st set of replacement pads I have had to release a small amount of fluid. Open the top bleed screw then move the pads apart.

pesky_jones

Pesky Jones wrote:

I'd wait and get some more opinions from other users before actually doing anything though!

Chunkers1980 wrote:

Bleeding/releasing fluid would be a last resort

See

PuttyKnees

Rightio, will try again! Otherwise I'll attempt to release fluid, though that's bound to end in tears.

pesky_jones

PuttyKnees wrote:

Rightio, will try again! Otherwise I'll attempt to release fluid, though that's bound to end in tears.

just be carefull with the bleed port screw - very small

maringirl

Have found a lot of Avid pistons are quite hard to push back for some reason. You need to be very firm with them but careful not to twist the piston or you will get really stuck. If you can hold the 'good' piston in and use the lver to encourage the other one out you can pop a bit of brake fluid onto the sides and then try and push it back in - just lubricates it a bit - sometimes works. But have known them to stick completely!

PuttyKnees

Thanks for all the suggestions. Letting out a smidge of fluid from the rear has allowed me to get the rear in. It drags but I think it will be OK after a bit of riding in. The front I forced in without letting fluid out, but it more than drags and it takes quite an effort to move the wheel, so I might do the same again.

frankspencer1979

Every time I've replaced pads on my elixir 3's, they've ended up needing bleeding, pushing the pistons had no effect.

mrmonkfinger

maybe its time for a bleed, it certainly won't hurt

cooldad

Bleeding is used to remove air from the system. It's not a universal panacea for brake issues. Quite the opposite, often leads to more problems when it's done badly.

cooldad wrote:

If there was space for the old pads when they were new, there's space for the new pads.

pesky_jones

cooldad wrote:

Bleeding is used to remove air from the system. It's not a universal panacea for brake issues. Quite the opposite, often leads to more problems when it's done badly.

cooldad wrote:

If there was space for the old pads when they were new, there's space for the new pads.

I'm pretty sure I had the same problem ages ago. I tried pushing the piston back and it wouldnt go, I tried harder and the piston got stuck fully (probally twisted). I know this was caused by the way I did it, but if i had just released a small amount of fluid (or even gone to the extent of full bleed) I wouldnt of twisted the piston and ended up having to buy a new caliper.

Like i say i know it was my fault the piston jammed, but if the pistons won't go at all -

PuttyKnees wrote:

Pushing harder doesn't seem to be one!

Then theres no point forcing them, release fluid or bleed surely?

pesky_jones

cooldad wrote:

Quite the opposite, often leads to more problems when it's done badly.

What? Surely anything leads to more problems when its done badly?!

cooldad

Because it's done badly really often.
Regularly as an attempt to rectify problems totally unrelated to bleeding.
By people who can't determine what the problem really is, if indeed there is actually a problem.
Urged on by people who suggest bleeding as a cure all.

pesky_jones

Ok but with these brakes (based on both mine and a few others expieriences), letting fluid out or bleeding has more of a chance of sorting the problem then trying to force the stuck piston. I'm not saying this is the only way - just the most likely to sort it.

mrmonkfinger

cooldad wrote:

Bleeding is used to remove air from the system.

And also to put a correct amount of fluid into the system.

Which might be relevant here.

The Rookie

No filling does that.....

Confusing filling and bleeding is EXACTLY what CD was trying to warn about, though thanks for assisiting in his demo....

cooldad

Brake problems?
The solutions:-
Bleed them.
Still not fixed?
Bleed them again.
Still not fixed?
Topic on BR and bleed them again?
Still not fixed?
Flog them on Ebay and buy new ones.

Rinse and repeat. Ad nauseum.

The Rookie

Don't stop that happening CD, it's how I get my brakes cheap!

mrmonkfinger

Confusing filling and bleeding is EXACTLY what CD was trying to warn about, though thanks for assisiting in his demo....

CD said nothing of the sort.

Also, I say again, a correct bleed done on Avids will also ensure system has the correct amount of fluid. During the last step, right before closing the system and replacing bleed screws, with the callipers pistons fully retracted, the reservoir bladder is filled.

lazyarsehole

I have the same problem every time I replace the pads in my Elixir 5's, does my head in!

Occasionally dragging the brake on a lengthy decent sorts it out (no idea how, one decent doesn't take THAT much off of the pads) but most of the time I end up re-bleeding the brakes.

Going to upgrade from the Elixirs soon anyway... getting something with pad bite adjustment for sure!!!