Upgrading a hard tail xc bike with a full suss frame?

stubbo66

I've just about finished building my new 29er hard tail so my 26er is in danger of being mothballed only 18 months after I built it, thing is it's a damn good bike to ride and I've invested a lot in it (full XTR, SID XX 120mm forks, custom wheels using stans arch on DT Swiss 240s hubs).

My initial thoughts were to keep both of them as hard tails and use the 26er on the bigger hillier rides and the 29er for the faster trail rides but it also crossed my mind to upgrade the frame to full suspension and keep everything else as is.

So getting to the point, what available 26" XC Full Suspenion frames are there I could build around a SID XX 120mm front fork (1 1/8" steerer). I prefer not to go Carbon partly for cost reasons and partly as I get my fair share of tumbles and would worry about looking after it properly.

I'd be looking up to and around £1000 and trying to keep the extra weight down as much as possible as the current frame is 4lb so don't want to drive the bikes weight up so much that i can't drag it up the hills any more.

Please impart me with your sage wisdom!

The Rookie

See the link in my sig to the rebuild of the sons HT into an FS.
Likey issues are
Front mech, seatpost/clamp, gear cables and worst (as in most expensive to resolve!) of all brake hoses, otherwise if you pick the right frame then no reason most stuff won't carry over.
As you have 120mm forks you'll be limited to 100/120mm travel frames, new the On-one Titus XC frame is a no brainer and well in budget, that or find a 'pre-loved' one, been very impressed with the sons Scott on a short ride (all he will allow me!)
http://www.on-one.co.uk/i/q/FRTITXRS/ti ... arch_shock - the carbon one is the same price and probably tougher (an aluminium tube will dent long before you'll damage a carbon tube!)

stubbo66

The Titus looks good, prefer the carbon to be honest though getting the size right might be interesting as I ride a medium and I'm at the top end of the sizing on that so need to get that right.

Also need to make sure they take a 135mm qr rear hub, the info on the frames doesn't give enough details so I've dropped them a line.

Noticed the FTM frame as well, has longer travel on the rear and has more scope for a bigger fork later if I wanted it. Might be a bit ott for my xc trail needs though.

Interested to see what other options are out there.

supersonic

Another option is to buy a whole bike! Sounds silly but... they are great value, and you'll always end up a with a bike that will work. Simply swap the bits on that fit, and keep the ones on the bike that you can't replace. Then flog the rest.

£900 bags you this, the price of the frame alone anyway:

http://www.pedalon.co.uk/acatalog/giant-anthem-x3.html

Sub 6lb frame too.

rockmonkeysc

But when you buy a cheap bike just for the frame you do get a rubbish shock. That Anthem would need £300+ spent on a better shock which is probably about all you would get for the un-wanted parts.

stubbo66

Yeah, I'd considered that but I think I'd prefer to get a frame and shock directly as I'd be wasting money on all the other components.

supersonic

Nothing wrong with the shock, one of the most fluid out there, and works well with the Maestro suspension. And you'd easily get more than 300 quid for the fork, wheels and parts. More like 500.

If you go frame only, look up all the specs and compare to what you have. The Titus above is very good value.

oodboo

Specialized epic:
http://www.bikescene.co.uk/Specialized- ... -18-0.html
Over budget but I like them.

oodboo

Santa Cruz superlight:
http://www.bikescene.co.uk/Santa-Cruz-S ... -18-0.html

stubbo66

Ah, some interesting alternative options.

I rode the new 29er Specialized Epic recently at a speccy trial day and liked it, obviously I'm looking for a 26er but it is pushing the budget OTT a little. Am I right in saying that Titus licensed the linkage system from Specialized?

The Santa Cruz is more in my bracket but the cable management looks pretty messy and I've yet to find any websites that actually have them in stock (versus just listing them).

The Titus looks like it would do the job for me, though I have concerns about the RS Monarch RT3 shock. It may pay me to go with this frame and save the money to replace with a better shock down the road if I felt I needed it. This is an XC bike after all so won't get a complete hammering (Wiggle MTB rides are the roughest things I do each year).

The carbon frame has a 5 year warranty as well on the Titus which gives me more confidence in using carbon as well now so that looks a good bet.

Still open to more ideas, I won't buy for a few weeks so will have plenty of time to digest before diving in.

oodboo

That's a 2011 epic frame which is 26". Not sure if you thought otherwise.

stubbo66

Yeah, I realised that, still a little more than I wanted to spen though, but a nice frame none the less.

booyaka

just ordered a Titus FTM Carbon Frame And Monarch Shock myself today.

going from a C456 - basically everything (bar the headset) should just move across to the new frame without too much hassle! (hopefully)

craker

Am following this thread as I need (want) a new bike. There's certainly some feeling on the roadie side of the forum that integrated headsets are a manufacturing benefit that don't bring anything good to those maintaining / riding a bike. That said, can one take a standard 1 1/8" fork and fit it to a frame advertising a tapered / integrated headset? Is it just about buying the right headset?

I think my year 2000 Jamis is a hopeless case when it comes to transferring bits to a new frame. What's with a 73mm bottom bracket anyway? Also new seatpost, new front mech.... I did all this when building myself a new road bike a couple of years ago. I think only the pedals ended up surviving the transfer from my old bike.

supersonic

Yes, are many headsets available to adapt the set up.

68 or 73mm are the two most common MTB BB sizes, loads of options here.

VWsurfbum

Heres a slightly leftfield option
http://www.flyxii.com/products_1.asp?menuid=329&id=1126
and a
http://www.bike-discount.de/shop/a88040 ... =GBP&cn=gb
Makes a very fast light frame set
£225 + £387!!!

stubbo66

The Fox RP23 is almost a given if I get a frame without a shock, must admit I don't know half as much about rear shocks and their variants and capabilities as I do about front shocks but I'll get there.

Don't know the first thing about flyxi, but I would prefer to buy from a uk retailer whatever I go for.

BTW on the question from craker I know for a fact by XTR Trail BB comes with spacers so will fit a 68 or 73mm BB very easily.

Another quick question, while I wait or other clued up readers to come up with other frame suggestions, I know when I buy an alu frame I have to get it taped and faced ready for the BB, is the process the same for a carbon frame. I kind of assumed the threaded area wasn't made from carbon anyway but thought I'd better ask.

VWsurfbum

I've never had to face a BB, i've had more frames ally or otherwise.

stubbo66

I've always had them taped and faced, ensures a perfect BB alignment and no gaps for fluid to get in, but each to their own.

The Rookie

No need to tap them (not tape!).....some frames are square, a carbon frame is more likely to be faced already, but if in doubt get it done.

My daughters frame was a LONG way off square, glad we got that faced!

stubbo66

Lol, always get the spelling wrong on that, taped vs tapped !

stubbo66

So I think I've narrowed down the options I'm comfortable with that I can easily upgrade and keep most of my existing bike.

The Titus X Carbon, still debating whether an rp23 would be a better bet than the monarch.
The Specialized S-Works FSR Epic.

On the epic I'd need to convert my 240s rear hub to 142 X12 which costs about £40, then I'll need to find the right model press fit BB for my XTR cranks. Next I need to find the right model of FSA headset for the frame. Finally I'll need a new seat post as well. So beyond the frame I'm looking at around another £130 or so to get everything hooked up.

On the titus I'd need a new headset and seatpost (I can reuse my XTR BB from my old frame) so looking at an additional £60 roughly with the possible future expense of the rp23 upgrade.

So given the titus all in would cost sub £700 and the Epic will cost roughly £1450 and they will be almost identical weights, how much difference will I really notice between these two.

As much as I could push the boat out for the epic I think I may be better served with the Titus.

Any more sage advice?

stubbo66

I should also qualify this by saying this bike will probably be the lesser used of my two bikes this year as I imagine most of the events I will be doing would benefit from my new hard tail 29er (Kinesis FF29) I've just finished building and this full susser is going to be aimed at the rougher xc rides I'll be doing.

So I may be answering my own question and saying it doesn't warrant the extra expense of the epic but I'd still like to get the best ride I can, especially as there are lots of big hills (and descents) on these events I'll be using it on.

VWsurfbum

Not riden the titus, but that would be my choice, i like my mates epic, but it does nothing for me.
Over the pond they love the Monach shock, so dont write it off just yet.

stubbo66

Yeah, I certainly won't replace the monarch unless it doesn't work well or feel right. It may also depend on which years model it is or whether they would exchange it for an rp23 at the point of sale as well.

I'll mull it over for another week or two before taking the plunge.

stubbo66

Does anyone know what version, size and stroke the Monarch shock is as sold with the titus x carbon frame?

stubbo66

Scratch that, it's the RT3.