When is it too cold (and dangerous) to commute by bike

littleprawn

Morning guys,

When is it too cold to commute by bike with possibility of the dreaded black ice on roads? November has not been a good month for us so far.....

Being in my first winter since I started commuting by bike, my hybrid and roadie both have 35mm tyres and I start off in the morning between 6:30-7am......see the Metcheck link....

http://www.metcheck.com/UK/today.asp?zipcode=ha5

What has been the experience from seasoned winter commuters?

jthef

The dangers for me are ice, snow and wind.
It does not mater too much if its freezing if the roads are dry, but if it's wet and forcast freezing I do drive, same with snow.
I do use the main roads more as they will of been gritted.

antfly

It has rarely been cold enough for ice yet this month, if you check you council website it should tell you if RSTs are cold enough for them to be gritting overnight, if not there should be no ice.

MrChuck

When it's too slippery, basically- bit of a circular answer but a lot depends on where you live and the roads you'd be riding on. Cold in itself shouldn't necessarily stop you (assuming you don't live in the Arctic circle or something)

ugo.santalucia

littleprawn wrote:

Morning guys,

When is it too cold to commute by bike with possibility of the dreaded black ice on roads? November has not been a good month for us so far.....

Being in my first winter since I started commuting by bike, my hybrid and roadie both have 35mm tyres and I start off in the morning between 6:30-7am......see the Metcheck link....

http://www.metcheck.com/UK/today.asp?zipcode=ha5

What has been the experience from seasoned winter commuters?

In London it is quite unusual to have icy roads... you need some rain followed by freezing temperatures, otherwise there isn't enough moisture in the air to build up a layer of black ice. Completely different story in the countryside, where moisture is provided by the green areas around the roads.
If you cycle through a park in London you might find some patches of ice though.

bompington

It's never too cold

edhornby

Met office is your friend.....


This morning the Met Office have issued a Level 2 Alert (alert and readiness) across NW England for the first time this winter. Level 2 is raised when average temperatures fall to or below 2C for at least 48 hours, or when there is an anticipated warning of snow or widespread ice.

In this case it’s the increasing likelihood of overnight frost, combined with rather cold daytime temperatures expected from tomorrow onwards. We are expecting daytime temperatures to reach only around 3 to 4C by the weekend, and night time minimums of minus 1 to minus 5C.

The presence of so much standing water after the recent rains mean that ice may become a real issue in a lot of places by the end of the week. Please be careful when travelling, and plan your journeys carefully.

corshamjim

With a pair of Schwalbe Marathon Winter tyres on, it's never too cold.

http://www.schwalbe.co.uk/spikes/marathon-winter/

BelgianBeerGeek

It's never too cold. Ice can be hazardous, just keep your wits about you. If you go too fast and crash, it's your own fault, much like being in a car.
The only time I'm really not keen on the commute is on compacted snow once the cars have been on it. Makes for a more interesting commute though!

Kieran_Burns

I cycled when it was down to -8 last year. I had a few issues with some bits being too cold but I've sorted out the wardrobe now and that should be done with.

This was on standard 28c Conti top contacts and I only needed the CX tyres for one week when the snow hit. It's a complete country commute and I really never had a problem.

I think the thing to be wary of is being too far from anything in case of a puncture / accident and you get too cold while not moving.

jimmypippa

Kieran_Burns wrote:

I cycled when it was down to -8 last year. I had a few issues with some bits being too cold but I've sorted out the wardrobe now and that should be done with.

This was on standard 28c Conti top contacts and I only needed the CX tyres for one week when the snow hit. It's a complete country commute and I really never had a problem.

I think the thing to be wary of is being too far from anything in case of a puncture / accident and you get too cold while not moving.

Wot he said. See Meanredspider's posts for seriously hardcore commuting in North East Scotland.

I do take a lightweight (Polartec 100-weight) fleece and waterproof trousers for any enforced stops from about November to March. I actually wore the fine down to -14, usually wearing windproofs including a hat, otherwise my head started to hurt. Lip salve also made it more comfortable.

Non membrane windproof* trousers are great for cold and dry; they provide almost no insulation, but stop the wind ripping the heat from your insulation, and are far more breathable than waterproofs.

In my experience round about freezing is the problem - sleet isn't much fun, and the roads are more slippery than when it is far colder.


*i.e. not windstopper fleece etc, which IMO has too much insulation for my taste, and I suspect too good at stopping wind and moisture.

Initialised

I've been on Schwalbe Snow Studs since the first frost so dress for the weather and its never too cold. Also with an MTB and snow/ice tyres the off road paths are still available for when you don't trust the motors not to spin out around you.

littleprawn

Guys,

Thanks for the all the advice !

Did the bike commute this morning, cold but my Aldi jacket :P is doing a sterling job keeping me toasty (with just a baselayer). My commute is urban across London and being stranded would not be too much of an issue to be honest. The problem would be tackling the dreaded 'P' word on the hybrid (no quick release tyres).

I will also think doing a different route where the traffic is heavier to offset any ice which may form overnight should the weather turn nasty!

Hope to continue the commuting by bike still!

bigmonka

I'm generally happy commuting (~8miles each way starting rural then into town) in cold temperatures, but I get really nervous about cycling when it's slippery with frost, ice or snow.
Are studded tyres really that good?
Are they a practical solution to use everyday over winter, on gritted main roads, just in case there's ice?

bompington

BigMonka wrote:

I'm generally happy commuting (~8miles each way starting rural then into town) in cold temperatures, but I get really nervous about cycling when it's slippery with frost, ice or snow.
Are studded tyres really that good?
Are they a practical solution to use everyday over winter, on gritted main roads, just in case there's ice?

Studded tyres really are that good - YMMV but in my experience, studs on pure black ice give roughly the same level of grip as normal tyres on a wet road.
How they run on non-frozen roads depends on the tyre - some are more tarmac-friendly than others: my Nokian A10s, and the Schwalbe snow studs Bomp Jr has for winter on his MTB, have studs only on the shoulders, so if you pump them up hard, the studs don't really touch the ground when you're running straight. Even when they do, the only thing you really notice is a noise like you're riding through rice crispies.
But if you're rarely on ice, you'd have to consider whether you think it's worth paying for studs, never mind any other considerations.

ugo.santalucia

bompington wrote:

BigMonka wrote:

I'm generally happy commuting (~8miles each way starting rural then into town) in cold temperatures, but I get really nervous about cycling when it's slippery with frost, ice or snow.
Are studded tyres really that good?
Are they a practical solution to use everyday over winter, on gritted main roads, just in case there's ice?

Studded tyres really are that good - YMMV but in my experience, studs on pure black ice give roughly the same level of grip as normal tyres on a wet road.
How they run on non-frozen roads depends on the tyre - some are more tarmac-friendly than others: my Nokian A10s, and the Schwalbe snow studs Bomp Jr has for winter on his MTB, have studs only on the shoulders, so if you pump them up hard, the studs don't really touch the ground when you're running straight. Even when they do, the only thing you really notice is a noise like you're riding through rice crispies.
But if you're rarely on ice, you'd have to consider whether you think it's worth paying for studs, never mind any other considerations.

But when you have to run tyres that weigh two pounds each, is it not the case of using public transport for once?

bompington

ugo.santalucia wrote:

But when you have to run tyres that weigh two pounds each, is it not the case of using public transport for once?

Ugo, I know how you feel about wheels and stuff, but as for me, I can handle the 5 minutes extra it takes to get to work.

corshamjim

ugo.santalucia wrote:

But when you have to run tyres that weigh two pounds each, is it not the case of using public transport for once?

You mean that bus packed full of damp depressed dullards with their coughs and sniffles? No thank you!

Initialised

From my point of view Snow Studs are well worth the extra weight.

When floods do this to your bike path



Then it freezes overnight and all those mounds of mud go solid and the puddles turn to ice you can still get through without having to slow down too much.

They wont stop a vehicle from spinning out infront of you or worse into you, but they may be the difference between a slide and an off. Also they open up the off-road routes that generally don't get cleared or gritted so you don't have to be there when the car skids on the snow.

Yes they are hard on the legs, I'm leaving 5 minutes earlier and having to do squats and stretches to stop my legs cramping up from the extra effort as I get used to them again (approx 1.5kg total extra weight). For a pure urban commute Marathon Winters are probably a better bet. And for me a monthly bus pass would cost about as much as a pair of Snow Studs. My current pair are on their third winter so they may seem expensive but they aren't really.

ugo.santalucia

How wide a rim you need to fit the damn things? I suppose an Open Pro won't take them

bompington

ugo.santalucia wrote:

How wide a rim you need to fit the damn things? I suppose an Open Pro won't take them

My Nokian A10s are on bog standard Aksiums.

ugo.santalucia

bompington wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

How wide a rim you need to fit the damn things? I suppose an Open Pro won't take them

My Nokian A10s are on bog standard Aksiums.

Ok, if there is a forecast of snow I will order them, otherwise in London there is really little or no ice

bompington

ugo.santalucia wrote:

bompington wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

How wide a rim you need to fit the damn things? I suppose an Open Pro won't take them

My Nokian A10s are on bog standard Aksiums.

Ok, if there is a forecast of snow I will order them, otherwise in London there is really little or no ice

Got mine from starbike.com

ugo.santalucia

bompington wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

bompington wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

How wide a rim you need to fit the damn things? I suppose an Open Pro won't take them

My Nokian A10s are on bog standard Aksiums.

Ok, if there is a forecast of snow I will order them, otherwise in London there is really little or no ice

Got mine from starbike.com

Brand from Finland... They must know what they are doing

bompington

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Brand from Finland... They must know what they are doing

You'd certainly expect that. I've done 3X 20 miles runs on them so far and I'm impressed - tried to test the grip a few times, on dry, wet, muddy, frosty and icy roads but so far it's always been my bottle which has been the limiting factor.

Choccy

I've used Snow Studs and for the last 2 winters I've been on Ice Spikers.

Snow Studs are great to keep on all over winter as you just let them down a bit if it's icy or snowing, rest of the time just keep them pumped up.

Ice Spikers are very good and stable in ice and snow, they'll stay upright were the Snow Studs start to slide. If money is no object then the 2.1 Pro would be the way to go as these tyres are quite heavy, even more than the claimed weight.

Also on cost, the one thing to consider is that a set of spiked tyres will last years. I had the Snow Studs for 5 years and gave them to a friend with hardly any wear. Only changed as I wanted a more stable tyre, in hindsight I should of paid the extra for the Pro's.

Bar Mitts help when it gets cold too. And some thick tubes as there is nothing worse than a puncture at 6.00am in the middle of winter.

jimmypippa

Meanredspider, do you wrun winter tyres on yoru CX, or are you on the MTB for those?

fossyant

Snow studs here on the MTB - when it's bad away goes the fixed, and out comes the MTB. I have an off road alternative route, which keeps me away from the sliding cars, and it makes a pleasant change. Snow studs, like has been said, are an all round tyre. Heavy and slow on road, but perform like any MTB tyre off road. They work very well on mud strewn climbs and it's just mad cycling across solid ice. They also work well in snow as you'd expect, where Winters fall down, but Winters are a road tyre.

Ice Spikers are insane, and are at the top end for grip.

The only time I found the tyres struggle is when the snow has frozen hard and been compressed for a number of days, but has turned into a 'sand' like texture and hasn't melted - the stuff just shifts under your tyres. Solid snow/fresh snow and ice they are great.

Cycling-mad

I wouldn't agree on the many "it's never to cold - it's -11c here t the moment and with windchill it's -16c and its only going to get colder that's enough to put me off today's commute. Alot of it does come down to common sense, check the weather forecast regularly, wear the appropriate clothing, make sure your bike is for for the weather ( marathon winters for snow and ice ect ) if your properly prepared and the weather isn't super extreme there's nothing different about winter commuting - always remember there's nothing wrong with having a "off" day!

alas58

Ice is the danger, cold, wind i can cope, but to get to work means using roads, B roads [never gritted] and off road tracks. As i am out at 5am at the moment it is car, especially as i have had 2 offs over this weekend.

bompington

Well, big disappointment this morning - proper snow forecast but not a flake in sight. Still, a lot of ice, and a bit of snow on some of the higher roads too. By now that's enough rides in dodgy conditions (100 miles or so) to have a pretty good idea of how the Nokians cope, and the answer is: very well. I still can't make them lose traction without doing extreme manoeuvres, and they've now been over quite a bit of frost, wet mud, frozen mud, black ice, snow, and slush.