Campag vs Shimano vs SRAM

2

Comments

  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    ddraver wrote:
    Force is more equivalent to 105, Apex was the beginning of the WiFli system (triple gears, but on a compact), but has now become the entry.level group sort of equivalent to Tiagra

    Force is more on a level with Ultegra. Albeit shed loads lighter...

    Tiagra Apex Centaur/Veloce

    105 Rival Athena

    Ultegra Force Chorus

    DA Red Record





    Super Record ;)
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    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • secretsam
    secretsam Posts: 5,120
    But when C+ did a comparative test a while back, IIRC they did 105 vs Apex vs Centaur

    Apex won, BTW, simply due to insane gear range it would seem...105 came across as good, but heavy. Now, that's not really a consideration if you're XXkg like me, but it was about 500g or more than a lb in old money. That's a lot.
    It's just a hill. Get over it.
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    SecretSam wrote:
    But when C+ did a comparative test a while back, IIRC they did 105 vs Apex vs Centaur

    Apex won, BTW, simply due to insane gear range it would seem...105 came across as good, but heavy. Now, that's not really a consideration if you're XXkg like me, but it was about 500g or more than a lb in old money. That's a lot.


    My list is the hierarchy as per the manufacturer. I don't get C+ as none of the articles interest me.
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    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    ...and the mags test whatever they get sent. i.e. whichever group the manufacturer is pushing at the moment.
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    Veloce is cheaper an a bit lighter than 105. In fact a veloce crankset + power torque BB is lighter than the Ulegtra 6700. Veloce functions just as well and the there is a three year warranty. There are a varity of shifter spares for campag if afdter three years you have a failure. With Shimano you don't have that luxary. The shifting expoerince wioth campag is pretty smooth. You can keep your shimano cassette and wheels as well if you use a J-tek shiftmate.

    Veloce can be had for about £360 and 105 for about £420 unless someone is doing a very special deal where they make almost nothing. Cmapg nopw do a triple option but that costs more.

    Centaur is lovely too but I think it really worth while is you pony up for the carbon crankset. That is really light.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    giant man wrote:
    Consider Shimano to be the everday cheap and cheerful groupset, Campag the very best of course, and Sram is just rubbish. Simple.

    Why is it then that pro riders from around the world are just as likely to be using one groupset as another? When you NEED the best equipment money can buy to insure that
    you stay in the race I doubt that IF Sram was really rubbish, like you claim, that anyone would even consider using it. Or are you just trolling? :? This is, after all, a beginner forum.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    Man Dennis we actually found somethign to agree on. YOur point is even more prescient given that most teams in the Pro Peloton use SRAM, a few less Shimano and a whopping 2 whole teams use Campag...

    Man those 16 other teams must be really struggl...uh..oh....

    ;)
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    ddraver wrote:
    Man those 16 other teams must be really struggl...uh..oh....

    ;)

    Lotto, Movistar and lampre = 3

    Shimano and SRAM pay the teams to use their kit, as do Campagnolo - but since the latter concentrates on quality ;-) and sell less to the public they're not able to shell out on Pro Teams. In the past teams bought kit for the performance. It's not like that now. Although there was a rather cryptic rumour on Cycling Weekly last month that seemed to be saying that there might be a few more teams using EPS in 2013 due to a shortage of Dura Ace. That might be bollox though.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    I'm sure Cav rues all the sprints he lost because he was on Shimano...

    Shimano=Campag=SRAM

    Deal with it...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    Mark Cavendish – 2012 season - 14 wins – Shimano DA
    Andre Greipel – 2012 season – 20 wins – Campagnolo SR EPS
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    Shimano=Campag=SRAM

    Deal with it...

    Man, we were doing so well for the first 2 pages... :cry:
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • happytramp
    happytramp Posts: 14
    I would have put them something like this.....

    Shimano - Campagnolo - Sram
    Sora - Xenon* - N/A
    Tiagra - Mirage* - N/A
    105 - Veloce - Apex
    Ultegra - Athena/Centaur - Rival
    Dura ace - Chorus - Force
    Dura ace DI2 - Record - Red
    N/A - Super Record - N/A


    * Discontinued
  • secretsam
    secretsam Posts: 5,120
    Coo, still going! And I still don't know the answer, although there seem to be lots of Campag fans still

    I'm quite drawn to Campag simply because SO many bikes these days have Shimano - but I really don't know

    Has anyone experience of all 3? (Other than a pro)

    PS: back in my younger days (mid 80s) when I watched the pros, many of them were on Campag because only Campag did 'everything' - otherwise you had to mix 'n' match, although IIRC Kelly used to race on Mavic? Anyhoo, Shimano were nowhere, no spares, confusing group system, constantly chopping and changing ranges. But Campag sat on their laurels too long, by the looks of things...
    It's just a hill. Get over it.
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    SecretSam wrote:
    Has anyone experience of all 3? (Other than a pro)

    Yes.

    I've just fitted Campag SR recently. VERY pleased. I'm a campag convert :) (although I did have a brief foray a couple of years ago but had to sell the bike with it on :( )
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    I went from Shimano to Campagnolo

    Veloce/Centaur mix on the everyday bike (it came with Xenon originally – that was a pile of cr4p and it nearly killed me....literally)
    Athena in silver on my ‘classic’ bike
    Super Record 2012 on my best bike

    The latter is groupset perfection.

    I’d like to try EPS in the future. If that lottery win comes in an order will be made for a C59 and SR EPS ;-)
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    There's a really good article on Campagnolo in this month’s Cyclist magazine btw. Well worth a read. They pride themselves in the amount of spares they keep and all parts are fully serviceable and replaceable. You don’t get this with the two 'common' brands ;-)
  • symo
    symo Posts: 1,743
    Shimano FTW, surprised no-one is pulling for them here. Crisp changes, doddle to setup and I love the 6700 brake hoods.
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    we are the proud, the few, Descendents.

    Panama - finally putting a nail in the economic theory of the trickle down effect.
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    Suppose, just suppose that someone produced one of the lightest, most dependable, most bulletproof, price competitive, component groups on the market. ALL their money went into function and barely a dollar toward form and or style. Would you buy it? Best functioning groupo by a long shot, yet ugly as h*ll? :?
  • happytramp
    happytramp Posts: 14
    dennisn wrote:
    Would you buy it? Best functioning groupo by a long shot, yet ugly as h*ll? :?

    Ha, ha. Probably not. I sort of feel that way about the Shimano crank. I'd never build a bike with it, but it wouldn't put me off buying a bike with it either.
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    dennisn wrote:
    Suppose, just suppose that someone produced one of the lightest, most dependable, most bulletproof, price competitive, component groups on the market. ALL their money went into function and barely a dollar toward form and or style. Would you buy it? Best functioning groupo by a long shot, yet ugly as h*ll? :?

    No chance!

    Edit: perfect function has an inherent beauty all of its own though. IMO. So probably...
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    NapoleonD wrote:
    dennisn wrote:
    Suppose, just suppose that someone produced one of the lightest, most dependable, most bulletproof, price competitive, component groups on the market. ALL their money went into function and barely a dollar toward form and or style. Would you buy it? Best functioning groupo by a long shot, yet ugly as h*ll? :?

    No chance!

    Edit: perfect function has an inherent beauty all of its own though. IMO. So probably...

    Good points. I'll mark you down as a maybe.
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    thegreatdivide wrote:
    Mark Cavendish – 2012 season - 14 wins – Shimano DA
    Andre Greipel – 2012 season – 20 wins – Campagnolo SR EPS

    But, do wins with any specific component group PROVE anything? Other than it was on their bike at the time of the win?
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    Nope - this whole thread is a pointless argument....which was kind of my point, or not..?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    ddraver wrote:
    Nope - this whole thread is a pointless argument....which was kind of my point, or not..?

    Couldn't agree more. Although since it's in the beginners part of all this I would assume that this question, by a newbie,
    is not all that unusual. When you're new to something it's really hard to know what to do and the advertising certainly can lead you to think that product "A" is the answer to your problems, especially if it's pretty enough. I play the fiddle(very poorly) and I sort of want to think that IF I spent big dollars on a new bow and fiddle "upgrade" that I would play better but like my cycling(again poorly) I know through years of "upgrades" that thinking that way just sort of throws money away. Although you do end up with a pretty bike(or fiddle and bow).
  • markyone
    markyone Posts: 1,126
    I have 1 bike with ultegra and its nice,winter bike.
    1 bike with super record wow nothing comes close,its campagnolo for me :D
    Colnago c60 Eps super record 11
    Pinarello F8 with sram etap
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    dennisn wrote:
    ddraver wrote:
    Nope - this whole thread is a pointless argument....which was kind of my point, or not..?

    Couldn't agree more. Although since it's in the beginners part of all this I would assume that this question, by a newbie,
    is not all that unusual. When you're new to something it's really hard to know what to do and the advertising certainly can lead you to think that product "A" is the answer to your problems, especially if it's pretty enough. I play the fiddle(very poorly) and I sort of want to think that IF I spent big dollars on a new bow and fiddle "upgrade" that I would play better but like my cycling(again poorly) I know through years of "upgrades" that thinking that way just sort of throws money away. Although you do end up with a pretty bike(or fiddle and bow).

    Yep, we discussed for the first 2 pages how performancewise they re identical, and it's only personal preference that matters. From his response, the OP get's the message, which is good, i.e. try them all and get whatever one you prefer...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    dennisn wrote:
    thegreatdivide wrote:
    Mark Cavendish – 2012 season - 14 wins – Shimano DA
    Andre Greipel – 2012 season – 20 wins – Campagnolo SR EPS

    But, do wins with any specific component group PROVE anything? Other than it was on their bike at the time of the win?

    This was a response to a previous post and no, it doesn't prove anything really.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    edited December 2012
    NapoleonD wrote:
    dennisn wrote:
    Suppose, just suppose that someone produced one of the lightest, most dependable, most bulletproof, price competitive, component groups on the market. ALL their money went into function and barely a dollar toward form and or style. Would you buy it? Best functioning groupo by a long shot, yet ugly as h*ll? :?

    No chance!

    Edit: perfect function has an inherent beauty all of its own though. IMO. So probably...

    There is a brilliant example of this in the comments on the SRAM Red Disks article.

    Step Forward TimBooth and Cllr Hodgen...
    Discs are a great idea, but those levers have to go. They are almost as ugly as that new Dura Ace chain set!!!
    I'm just glad these are prototypes... geeeeeeez they look fugly. Agreed there's no room for maneuver inside the housings but a vertical master cylinder from the way the picture has been taken doesn't aesthetically appear to be the way forward in my opinion. Keep up the R&D!

    Not they are unnecessary on the road, Not they re too heavy, not that they are unaero, not that they can over heat or any of the problems associated (99% erroneously) with disks but "becasue they re fugly"
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,738
    markyone wrote:
    I have 1 bike with ultegra and its nice,winter bike.
    1 bike with super record wow nothing comes close,its campagnolo for me :D


    I know I really should nt be prolonging this argument but what you re saying is the bike that get's ridden in all the rain/mud and general sh1t performs less well than the bike ridden in the dry and the sun. This is relevant how?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    ddraver wrote:
    markyone wrote:
    I have 1 bike with ultegra and its nice,winter bike.
    1 bike with super record wow nothing comes close,its campagnolo for me :D


    I know I really should nt be prolonging this argument but what you re saying is the bike that get's ridden in all the rain/mud and general sh1t performs less well than the bike ridden in the dry and the sun. This is relevant how?

    Would you ride a C59 in the rain?

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