Student needing help

gregmatthew

Hi I am currently looking into collar bone and shoulder injuries as part of my degree, no injury is impossible to stop so the aim of the project is how to help lower the risk of these injuries. Breaks are the second most common injury behind lacerations, which people are admitted to hospital for. The most common being clavicle breaks. Obviously the natural instinct when falling from the bike is to protect yourself by out stretching your arms, where the force travels to the collarbone quiet often breaking it. As I previously said the aim is not to stop it completely just to help reduce the force the collar bone receives during a crash to try and reduce the chance of a break. Thank you very much for you time.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/8XYVPMK

nicklouse

i wonder if this is a better thought out survey.

nicklouse

not much better,

mountain biking is not just one thing.

i do not wear or use the same protective kit for XC as i do for DH.
what ever you produce will have to fit in with current kit out there and not hinder their operation.

bartimaeus

I'm very interested to know how I'm going to be protected from collar bone injuries by something integrated into my helmet, gloves, glasses, shorts or shirt. I'm probably better off learning doing some judo and learning how to fall safely.

cat_with_no_tail

1. Where did you get that statistic from?
If you're quoting statistics you should really cite the source.

2. Why have you got an option for "other" when you've got a category for "under 17" and "over 60" and everything between?.

4. I see where you're going with it, but you should really include more options than just using MTB as a cover-all for anything that does not encompass Road / Commute. As it's a survey about protection, you really should at least be including stuff like DH, BMX etc.

6. You're unlikely to be able to gain anything from this question, asmost people I know would have ticked more than one answer in Q4, so your results would show (for example) that commuters wear upper body armour and knee pads.
You should also differentiate between open and closed face helmets imo.
Personally, I'd have this question duplicated for each reponse given to question 4, so if you tick the box that says you do road riding, you get a question asking what protection you wear then doing that, if you also ticked Downhill MTB you'd get another asking what protection you wear for that and so on. Obviously you set the logic so that if you don't select an option, the correcponding question on protection does not appear.

8. Again, there is nothing there to account for people who already wear shoulder protection. And again, without a source for that "statistic", I'd not consider anything.

9. You could hide that question so it only appears if the answer to 8 is "no".

10. It's "already", and it's a douchebag question to ask anyway. It just sounds dim, and will elicit the sort of response you got above about how it's no use being built into gloves. You need to focus the question and make it specific to your subject matter. It's a poor question anyway as it requires a lot of assumption on the part of the respondant.
ie, we're assuming it does not restrict range of movement, breathability, weight etc, are we assuming it does not increase the cost of the garment in question. Are we assuming it's built into a helmet? Body armour? Jersey?


Again, as with your first one. There does not seem to be any point in this survey. The questions you're asking, and the responses they will generate, will not give you any useable data.

The questions you ask in your survey seem to be in no way related to the information you provided in your OP above, as such, it comes across like you're just doing a survey for the sake of it.

For that reason, I'm out!

cooldad

Deja Vu
viewtopic.php?f=10002&t=12891317&p=18000167#p18000167

cooldad

gregmatthew wrote:

quiet often breaking it.

I think we should have a strong word with quiet for breaking collarbones, and possibly a strongly worded letter to the DM.

You randomly use the words clavicle and collarbone. May one assume these are the same bits?

Funnily enough, whilst I have broken numerous bones on both motorcycles and bicycles, over thirty at last count, including my pelvis (very painful), neck (not very painful, but quite scary), and sternum (breastbone for the idiots)(very very very painful, for a long long time), I've never broken a clavicle. Go figure.

ps I couldn't find my age on the list.

2x10

Some of the replies seem a bit harsh, the guys a student, in the process of learning not a consultant at the local A&E. ( I assume) But yeah the survey could use a bit of tweaking.
I didn't break my collar bone but dislocated the shoulder, cant really see how any protective equipment will help to avoid that, but if it will then Ill consider using it.

ilovedirt

Yeahhh, that statistic doesn't sound right at all, or it's at least missing any type of context, which basically makes it completely void.

cooldad

2x10 wrote:

Some of the replies seem a bit harsh, the guys a student, in the process of learning not a consultant at the local A&E. ( I assume) But yeah the survey could use a bit of tweaking.
I didn't break my collar bone but dislocated the shoulder, cant really see how any protective equipment will help to avoid that, but if it will then Ill consider using it.

Just gets a bit boring
Surveys pop up daily - 99.99999999% are absolute crud.
And that is a proven fact.

bennett_346

Why can't we have a sub forum for these questionnaire type things, which seem to be springing up more and more.

The something for nothing culture attacks again.

cooldad

That is an excellent idea. Or just make sure they're all posted in Crudcatcher.

nicklouse

2x10 wrote:

Some of the replies seem a bit harsh, the guys a student, in the process of learning not a consultant at the local A&E. ( I assume) But yeah the survey could use a bit of tweaking.
I didn't break my collar bone but dislocated the shoulder, cant really see how any protective equipment will help to avoid that, but if it will then Ill consider using it.

and the reason is that every new person that joins posts crap surveys that have not been thought out.

most dont even seem to have been written by someone who rides a bike.

when we have a survey posted by someone who has been a member longer than 2 seconds they are actually good and dont piss you of with poorly thought out questions.

do you know you can make money filling in questionnaires. if they are anything like the OPs last two i could not be paid enough.

The Northern Monkey

How do you prevent a collar bone break though?

I always thought that 42%* of collar bone breaks are due to the rider putting arms out when falling - the impact travels up the wrist and forearm and into his shoulder, therefore causing the snap.

Unless you find some way of absorbing the shock through the arms, its gonna snap.


*another made up statistic

The Rookie

You can tell the students are into their final year project and have to tick the 'customer feedback' box can't you.....

Cracked 2 ribs not a collarbone.....most people brake the collar bone by going down on their shoulder direct.

bennett_346

The Beginner wrote:

most people brake the collar bone by going down on their shoulder direct.

Which reminds me, was it you who was obsessed with trying to get everyone to say brake disc instead of brake rotor ages ago because it was an American term?

Or was that someone else...

EDIT:Seems it was you I thought you of all people should make the distinction between break and brake...

viewtopic.php?f=10007&t=12750068&hilit=rotor+american

the_moodster

Seems I'm bucking the trend by breaking my wrist

maybe it's because I've already bust my collarbone (while not on the bike)

Survey completed

moltryn

As The Beginner said.. most collarbone breaks are a result of a fall directly on the shoulder. But also from landing on an outstretched arm, or a direct blow to the shoulder / collarbone area.
Currently convalescing from a comminuted break of the collarbone, three broken ribs, fractured elbow.. and lots of internal bruising and other cuts, etc. From a fall directly on to the shoulder and upper arm :-( !!
Survey completed (although I almost lost the will to live doing so).

bennett_346

moltryn wrote:

Survey completed (although I almost lost the will to live doing so).

Great 3rd post.

moltryn

Should apologise for the post, or the lack of posts in general?!
It should be applauded - I'm operating one-handed!

cooldad

moltryn wrote:

Should apologise for the post, or the lack of posts in general?!
It should be applauded - I'm operating one-handed!

You must do a lot of walking.

bennett_346

moltryn wrote:

Should apologise for the post, or the lack of posts in general?!
It should be applauded - I'm operating one-handed!

It was a compliment.

moltryn

Bennett.. it genuinely wasn't taken negatively! My response was maybe just my humour.. it's all I've got to get me through at the minute!!

nicklouse

moltryn wrote:

Bennett.. it genuinely wasn't taken negatively! My response was maybe just my humour.. it's all I've got to get me through at the minute!!

You bust your right hand then?

moltryn

Moi? Yeah the breaks are all on the right side.

bennett_346

Furious walking syndrome?

bartimaeus

bennett_346 wrote:

Furious walking syndrome?

Has this thread now been moved to the Crudcatcher?

The Rookie

bennett_346 wrote:

The Beginner wrote:

most people brake the collar bone by going down on their shoulder direct.

Which reminds me, was it you who was obsessed with trying to get everyone to say brake disc instead of brake rotor ages ago because it was an American term?

Ruddy phone auto correct....... but yes guilty....

SomeIdeaNoGear

Having spent 10 weeks off the bike after snapping my collarbone right on the end (I'm always one for making A&E's and my surgeon's life a little more interesting, he's actually called Mr D Limb which definitely gave me a chuckle when I got that letter) I'm keen to find out what kind of protection could have been offered.

I actually think the break was down to a combination of my full face helmet smacking into my collarbone as well as the location of the straps on my back pack (I didn't have time to put my hands out to try and cushion the impact and kind of slid on my head for a bit).

I'm considering investing in some american hand-egg pads for the next time I start on the serious drop offs again, but don't want to look like a dynasty reject, so any product that could limit the chance of me not being on the bike can only be a good thing.

I've got to agree with most of the people on here though, that survey does need a bit of tweaking...

chez_m356

you should ask this guy

he seems to like helping students