standing up climbing..why is it so hard

styxd

Climbing out of the saddle is something worth learning. You can probably sit and climb most hills, but its nice to mix it up as it uses different muscles to seated climbing.

It depends which 100mile sportive yo want to complete really. Something with steep hills like the Fred Whitton would be quite difficult to do completely seated, unless you had very low gears.

With a double, I find myself climbing most of the steep hills like wrynose and hardknott out of the saddle from bottom to top.

elderone

styxd wrote:

Climbing out of the saddle is something worth learning. You can probably sit and climb most hills, but its nice to mix it up as it uses different muscles to seated climbing.

It depends which 100mile sportive yo want to complete really. Something with steep hills like the Fred Whitton would be quite difficult to do completely seated, unless you had very low gears.

With a double, I find myself climbing most of the steep hills like wrynose and hardknott out of the saddle from bottom to top.

Well,just been watching some hardknott vids on utube and from what i,ve seen,your doing extremely well to climb out the saddle.
nice one.

RoadMeridaBen

I find the opposite, find it much easier to climb out of the saddle even when I had just started cycling i found the same.
A few months ago i tried a strava segment twice within 20 minutes, once standing and once seated
went balls out on both attempts and actually recorded bang on the same time on both runs, although it took
40 watts more standing

elderone

Now that is interesting and tends to edge to the what suits individually side of the fence,which is what I have thought all along.

limoneboy

Respect to you doing the horseshoe pass in one go after 3 months of riding.

Its a pretty hard climb for beginners ,i do it a lot as its round the corner from me ,tip on that climb would be to pace yourself ,if you try to hard just before the parking area before the cattle grid you will blow out before the actual horse shoe after that its a breeze. to be honest a lot of people miss out on the best of the horseshoe which is coming back down at 50+ mph it's a treat as you can see for miles further down the road . i do both standing and sitting but as all comments above make sure your in the correct gear and when standing control your breathing to keep the heart rate down.

FlacVest

You have to find the right amount of upward force generated by the bike to match what you'd like to comfortably put down, if that makes sense. That's what we're always doing when we cycle through gears to find the right cadence.

It's the same thing. You shift up 2 or so gears so you can keep a preferred cadence that matches best with your body's ability to push down with enough force so that you aren't wasting energy and having to use your core to hold you up. If you shift too low, you'll use your core to keep upright. Too high and you have to pull hard on the bars for leverage.

If you do it right, you use virtually none of your core, and it's just like climbing stairs... but a bit more fluid.

Just mess around with it; mess around with what feels best for you, but you do have to be fit; you're going to use the muscles in your back along with your abdominal muscles a lot more, so if those are weak you're going to feel it. Because you're using more muscles, you're going to require more oxygen as well. So, again, if you aren't fit, you're going to tire.

The more you do it, the better you'll get at it. Find what's right for you; if it's a shallow hill, I'll put my hands in the hooks and get out of the saddle there. If it's steeper or longer, I'll put my hands on the hoods and stand up.

But you don't even need a hill; just shift up 3 or so times on the flat and pedal. No reason why you can't do it there.

nolight

I am getting more comfortable standing on flat land. But still very weak in climbing. Today I tried to stand up while climbing, my legs cramped and immediately I sit down again. There are times when I find a nice rhythm but normally that is on flat land.

smidsy

FlacVest wrote:

If you do it right, you use virtually none of your core, and it's just like climbing stairs... but a bit more fluid. ... Really!
you're going to use the muscles in your back along with your abdominal muscles a lot more, so if those are weak you're going to feel it.

So that is your core is it not?

So back to my original position earlier in this thread. Good core fitness is essential for out of the saddle work. If your core is weak you loose a lot of energy swaying around.

TakeTurns

When I was a beginner to cycling, I would have to climb out of the saddle a lot. I'd notice my speed decreasing so I'd get out the saddle to try maintain it. At the time of being a beginner, my muscles had not yet adapted to such work load and therefore needed a slight break. Switching between sitting and standing allows you to engage different muscle groups. Especially if you come to a steep section on a hill, getting out of the saddle can help you power up that section easier than you would be able to whilst seated.

However, now that I'm a a better cyclist than I was back then. I can do majority of the hills seated. This doesn't mean it's the best way to climb them. I still get out the saddle on steep sections because it helps to get up and over them faster.

I agree with the comments about core strength being important. Ever since I've been doing cycling specific core workouts, my upper body feels a lot more solid on the bike. I've read that Wiggo was advised by his coach to work on his core in order to improve his power output. Although it added a slight bit of weight to him, it improved his performance.

styxd

smidsy wrote:

FlacVest wrote:

If you do it right, you use virtually none of your core, and it's just like climbing stairs... but a bit more fluid. ... Really!
you're going to use the muscles in your back along with your abdominal muscles a lot more, so if those are weak you're going to feel it.

So that is your core is it not?

So back to my original position earlier in this thread. Good core fitness is essential for out of the saddle work. If your core is weak you loose a lot of energy swaying around.

I wouldn't say good core fitness is essential. It certainly helps, but if you're a beginner wanting to make improvements then you're better off practicing out of the saddle climbing rather than trying to improve your core.

smidsy

I agree styxd but the OP wanted to know why it was hard. Its hard because he is unfit and has poor core strength.

Both are essential if you are to make it easier.

elderone

smidsy wrote:

I agree styxd but the OP wanted to know why it was hard. Its hard because he is unfit and has poor core strength.

Both are essential if you are to make it easier.

Yes, im still not fit or good core strength what ever that is but that wasn,t the question i asked.As i said,i can get up hills sitting and have never walked yet even on cat 2 or 3 hills but i find it so much harder to stand doing hills,hence the question.
Is fitness or technique the issue?

styxd

smidsy wrote:

I agree styxd but the OP wanted to know why it was hard. Its hard because he is unfit and has poor core strength.

Both are essential if you are to make it easier.

I think you're going off track. I dont think good core strength is essential to be any good at out of the saddle climbing (depending on your definition of good though I guess).

I wouldnt say my core strength is any good, I dont really do many/any core strength exercises.

I would say I can climb out of the saddle better than your average rider though.

I think this is probably due to aerobic fitness, low body weight and technique.

Also, bike setup helps. I find longer bikes with long stems and low bars are easier to climb out of the saddle on.

FlacVest

styxd wrote:

smidsy wrote:

FlacVest wrote:

If you do it right, you use virtually none of your core, and it's just like climbing stairs... but a bit more fluid. ... Really!
you're going to use the muscles in your back along with your abdominal muscles a lot more, so if those are weak you're going to feel it.

So that is your core is it not?

So back to my original position earlier in this thread. Good core fitness is essential for out of the saddle work. If your core is weak you loose a lot of energy swaying around.

I wouldn't say good core fitness is essential. It certainly helps, but if you're a beginner wanting to make improvements then you're better off practicing out of the saddle climbing rather than trying to improve your core.

I didn't say it was essential either; if you don't have any though you'll know it. If climbing and done properly you're pretty relaxed for the most part, but this is going to depend on how high your cadence is and how steep that hill is; not to mention how fast you want to get up that hill.

smidsy

elderone wrote:

smidsy wrote:

I agree styxd but the OP wanted to know why it was hard. Its hard because he is unfit and has poor core strength.

Both are essential if you are to make it easier.

Yes, im still not fit or good core strength what ever that is but that wasn,t the question i asked.As i said,i can get up hills sitting and have never walked yet even on cat 2 or 3 hills but i find it so much harder to stand doing hills,hence the question.
Is fitness or technique the issue?

My answer may not be what you were expecting but I did understand the question.

It is much harder because you are using different muscles to those that you use in seated riding. These include your core as you have to support your upper body in a way that you do not when seated.

Additionally you are having to take your whole body weight through your legs as well as turn the pedals when standing which you do not when seated.

So in short the specific muscles and technique required for standing riding is not as well deveolped in your case as your seated riding - Simples!!!

As with anyhting the more you do it (correctly) the better you will become so keep at it.

rick_chasey

The OP:

It's just practice.

Also, it does help if you're not a heffer.

nunowoolmez

Summed up nicely there ^^^

It is true that to become better, it is heaps better if you shed some weight. I wasn't overweight, but i found losing a bit did help me climb better. Stand up climbing is all about practise & rythm. It is easier finding a more manageable climb & rep it, this way it will allow you to find your own rythm & style & then you can transfer this to more difficult climbs with more confidence & skill.

As long as you relax your upper body & breathing & just keep the kinetic energy to your legs (keep your upper body relaxed but keep movement to a minimum), you be in business in no time.

However, on some gnarly climbs you just have to grind it out & this might mean any form goes out the window!!

Good luck

elderone

smidsy wrote:

elderone wrote:

smidsy wrote:

I agree styxd but the OP wanted to know why it was hard. Its hard because he is unfit and has poor core strength.

Both are essential if you are to make it easier.

Yes, im still not fit or good core strength what ever that is but that wasn,t the question i asked.As i said,i can get up hills sitting and have never walked yet even on cat 2 or 3 hills but i find it so much harder to stand doing hills,hence the question.
Is fitness or technique the issue?

My answer may not be what you were expecting but I did understand the question.

It is much harder because you are using different muscles to those that you use in seated riding. These include your core as you have to support your upper body in a way that you do not when seated.

Additionally you are having to take your whole body weight through your legs as well as turn the pedals when standing which you do not when seated.

So in short the specific muscles and technique required for standing riding is not as well deveolped in your case as your seated riding - Simples!!!

As with anyhting the more you do it (correctly) the better you will become so keep at it.

Thanks,that makes perfect sense to me now.
Also not a heffer lol,I wiegh 11stone so dont think is an issue.
nunowoolmez,I have been doing more hill climbs as where i live there is not much choice,but will keep at it.cheers.

Roadrookie

I have only been riding (again) since August but find standing up climbing has become more and more common, using body weight to turn the pedals saves the thighs some work. I suppose then it must just be a technique confidence thing and probably the only way to improve matters is to practice it repeatedly. Maybe my youthful years on bikes and my middle years on motor bikes makes me more confident on two wheels but whatever the reason its just second nature to me. I would recommend sticking with it as I am sure it helps.

okgo

Up the steep stuff I don't mind getting out of the saddle, but there is certainly an optimum cadence even for doing it. I am running silly gears at the minute and when it gets steep my cadence drops to the low 60's, I'm sure it would be better if I was spinning a little bit quicker. If its really steep I actually climb in the drops for more leverage.

And its not practice at all I don't think, its just fitness, becoming fitter will make you better at every aspect of bike riding, and it doesn't matter if you're heavy if you have the power to make up for it.

blackpoolkev

I posted a thread along similar lines a few weeks back.One piece of advice that came back has helped me a lot-hold your head up when out of the saddle!It opens up your airways and helps to shift your weight over the cranks.

alihisgreat

Stumbled upon this video again: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_65831anz4&list=PL114031911DD7E8AF

useful tips for climbing out of the saddle

elderone

thats a useful vid,cheers.
shame his voice goes right through me..

Cleat Eastwood

Why is what so hard? - take your personal problems elsewhere young man. Yours sincerely Disgusted of Stoke.

elderone

listen ling chung,you cant be disgusted from stoke,as there is nothing more disgusting,than stoke.