Another build - 2011 Spesh Stumpjumper Expert Carbon (Maybe)

M_rift04

Hi all, After selling my Canyon Strive Build I decided I like building and went searching for another frame and came across this beauty!!!




My brief Canyon Experience made me think about what 160mm feels like as a all-mountain bike and in all honestly its a bit too much for my area of riding, with the exception of Aston,chicky and worburn..So I am sticking to 140mm (Had the Ragely Mmmbop at 140mm) but going for FS still.

Now, I'm still in two minds as to if I would like this once its built as I have always tried to stay away from the big players (Spesh, Giant, trek etc..) because I like having a bike that is more different then usual. If anyone is interested in the frame its yours for £700 its in the classified section too.

I'm also looking into a hardcore Hartail again - This time its between this Specialized Carbon beaut or one of these three: SC Chameleon,Cove Stiffee or the Evil Sovereign..Thoughts on that choice?

lawman

So you bought a bike you don't want, from a brand you don't like, to replace a bike you built, never rode and then sold, to sell this frame to buy another bike that is nothing like any of the two previous bikes? Thats a very odd way to do things

My opinion on specialized? well the stumpy with the brain shock is just plain crap imo, why on earth they decided to make it have a "Brain" when from what I can tell all it does is mimic a normal adjustable shock like an rp23, but moves any form of pedal platfom adjustment to a place that is un-accessable when riding, forcing you to dismount the bike to adjust for whatever lies ahead... Clearly said brain is making up for serious lack of such an object in the body of the complete tool who bought one in the first place...

As for the hardtails mentioned, the sovereign, or if you dont want a dropper post, stanton slackline or maybe a production privee shan, if you want to be really different

M_rift04

lawman wrote:

So you bought a bike you don't want, from a brand you don't like, to replace a bike you built, never rode and then sold, to sell this frame to buy another bike that is nothing like any of the two previous bikes? Thats a very odd way to do things

haha you nailed it!! I don't really know what my mind does, its hard to explain...The brain is a very complex thing, its hard to explain to anyone outside of my brain. I see something and my imagination says..."I'm gonna take this small idea and run a long way away with it and make some seriously tempting scenarios for you to think about" and after a while my mind goes "Ok, that sound plausible, I'll buy it!"

As for the Brain on the spesh...its popular because its makes a clear difference between the flat terrain (where it is locked out) and bumpy stuff where it opens up and takes the bumps. Its basically a very basic version of the Electronic stuff that'll be on 2013 lapierres. I rode a Epic two years ago and it was night and day difference between the two terrains, its not like propedal at all, its far better.

I'll check those other options out for the HT, never heard of either of them.. :twisted:

ps I did ride the Canyon...once...

emseens

But on epic it make sense, I rode 29er stumpjumper FSR, it felt wrong. I try to fiddle with brain during the ride, and can't get good performance out of it. On the hardest setting shock was good on smooth terrain, bet when it become bumpy I can't tell the difference between 29er stumpjumper HT and FSR. So I clicked one position from hardest setting. Ride was to soft and i cant do anything about it.
On my bike I have propedal that I can turn on - this is only proper whey on AM bike.

M_rift04

Well, its always a challenge to compare a 29er to a 26er - If you had a rigid 29er it'd feel similar to a 100mm HT 26er.. and I'm not sure comparing a FS 29er to a FS 26er brings you to a good conclusion because they are completely different geos and all sorts. However I don't want to turn this post into another 29 vs 26 opinion post that undoubtably results in people coming to the conclusion that it is just each to their own..

There isn't much difference between the FSR and the Epic apart from the travel and so the brain should work the same. Maybe the pressure in the shock wasn't correct, did you set up the sag and everything? The 29er wheel takes alot of the bumps so as I mentioned above having a HT 29er is a similar feeling to a FS 26er..thats why they're so popular.

lawman

emseens wrote:

But on epic it make sense, I rode 29er stumpjumper FSR, it felt wrong. I try to fiddle with brain during the ride, and can't get good performance out of it. On the hardest setting shock was good on smooth terrain, bet when it become bumpy I can't tell the difference between 29er stumpjumper HT and FSR. So I clicked one position from hardest setting. Ride was to soft and i cant do anything about it.
On my bike I have propedal that I can turn on - this is only proper whey on AM bike.

Very much this, on an xc course a bike like an epic with the brain makes sense, on a stumpy, it makes no sense when you want to be going up as easily as possible, then have fun on the way down, last thing I want to do is get to the top of a climb, dismount my bike, change my shock settings, ride down then repeat. Flicking a lever on the shock is easier, quicker and doesnt interrupt your flow. They also use stupid shock mounts, so you are completely tied into that setup. Literally one of the worst ideas ever as far as a 140mm bike is concerned, and in no way does it work anything like or as likely as well as the new E.I shocks.

M_rift04

So what is the difference between a XC course and Epping or any other singletrack stuff..Nothing.

You have the wrong end of the stick Lawman, you don't need to adjust it constantly..you set it up for your preference eg firmer or softer and then leave it..thats why designed it so you can't adjust it on the bike because you don't need to..why do you think they have kept it even on 2012 bikes, if it didnt work as you say it would have been scrapped years ago!!!

I never once said they worked 'like or as' the E.I shocks I said ts like a (very) basic version meaning it senses when you're on a flat surface and locks out and then senses whe you hit bumpy terrain and opens again.

Also, when was the last time you've ridden a brain setup???

lawman

M_rift04 wrote:

So what is the difference between a XC course and Epping or any other singletrack stuff..Nothing.

You have the wrong end of the stick Lawman, you don't need to adjust it constantly..you set it up for your preference eg firmer or softer and then leave it..thats why designed it so you can't adjust it on the bike because you don't need to..why do you think they have kept it even on 2012 bikes, if it didnt work as you say it would have been scrapped years ago!!!

I never once said they worked 'like or as' the E.I shocks I said ts like a (very) basic version meaning it senses when you're on a flat surface and locks out and then senses whe you hit bumpy terrain and opens again.

Also, when was the last time you've ridden a brain setup???

an xc race is covering ground as quick as possible on a short travel xc bike, not for the fun of a good descent, and if you value climbs more than descents, it begs the question why have a big with 140mm of travel?

Last time I rode a brain shock was on a 2011 stumpy exactly the same as yours, riding down a short DH section, which is damn rocky, then back up the same track again. DH it felt pretty average, no messing with the shock, turn straight back around and back up and it bobbed like hell. My problem with it is the fact that FSR bikes tend to bob alot without a pedal platfom, so the brain has to be set quite firm to make it feel better on climbs. This has a knock on effect for the downhills, there is always a compromise, which for a system designed to supposedly eradicate such compromise is kinda pointless. The marketing specialized uses means that they will sell more because of such a technology, in practice I've yet to ride any bike with such a shock, having ridden fox terralogic forks, the brain on several stumpys and epics, and scotts genius and spark, that performs as well in any situation as a normal shock such as an rp23.

M_rift04

Ok, Whatever Lawman, it seems like you've always got a different point of view that you HAVE to get across and in turn I always start argueing with you......I like it!

Lawman what I think you have done is riding someone elses bike and its not set up for you personally. The amount of reviews I have read from BikeRadar, mtbr etc that show the Brain works for them as it has been designed to because they have tested the bike over a day or two and setup the fade on the brain to their preference. I am 100% confident that the Brain system works better then the RP23/propedal system in all situations. Again, the question is this: Why would specialized put the Brain system on all the top models of their range if it wasn't better? This question does not necessarily prove that its better then the RP23 (Or whatever shock we're comparing it to) but it has some indication.

What you are asking in your first paragragh is just crazy...Who buys a mountain bike (Not the FR or DH type) and doesn't value the climbs and descents equally...The point is Lawman, that 120-150mm (Might fit the Rockshox Rev Ti 120-150mm or Fox Talas 140mm floats) is the perfect amount of travel for my riding and needs. A 140mm bike is the mid-point of travel so it will have equal advantages and disadvantages when it comes to climbs/descents and it doesn't lean to one side more then the other.. Enough said really. Personal preference.

lawman

M_rift04 wrote:

Ok, Whatever Lawman, it seems like you've always got a different point of view that you HAVE to get across and in turn I always start argueing with you......I like it!

Lawman what I think you have done is riding someone elses bike and its not set up for you personally. The amount of reviews I have read from BikeRadar, mtbr etc that show the Brain works for them as it has been designed to because they have tested the bike over a day or two and setup the fade on the brain to their preference. I am 100% confident that the Brain system works better then the RP23/propedal system in all situations. Again, the question is this: Why would specialized put the Brain system on all the top models of their range if it wasn't better? This question does not necessarily prove that its better then the RP23 (Or whatever shock we're comparing it to) but it has some indication.

What you are asking in your first paragragh is just crazy...Who buys a mountain bike (Not the FR or DH type) and doesn't value the climbs and descents equally...The point is Lawman, that 120-150mm (Might fit the Rockshox Rev Ti 120-150mm or Fox Talas 140mm floats) is the perfect amount of travel for my riding and needs. A 140mm bike is the mid-point of travel so it will have equal advantages and disadvantages when it comes to climbs/descents and it doesn't lean to one side more then the other.. Enough said really. Personal preference.

Well the forum would be no fun if people didnt voice their opinions!!

First off, the bike I rode was supposedly setup for a rider heavier than me, so in theory should have been the opposite of what I experienced. All the FSR style bikes I've ridden, stumpy, zesty and older norcos have not really impressed me with their ride, mainly down the over-active suspension and pedal bob, and personally much prefer twin link, vpp/dw link/quad-link style bikes, purely for the way the suspension acts as a system.

Spesh have used the brain shock for many years, dropping it could confuse some people and drop its actual value and sales of previous years bikes in sales may fall, not really sure. Its also one way of saying they have a unique selling point, its part and parcel of marketing crap that alot of folks will believe because they read it so it must therefore be true. Personally as I said having ridden many bikes with that style of somewhat "own-brand" shock design, I've yet to find one that really nails the performance of the bike, like I said to me the shock designed to create a no compromise ride often does the opposite, creating a compromise that an of the shelf rp23 or monarch might not create.

Many, many people do buy bikes based on what they ride and what they prefer to ride, the majority of people on my local trails ride short travel xc bikes because they offer a decent all-round ride that climbs well and can descend relatively well. If gets them to the bottom great, but if it means getting to the top a little easier and quicker, they'd have the shorter travel, lighter bike to make the most of what they feel they prefer to ride. I myself much prefer a 140mm travel full suspension or hardtail, as I like to get the top in whatever way, and then descend with confidence and try to go as quick as my skills allow. I'm no downhiller, i'm no xc racer, but having a blast where ever I ride seems much more fun to me on my mojo HD than it would do on say a friends yeti arc. Again personal preference

Briggo