Looking for a new commuting steed, disc ready road/cx

mcj78

Hi all,

Thinking of a new commuting steed - been looking at the Genesis Day One Alfine (& the ss one) but they seemed a bit long in the tt (52cm frame = 545mm tt :shock:) - might get away with the Croix de Fer as it's a touch shorter but i'm open to suggestion... the Genesisesses seem quite weighty into the bargain but that's not really a deal breaker...

So - what other nice disc-compatible road/cx frames are out there? Would I be as well buying a 29-er and sticking drops & slicks on it? I liked the look of the Cannondale CAAD-X bikes & hoped they'd do a disc version for 2013 but it looks like they're only putting discs on the high end ones - i've seen the usual offerings from Planet-x, Kona, Cotic, Whyte, etc. etc. but nowt's really caught my eye tbh - for a full bike i'm sticking to around £1k - don't mind building up a frame myself either so that's an option too.

Help me out here guys - what am I missing?
8)

estampida

http://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/m14b315s2 ... S_GB/23472

JamesB5446

Charge Filter?
[deleted by mod due to malware from bikereviews . com. Please DO NOT embed images from this site]
http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... hi12-43054

Or a Boardman CX?

mcj78

Hmm - that Civia thing looks interesting, never seen one of those before - defo liking the Gates belt drive, God knows why more (esp. UK) companies aren't using it on commuters! I'm near Glasgow probably none near me to get a blast on - good shout though!

I'd seen a few Charge bikes in the past - nearly bought a Plug for knocking about on... until I seen it up close - that Filter looks pretty decent though, but not quite my taste!

The new Genesis Day One Alfine looks great, but I think it would be too long for me & I don't fancy the Versa shifters much - had a play around with them in the shop one afternoon & was scared they'd break! If they made this "frame only" i'd make it work... somehow...


Keep the suggestions rolling 8)

JamesB5446

mcj78 wrote:

defo liking the Gates belt drive, God knows why more (esp. UK) companies aren't using it on commuters!

I really don't see the point of them.

mcj78

JamesB5446 wrote:

mcj78 wrote:

defo liking the Gates belt drive, God knows why more (esp. UK) companies aren't using it on commuters!

I really don't see the point of them.

I thought the whole idea was less metal on your drivetrain to grind away/clean/lube - but yeah, I suppose it only replaces a SS chain which are pretty cheap and tough anyway & on an SS or internally geared hub there wouldn't be any mechs/cassettes to crunch through... so yeah - I guess I see where you're coming from Plus they need splittable chainstays/dropouts which makes the frame more complicated to manufacture... in fact - balls to the belt drive :P Only kidding I know they probably have many plus points, like being different!

JamesB5446

I think people like them because they're new.

People thought cam belts in engines were better than cam chains at one point.

Big_Paul

JamesB5446 wrote:

I think people like them because they're new.

People thought cam belts in engines were better than cam chains at one point.

Harley use belt drive, both primary and final drive so they can be tough enough, but when Kawasaki tried it, people retrofitted chains and sprockets because the belts lasted barely longer than a chain and were something like £200 back in the 90's

For all the price of a couple of sprockets and a chain, why would anyone go to all the trouble of making a split chainstay frame? Got to be a fad.

JamesB5446

Harley use them, as do Budnitz. Harley are the overpriced-beach-cruiser-for-idiots of the motorbike world.

BelgianBeerGeek

Isn't that the point, though? It isn't a chain. No stretch, and because no lubrication/preserve is needed, no abrasion when road crud gets stuck. And more importantly, no oil on your trousers.
Back to the original question, Pinnacle CX bikes from Evans? I have one, and have been really pleased with it.

JamesB5446

There is this fancy new invention called a chain guard.

And any one too lazy to put a bit of oil on a chain every now and then is probably too lazy to ride a bike.

Their website says it lasts twice as long, but it costs twice as much.

estampida

the main argument for belts are

zero maintenance once fitted

zero maintenance, for miles (toyota timing belt change at 60,000 mls..... for example) - 60,000 miles turning at err 2000 rpm......., the wear resistance is unbelievable for this system of power transfer

and the belt weight nothing compared to a chain, regardless of the rest of the drive bits you don't need

Big_Paul

Timing belts are constantly tensioned and under their cover live in a relatively clean environment, run a belt uncovered and it doesn't last anywhere near as long, throw a bit of grime, grit or misalignment and they're a liability. On the belt drive Kawasakis, the sprockets were heavier than the one for the chain drives, and if the belt wasn't aligned properly it would fret against the guides on the side of the sprockets, then it would fray, it was a nightmare to tension them too. All it took was one wee stone and it could break or shed a tooth, then another and eventually it would look like an elastic band.

estampida

are they better than a chain or not?

are belts better than chains for commuting, and some cx action - probably

are belts better than chains on mtb's going miles in to the wilderness - probably not

i'm sure 1980's Kawasaki's have many many problems but its the 21st century and this sort of new tech will be adopted at some point, the belt and tooth profile is different, and they are made of different compounds (therefore will behave differently), rubber bands should be cheaper to produce than steel 1's made of 600 or so parts

but they are not...... how does that work?

in the cycling industry this happens a lot, prices are not set on how much it costs to make....... its how much they think you want to pay for it........ a cx bike with disc brakes is right up there on the high mark up scale at the mo

JamesB5446

Fads always cost more.

Plastic belt - light.
Hub gear - heavy.

The maintenance argument is daft. Lube your chain, it's really not that hard.

estampida

JamesB5446 wrote:

Fads always cost more.

Plastic belt - light.
Hub gear - heavy.

The maintenance argument is daft. Lube your chain, it's really not that hard.

and check for wear of chain

and adjust the indexing once in a while (for chain and gear part wear)

and check for wear on cassette and chain rings

and some people have no luck with front and rear mechs throughout their cycling career

but 20 years from now will bikes still use chains??

20 odd years ago the lotus superbike was almost laughed out of the velodrome, after a couple of races who was laughing then.......

go back to rod operated brakes if you want as the connection will be more direct than hydraulic...........

jesus :roll:

and for a little research....

http://beltbik.es/

symo

JamesB5446 wrote:

Harley use them, as do Budnitz. Harley are the overpriced-beach-cruiser-for-idiots of the motorbike world.

and budnitz only build cycles for rich hipster douchebags.

Belt drives are used by Harley for a reason, their motorbikes are bobbins.

Name one motogp team using a belt drive.

JamesB5446

estampida wrote:

but 20 years from now will bikes still use chains??

Yes.

estampida wrote:

20 odd years ago the lotus superbike was almost laughed out of the velodrome, after a couple of races who was laughing then.......

Was that the one with the chain?
Who laughed at it? It was banned (as were all monocoques) until 1990.

estampida wrote:

go back to rod operated brakes if you want as the connection will be more direct than hydraulic...........

You can still get bikes with rod brakes. Wouldn't want them on a mountain bike mind you, but on a town bike, why not?

mpdouglas

I had my eye on this carbon, disc compatible frame from Dedacciai. It's their Super Cross model. Seems to retail at around £1,400. I reckon I could build an amazing commuter bike around this.



Spec is here: http://www.wiggle.co.uk/dedacciai-super-cross-frameset-2012/#

It didn't launch all that long ago, but signs are that it may already be discontinued which I don't quite understand.

It seems like it might be replaced by their Cross DC13 model.

tptvmbircn

I had the exact same situation, my perspective on the issue was something robust and can do both road and trail, not too concerned about weight and to avoid the carbon frame issue (personal opinion). I looked at the genesis range mainly the croix de fer and the build quality was pretty shabby as the stays were pointing outwards compared to the rest of the frame, might of been a one off but I was not willing to take the chance. I ended up going for the Surly Karate Monkey and never looked back.

Brief Pro's

- both on and off road, quick, running marathon xr's
- steel frame will last for years
- nice geometry and has a fun factor

Brief Con's

- full guards you will need to be into hacking
- not for weight weenies

Just my input and now all year bike, neither didn't stop me completing the coast to coast in a day, with camping gear on my back good luck

passout

Planet X Dirty Disco?

mcj78

Hi guys - sorry I started this post then vanished, busy run up to holiday ( from which I'm just back )

Cheers for the suggestions, there's plenty for me to think about there anyway - apart from belt drive - cheers for the suggestions!

J

uzubairu

passout wrote:

Planet X Dirty Disco?

Recently acquired one for my 4x rides to work (1 day in the car).
I love it.

Previously used a MTB (very hard going), then bought a road bike which I swapped for the Dirty Disco after 3 weeks (didn't feel confident on the road bike).
Swapped the tyres for 28mm Continental Grand Prix 4 Seasons and I haven't looked back.
Commute time has improved as well.
Gone on trails on my days off and I still enjoy the ride.
Best decision for me (love the disc brakes and the riding position).

Got 10% off when I bought mine (discount weekend).