How tough is carbon?!?!?!?

ro63rt

Can anyone please answer me this? How much abuse would a carbon hardtail really take? I'm fancying a really leightweight XC hardtail, just curious to how much abuse I can give it? Will it take decent drop offs, jumps, good size rock gardens, just good old general trail hacking?

Thanks now for all responses.

njee20

Piece of string...

It's tougher than an equivalent weight aluminium frame. That said, if you buy a Scale 899 and do lots of 8ft to flat drops it won't last that long.

Something like a Carbon 456 will be very tough, but doesn't really fit in the 'really lightweight' category. But then that's all subjective.

EH_Rob

When well made its as tough as anything else, and very light. I have an alu frame but carbon bars and seatpost - they're brilliant, and take trail centre sized jumps and drops just fine.

Being made out of carbon doesn't necessarily make a bike good though.

styxd

I dont really understand why you'd want a really lightweight XC hardtail for jumps and drops (unless you're increidbly smooth)

The frame might be strong enough, all the other bits wont be though.

oodboo

Depends how it's made etc but this might give you an idea:
http://www.pinkbike.com/news/santa-cruz ... t-lab.html

rockmonkeysc

Depends on the frame. Some are very tough, others aren't.
Have you considered titanium?

cooldad

RockmonkeySC wrote:

Depends on the frame. Some are very tough, others aren't.
Have you considered titanium?

Or even better than titanium, aluminium

oodboo

I'm waiting for them to start making bikes out of duranium.

Huckfinn

What about unobtainium?

EH_Rob

styxd wrote:

I dont really understand why you'd want a really lightweight XC hardtail for jumps and drops (unless you're increidbly smooth)

The frame might be strong enough, all the other bits wont be though.

True to a point. my bike isn't a really light XC hardtail, but its a reasonably light hardtail with XC geo, and it stands up to the jumps and drops I ride (as well as going down some DH trails at Innerleithen once or twice!). Maybe that's because it isn't a true XC racer, maybe its because I'm relatively small and don't weigh very much, maybe its because I'm fairly smooth (probably not the latter!). Either way, I still have fun on it going down, and also enjoy being able to get up hills quickly.

I guess it depends how gnar the OP is and exactly what bike he's thinking of getting. It sounds like a C456 might be more up his street.

I can understand a wish to do this more so than the clowns you see riding 180mm travel freeride bikes around any trail centre red route you can think of. Although I'm looking for an FS bike at the moment, I really don't want a great big rig for the sake of having it.

styxd

I saw a chap riding a bike made from geranium. Couldn't tell how strong it was though, he was riding it like a right pansy.

styxd

I guess it depends how gnar the OP is and exactly what bike he's thinking of getting. It sounds like a C456 might be more up his street.

Yes. Jumps and drops - anything you find on a trail centre run I wouldnt necessarily count as "jumps and drops."

These are just "trail features" - any mountain bike should be able to handle them. If it cant, its not a really upto its job as a mountain bike.

cooldad

Huckfinn wrote:

What about unobtainium?

You mean titanium

"Later, unobtainium became an engineering term for practical materials that really exist, but are difficult to get.[4] For example, during the development of the SR-71 Blackbird spy plane, Lockheed engineers at the "Skunk Works" under Clarence "Kelly" Johnson used unobtainium as a dysphemism for titanium. Titanium allowed a higher strength-to-weight ratio at the high temperatures the Blackbird would reach, but the Soviet Union controlled its supply and was trying to deprive the US armed forces of this valuable resource.[nb 1] Eventually, through a European front company, a large quantity of titanium found its way to the United States.[nb 2]"

http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/ ... inium.html

EH_Rob

styxd wrote:

I guess it depends how gnar the OP is and exactly what bike he's thinking of getting. It sounds like a C456 might be more up his street.

Yes. Jumps and drops - anything you find on a trail centre run I wouldnt necessarily count as "jumps and drops."

These are just "trail features" - any mountain bike should be able to handle them. If it cant, its not a really upto its job as a mountain bike.

True. I'm a bit confused about when a jump or drop is actually neither and is a trail feature because its at a trail centre and not somewhere else, but ok.

YeehaaMcgee

ro63rt wrote:

Can anyone please answer me this? How much abuse would a carbon hardtail really take?

7.354 Yees.

ro63rt wrote:

I'm fancying a really leightweight XC hardtail, just curious to how much abuse I can give it? Will it take decent drop offs, jumps, good size rock gardens,

Erm, I'm not sure a super light XC machine is what you're after.

cat_with_no_tail

YeehaaMcgee wrote:

ro63rt wrote:

Can anyone please answer me this? How much abuse would a carbon hardtail really take?

7.354 Yees.

fukoff! nothing can handle such levels of rad. I think you used an incorrect gnarr ratio on your metric fukton conversion.

YeehaaMcgee

No, it's correct. I'm using the post-Ffestiniog, modern metric Yee scale.

Clank

YeehaaMcgee wrote:

No, it's correct. I'm using the post-Ffestiniog, modern metric Yee scale.

Really? Wow. Back-mathing from the result gives a Gnarr in the mega-Tomac Range! It's still sub-Hart, but even so, that is a stellar Gnarr count.

In other news - a carbon frame will be tougher than it's aluminium equivelent. If it's not, they've ballsed the design/manufacture up.

passout

Often pretty tough but http://www.bustedcarbon.com/

Chunkers1980

http://www.bustedally.com/

paul.skibum

That Santa Cruz video impressed me (and depressed me - I'd have happily taken any of those frames!) although the thing that struck me was that whilst the forces needed to break it were twice that of the aluminium frame the failure was far more terminal - I guess the force levels would be pretty terminal to you as a rider as well though!

My "new bike saving fund" for my long travel all mountain enduro xc dream bike might need to be a bit bigger for carbon

supersonic

Strangely enough the carbon frame will be easier to repair!

YeehaaMcgee

Yep, wheras once aluminium bends, it's pretty much done for

ro63rt

Thanks for all your replies, much appreciated!

I can see where some of you are coming from with the leightweight XC for jumps & drops. At the minute I'm riding a Marin Rocky Ridge, about 4 years old when it was speced decently. But I've modified so much the only original parts are the Frame & Fox 32 Vanillas with 140 travel. I run a double chainset & bash up front with a stinger chain device. Just to give you an idea. I guess I could lighten it up with a single chain ring on the front & a few other bits of finishing kit. I would be running a single ring with 10speed on this purchase defo, as my fitness is allowing.

I'm looking for something that will fly up hills as my fitness has improved no end since using a road bike a bit. Plus I like doing long days out, but living in the lakes there is some pretty rocky stuff & there are plenty of natural jumps & drops. Which just need to be used.

I'm liking the suggestion of the On-One carbon 456.

YeehaaMcgee

The rocky ridge isn't a bad frame at all, and any bike will fly uphill given the right rider.
Given the choice of a Marin or an OnOne - I'd actually go for the Marin frame.