Proper technique for very rough ground

Giraffoto

I’d be interested to know if there’s a smart technique for coping with this sort of thing . . .

Last night I came to a stretch of bridleway where the mud had been churned up by cows, had several deep tractor tyre ruts in it, and was then baked hard by the Sun. The effect was a combination of cow hoof prints about 10 – 20cm deep, ridges about the same height, and the whole lot pretty solid. (Think of the inside of an egg box made of baked mud and sized for ostrich eggs) . The only way I could get through was to lock the fork out, select a gear around 32/28 (f/r) and wheelie across short stretches of it. Is this the only technique? How would the experts do it, assuming they had the same sort of bike – a hardtail with 100mm of fork travel?

cooldad

How long is a piece of string?
Ride over it.

mrmonkfinger

I'd nose manual it.

mrmonkfinger

in reality, either just ride it, or walk

Emphursis

When I hit patches like that, I normally follow the biggest rut, which is usually a tractor tire track.

Jimx26

Plough through it

craigw99

why would you lock out the fork when it is bumpy?

cat_with_no_tail

Giraffoto wrote:

I’d be interested to know if there’s a smart technique for coping with this sort of thing . . .

Last night I came to a stretch of bridleway where the mud had been churned up by cows, had several deep tractor tyre ruts in it, and was then baked hard by the Sun. The effect was a combination of cow hoof prints about 10 – 20cm deep, ridges about the same height, and the whole lot pretty solid. (Think of the inside of an egg box made of baked mud and sized for ostrich eggs) . The only way I could get through was to lock the fork out, select a gear around 32/28 (f/r) and wheelie across short stretches of it. Is this the only technique? How would the experts do it, assuming they had the same sort of bike – a hardtail with 100mm of fork travel?

:shock:

Why on earth would you lock your fork out to ride over rough ground?

And if it's smooth enough to wheelie over, surely it's smooth enough to ride :?

Does not compute.

njee20

Why on earth would you lock your fork out to ride over rough ground?

And if it's smooth enough to wheelie over, surely it's smooth enough to ride :?

Does not compute.

+1

Chunkers1980

Wheelies are often the only option be it mud, rock or ruts. Just hammers the back wheel, but means the front doesn't get stuck in the rut or mud, you place the front wheel in the best position to get over anything on the way down.

njee20

Perhaps it's a terminology thing then - there are times when you may manual through a rough section, but not wheelie, and why you would lock your forks out is beyond me.

YeehaaMcgee

Giraffoto wrote:

I’d be interested to know if there’s a smart technique for coping with this sort of thing

Yes there is.
Would you like to know what it is?

Chunkers1980

Yeah, manual is more it, but is more a wheelie when you know it's a long one!

Giraffoto

craigw99 wrote:

why would you lock out the fork when it is bumpy?

then Cat with no Tail wrote:

Why on earth would you lock your fork out to ride over rough ground?

And if it's smooth enough to wheelie over, surely it's smooth enough to ride

Does not compute.

and njee20 wrote:

+1

Three very good points. When I first hit this challenging patch of ground the fork bottomed out and I nearly came to a complete halt. Locking out the fork made it easier because I could raise the front wheel over the obstacles without having to wait for it to rebound - leaning back a bit helped too. The wheelie technique relies on the only thing you've got on the ground being driven, so whatever you hit you climb over: on the other hand, my skills don't extend to doing it over 50m of craters, so I was doing it in fits and starts (and stops). Also, I agree that it's probably rideable by someone with more skill than me, so what is the skillful way to do it?

Now you have the picture - sporadic wheelies, bottoming out forks and avoiding the cowpats - what would you do? In the saddle or out of it? Lean forward, lean back, stand up or sit down? High or low gear? Stop and pump your tyres up a bit?

Also thanks for the replies so far.

finally, YeehaaMcgee wrote:

Would you like to know what it is?

I would indeed. As long as it's not too smart for me

Also a bit of clarification - I don't know what "manual" means outside of skateboarding, what I call a wheelie is pushing hard on the pedals in a lowish gear so the front wheel lifts, and keeping it there for a few turns of the pedals. That's what I did. What does manual mean?

rockmonkeysc

Plenty of speed, weight back, heels dropped and if it's only a short section manual through it. Speed is your friend, if your going faster your wheels won't drop in to the holes, keep pedalling.
The fork's rebound will help you to lift the front wheel so don't lock it.

YeehaaMcgee

Weight slightly back, arms and legs bent a little. Let your arms and legs bend like damp noodles to absorb the holes in the ground.
The looser you can be, the easier it it - let the bike go mad underneath you.

jairaj

If its a short section take it speed and skip over the ruts. If its long or you can't keep speed high enough to just skip over it then you have stay as loose as possible to let the bike move in and out of the ruts. Need to move your weight back and forth according to the terrain to let the bike move around you. eg if the back wheel is about to go over a bump then unweight the back to allow it to come up. Looking well ahead and trying to plan a cleaner line through can help too.

A manual is like a wheelie but you are not peddling to pop the front wheel up. It requires you to shift your body weight towards the back of the bike and holding the balance position.

YeehaaMcgee

I was told that it's as simple as -
sitting on saddle = wheelie.
standing on the pedals = manual.

Plyphon

YeehaaMcgee wrote:

I was told that it's as simple as -
sitting on saddle = wheelie.
standing on the pedals = manual.

Pedalling = Wheelie
No pedalling = Manual

bennett_346

Plyphon wrote:

Pedalling = Wheelie
No pedalling = Manual

Yeah this was my belief, sitting or stood, pedalling is a wheelie not a manual.

Majski

I'd just go ride some better trails TBH

The Northern Monkey

Giraffoto wrote:

Three very good points. When I first hit this challenging patch of ground the fork bottomed out and I nearly came to a complete halt.

Have you set your sag correctly to your weight?
If you're riding over "egg boxes" then your fork sounds way too soft.

What forks are they?

bennett_346

The Northern Monkey wrote:

Giraffoto wrote:

Three very good points. When I first hit this challenging patch of ground the fork bottomed out and I nearly came to a complete halt.

Have you set your sag correctly to your weight?
If you're riding over "egg boxes" then your fork sounds way too soft.

What forks are they?

Or he doesnt have the right bike for them. Any 100mm bike is going to bottom out over the kind of terrain he's talking about. If you set the sag correctly it'd be way too firm for anything else on the ride. Maybe he's overcooking the speed a bit.

Giraffoto

The Northern Monkey wrote:

Have you set your sag correctly to your weight?
If you're riding over "egg boxes" then your fork sounds way too soft.

What forks are they?

Rock Shox Recon Gold (coil spring), set up by TF Tuned - It feels perfect for everything else I've encountered, but this case is probably down to bad technique. If I'd been leaning back (it now turns out) the front would probably have lifted over the ruts and ridges; as it was, the front dug in and any fork is going to bottom out with 90+kg of Southern Giraffe wrapped over the bars!

YeehaaMcgee

That still shouldn't bottom out the fork. Sounds like the spring rate may be too soft.
Regardless, the crux of the matter in this case is technique - but this forum has fallen into it's usual behaviour of trying to blame the equipment. No surprises there.

Giraffoto

It's set up for someone who knows how to ride rough ground

bennett_346

YeehaaMcgee wrote:

That still shouldn't bottom out the fork. Sounds like the spring rate may be too soft.
Regardless, the crux of the matter in this case is technique - but this forum has fallen into it's usual behaviour of trying to blame the equipment. No surprises there.

Well it depends. We don't really know how rough what he's riding is, if it's seriously rough than any short travel fork will bottom out over it even with the right sag otherwise it would be way too hard for anything smaller, however it's not an excuse for falling off.

YeehaaMcgee

Not really. it should still take a substantial impact to bottom the fork out. The shorter the fork travel, the stiffer the spring, which is why we measure sag in %, not in absolute deflection.