How unfit am I? Annoyed with myself!

2

Comments

  • RandG
    RandG Posts: 779
    TheFD wrote:
    So as a 15 year old you drank, smoked, did drugs and ate crap - that is some childhood you had!!


    So did I :lol: it was great :D but I also now don't do any of those things 8)
  • adm1
    adm1 Posts: 180
    Manc33 wrote:

    The thing with the ecig is not only does it enable (enable is the key word, ENABLE) pretty much any smoker to stop smoking tobacco (what all smokers want) and you can also "carry on smoking" or that is, your brain has no qualms about the transition, but it even feels to me like I could quit this (apparently harmless) device far easier than real cigarettes, the companies lace tobacco with all sorts of chemicals to give a faster hit and that is what also gives you the faster anxiety when it wears off, they are geniuses at "repeat sales" as they probably call it in their boardrooms.

    If I can stop using tobacco with this, anyone can. I am like a nicotine fetishist or something, a nicotine fiend. Always have been. Just gave up expecting to ever be able to stop at one point. I guess I class myself as a non-smoker now, I dunno. :|

    There's not very much wrong with nicotine itself - it's only really as harmful as caffeine. It's the by products of smoking fags that kills you. I gave up almost three years ago now. I used Swedish Snus (google it) to break the physical addiction and it took two days. I kept up the snus for a year while getting my fitness levels back up again with cycling and swimming. Then I switched to nicotine gum.

    I still have a nicotine addiction, but now it's no worse for me than an espresso habit. I will never smoke another cigarette again. Congratulations on breaking the ciggie habit - next consider breaking the physical part of it. Maybe go from ecig to gum or something. Don't beat yourself up about it though.

    Anyway - on your average mph thing.....check if you have your cycling computer set to the correct wheel circumference! That might be your problem.
  • gjpollitt
    gjpollitt Posts: 42
    My average speed and distance is slowly increasing whilst my heart rate is slowly coming down. Over time you will notice improvements like this. Just get out and cycle for now and don't focus too much on numbers and graphs!
    Graham

    Cube lightening hpc race 2012 - red,white and blue
  • Jez mon
    Jez mon Posts: 3,809
    junglist_matty wrote:
    A lot of good stuff.

    Basically, I agree with this assessment.

    Getting faster is down to riding the right way, most training plans I have seen are variations of the following.

    Monday - Rest day/recovery ride
    Tuesday - Hard training session (some kind of intervals) 1.5hrs
    Wednesday - Rest/recovery
    Thursday - Another hard training session (one hours hard effort)
    Friday - Rest/recovery
    Sat - 2 hrs easy ish
    Sunday - 3+ hrs, long club run.

    The key things are, variation of intensity, and plenty of recovery time.

    But above all, enjoy riding your bike, riding to a rigid training plan isn't always fun, anyone who looks over my Strava records will see I'm not following any kind of plan!

    Also, check your position and tyre pressures.
    You live and learn. At any rate, you live
  • Scrumple
    Scrumple Posts: 2,665
    Don't read all the blather above - I'll save you time:


    1. KEEP RIDING> fitness will increase exponentially and gains will be dramatic after a painful and slow start (it will seem slow, but in reality 6 months of 3 times a week will get you heaps of reward).

    2. Find a group > riding in a pack will kick you on as you improve, as it will force you to push yourself if you join a club run.

    3. Stick at it, as you need to develop a routine where it becomes easy to get out, and you can enjoy the huge leaps you make.

    DONE!
  • mouth
    mouth Posts: 1,195
    TheFD wrote:
    Mouth wrote:
    Manc33 wrote:
    I would give anything to be as fit as I was at 15.

    I beg to differ, at least in my own personal experience. I no longer drink, smoke or do drugs. Oh yeah, I don't really eat crap any more either.............
    So as a 15 year old you drank, smoked, did drugs and ate crap - that is some childhood you had!!

    Yep. And the price I paid was a heart attack at 25. Call it learning the hard way.
    The only disability in life is a poor attitude.
  • s1mon
    s1mon Posts: 618
    Hi,

    Well I'm a year or so younger than you and just got back into cycling after a couple of years out of it but in those years I didn't really do that much as had other things to do, hobbies etc and buying a house. I used to do a lot of riding in my teens and school with the odd mtb race.

    My average speed is around 12-14/15mph that's with a 10mile ride which seems to suit me at the moment, although did 15mile route today at around the same average speed :) The weakened I did a 25mile route but ended up doing 35 ! Nearly killed me and my average was way down.

    The only way to get quicker is cycle more but don't go over the top like I did :D

    I've been finding routes on Endomondo around my area and doing those which is nice as you've got somewhere to go/follow rather than just ride any old way.

    Main thing I've done is enjoy the ride and make the most of the weather sod the speeds, getting out the riding is going to get me fitter and loose a few pounds than sitting at home !

    I would like to get heart rate monitor and try riding in set zones though.

    HTH.
  • thescouselander
    thescouselander Posts: 549
    Ringo 68 wrote:
    +1 to the HR monitor and lower speed and heart rate zones.

    I am doing most of my riding in Zone 2 which is 138 bpm maximum for me. At first this was really hard to do, especially on anything that pointed upwards, but the more I ride at this lower intensity the easier it is to keep below 138 bpm.

    Not being totally out of breath is a novelty when out on my bike too.


    I'd love to know how people do this. I can only keep in zone 2 on the dead flat and there's not much of that round here which makes it very difficult. How's it done?
  • Ringo 68
    Ringo 68 Posts: 441
    thescouselander wrote:
    Ringo 68 wrote:
    +1 to the HR monitor and lower speed and heart rate zones.

    I am doing most of my riding in Zone 2 which is 138 bpm maximum for me. At first this was really hard to do, especially on anything that pointed upwards, but the more I ride at this lower intensity the easier it is to keep below 138 bpm.

    Not being totally out of breath is a novelty when out on my bike too.


    I'd love to know how people do this. I can only keep in zone 2 on the dead flat and there's not much of that round here which makes it very difficult. How's it done?

    It takes a lot of discipline, especially if you find some guy on a Argos MTb with a fag hanging out of the corner of their mouth rides past you.
    The route I use when trying to keep my HR low is pretty flat with a 1K uphill section. When my HR starts going up I just change to an easier gear and ease off slightly. I spend most of the time in the small ring.
    It must be doing something because I did a PB on one segment, even though my average HR for that segment was only 134.
    The advice I read was that if you find you can't get up a hill without your HR getting too high was get off and push!!! In time you will find yourself getting up the hill with a low HR.

    Slow is the new fast.
    Cube Agree GTC Pro
    Boardman Comp
    Carrera Subway Hybrid
  • alex1rob
    alex1rob Posts: 95
    Is this a thread about riding slowly.... or a cleverly disguised marketing campaign for e-cigarettes :/

    Ride more, you'll get faster. Don't lament the past, you're not aiming to be the next Wiggins. Plenty of time left to become a good cyclist, it just requires dedication.
  • Manc33
    Manc33 Posts: 2,157
    edited August 2012
    "some guy on a Argos MTb with a fag hanging out of the corner of their mouth" hahahaha.

    Today I did 25.80 miles, average 12.2 MPH.

    To the top of Snake Pass (the 3.3 mile side) and back again.

    Got soaked a little. About 3/4 of the way up a sudden shower started, saw 2 guys dressed the same (team colours) go past me, they seemed slow when I was still but they were out of sight by the time I got my coat on lol.

    Maybe they saw me there and are members here, it would be spooky. :lol:

    Last time I went up Snake Pass about 2 years ago I saw a really fit blonde girl in an all in one black jumpsuit absolutely fly past me, standing up! STANDING UP after coming up a hill like that!

    Funny on the way home 2 kids going quite fast down the pavement, about 17MPH and I went past them and heard them say "Not anymore" lol. As they tried to catch up I stood up and gave it some, hehehe they had no chance. :mrgreen: Than again if they actually had their seats put up to the proper height, who knows. Only a child that has a cyclist as a father has their seat adjusted properly, or a well off kid that got a (correct) bike fitting done.

    Even saw a kid about 5 or 6 cycling up Snake Pass with his dad behind... at least they were cycling up the beginning bit.

    Here's what I think.... if you do a ride you have done before and think "Hmmmm that was definitely easier than last time" then you are getting fitter. You can't even use the average speed because of wind, or like me today coming back down Snake Pass on a wet road, I couldn't just "race" down it like I could if it was dry (and still probably wouldn't want to risk it on these cheap tyres). Max I have got up to is 37MPH and I don't think I would wanna go much faster than that.

    I did get a HR monitor the other day from Aldi for £8.99 and it works. Saw the same one in a chemists for £19.99 :roll: It works fine, lets you set a max and gives you percentage of the max. Even has a clip for putting it on your handlebars with the watch strapped on it (but my bars are too fat).

    I think to stay under say 140 BPM I would be better off walking up a semi-steep hill and as most have said it is nearly impossible if cycling, unless you're always on the flat.

    I live in Manchester, just about every single street from where I live either goes uphill or downhill. It is even uphill and downhill all the way to Snake Pass, which is generally uphill in the end.

    I leave my house and boom, a hill. Then at the bottom of that hill I turn right and guess what? A hill (uphill!) then a flat bit at the top (this is where you can turn right up an extremely steep incline - Werneth Low) then uphill, then up and down for a while, then up Mottram hill, then its flat for about 2 miles, then its down quite a steep hill to the Gun Inn pub, then go right and downhill again, then its pretty flat around Glossop although its slightly uphill through there, then its uphill, then its Snake Pass which is 100% uphill.

    So from my house to Snake Pass is pretty much up, up, down, down, up, up, up, up. :lol:

    I am actually glad I don't live somewhere like Holland. My mum today lol "You'd think the Dutch would be good at the [Olympic] cycling" so I said nope, there's no real way to test themselves if they are always on the flat.

    Tell you what I want but I think they are £3500 so forget it.... those exercise bikes where you can program Tour de France routes into it and it adjusts the pedals accordingly. They were giving one away on ITV4 when the TdF was on, but then swapped the competition to a real bike. Imagine having that in your house! AFAIK you can put just about any route in (that is a road) in the world. I think it even tilts forward and back etc, well for £3500 it better had.
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    t4tomo wrote:
    junglist_matty wrote:
    silly commuter racing

    Pick a slowish girl with a nice ass and just ride behind her!

    I only wish girls with nice ass's rode the same routes, it would make recovery / slow training far more bearable!

    Unfortunately there's no shortage of mid-life crisis men on £3k+ bikes clad in lycra with huge bellies round here! They come chugging past at a super fast 15mph going all out to maintain that speed.... Trouble is, it's only about 2-3mph faster than my recovery speed so they take far too long to get out of sight!!!
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    jonomc4 wrote:
    I am 46 - so older. Smoked for many years but gave up about 4 years ago (except the occasional one) and none at all in 2 years.

    When I started cycling I was the same as you. Now I can average 24mph on a 10 mile flat ride without headwind and cruising at 20mph doesn't bring up a big sweat. I am still fairly crap on hills but gradually getting better.

    How do you cruise round at 20mph without breaking a sweat!? I wanna know because I've been riding mountain bikes (road bike for 3 years) and I can't cruise anywhere near that speed....

    I went out hard on a 53mile ride this morning and averaged 19.4mph, there wasn't any (what i consider) big hills, mostly flat and a medium 10-15mph SE wind:

    http://app.strava.com/rides/16623905


    I wanna know you're secret for riding 20mph without breaking a sweat!
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    Manc33 wrote:
    I am actually glad I don't live somewhere like Holland. My mum today lol "You'd think the Dutch would be good at the [Olympic] cycling" so I said nope, there's no real way to test themselves if they are always on the flat.

    Heard of team Rabobank?????

    or Michael Boogard?
  • houndlegs
    houndlegs Posts: 267
    Reading the comments about keeping heart rate low,and if it gets to high get off and push.
    Can somebody point me in the direction of something to read to explain all this to me please.
    I'd be interested to learn a bit more about this and heart rate monitors.
  • Ringo 68
    Ringo 68 Posts: 441
    houndlegs wrote:
    Reading the comments about keeping heart rate low,and if it gets to high get off and push.
    Can somebody point me in the direction of something to read to explain all this to me please.
    I'd be interested to learn a bit more about this and heart rate monitors.

    http://www.bikeradar.com/fitness/articl ... sts-28838/
    Cube Agree GTC Pro
    Boardman Comp
    Carrera Subway Hybrid
  • houndlegs
    houndlegs Posts: 267
    Ringo 68 wrote:
    houndlegs wrote:
    Reading the comments about keeping heart rate low,and if it gets to high get off and push.
    Can somebody point me in the direction of something to read to explain all this to me please.
    I'd be interested to learn a bit more about this and heart rate monitors.

    http://www.bikeradar.com/fitness/articl ... sts-28838/
    Many thanks ringo
  • teulk
    teulk Posts: 557
    I went out on my normal route yesterday of 23mile and averaged 18mph. There wasn't much wind so i can only assume it was all my own effort. I generally average about 16 - 16.5mph (17mph was my previous best ) over that route. I don't care what anyone says an average of 18mph is quite a hard thing to do as obviously you have to ride faster than that to get that average. Anyway i was well pleased with my time. I weight 15 stone so im no light weight.
    Boardman Team 09 HT
    Orbea Aqua TTG CT 2010
    Specialized Secteur Elite 2011
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    teulk wrote:
    I went out on my normal route yesterday of 23mile and averaged 18mph. There wasn't much wind so i can only assume it was all my own effort. I generally average about 16 - 16.5mph (17mph was my previous best ) over that route. I don't care what anyone says an average of 18mph is quite a hard thing to do as obviously you have to ride faster than that to get that average. Anyway i was well pleased with my time. I weight 15 stone so im no light weight.

    Congratulations, thats a good effort mate, 18mph average over 23miles is more than respectable & as you say, it's certainly not easy. Do you GPS track your route? If you have a GPS phone/bike computer (edge200 is about £100) get the free Strava app, it's brilliant for motivation, and post ride analysis. If your training to try and get faster its a great way to keep track of historical rides and making comparisons between yours and others rides.
  • sebbyp
    sebbyp Posts: 106
    Thats a good long ride Junglist_matty, I agree you have to be rather good on the bike to avg. 20mph without working to some degree! Im not sure if Strava is 100% accurate as they keep taking the raw Garmin Data and interpet it themselves. Maybe you could try garmin connect just to check your ride vs. strava. I upload my rides to garmin and strava, just because im a runner at heart and always used garmin connect, then recently got on a bike and found strava :D Im more concerned with building the legs muscles up as cardio wise im strong and the legs fatigue first.
    I've been riding for nearly 5 weeks and am at 18mph/30miles so hoping to improve swiftly to start with.
    http://app.strava.com/rides/16753539
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    sebbyp wrote:
    Thats a good long ride Junglist_matty, I agree you have to be rather good on the bike to avg. 20mph without working to some degree! Im not sure if Strava is 100% accurate as they keep taking the raw Garmin Data and interpet it themselves. Maybe you could try garmin connect just to check your ride vs. strava. I upload my rides to garmin and strava, just because im a runner at heart and always used garmin connect, then recently got on a bike and found strava :D Im more concerned with building the legs muscles up as cardio wise im strong and the legs fatigue first.
    I've been riding for nearly 5 weeks and am at 18mph/30miles so hoping to improve swiftly to start with.
    http://app.strava.com/rides/16753539

    Yep, I upload to Garmin Connect and Strava; Garmin connect for my own personal use, but I use Strava for the social side of ride sharing as it's easier to use than Garmin connect and more riders use it because of simple smartphone compatibility. Then Strava is really good for basic comparison to other riders on the same routes, whereas Garmin connect isn't.

    Progress is a lot slower than you think; it's tough going and at times is very demoralising when you don't improve like you hoped you would.... Just be careful not to over-train or you'll plateau.

    My advice, get yourself a HR monitor, they're invaluable training aids and help you to stick to a zone and make every mile count rather than just going full on all the time which won't help your speed improve.

    Low heart rate training = improve aerobic fitness (more efficient heart and endurance ability)

    High intensity interval training = build muscle strength and improve your Lactate Threshold

    High intensity short rides = helps build stamina


    Mixing up the three types of riding will help you significantly improve, the two key points to remember:

    - Going at low heart rates usually means going slow.... The more your body improves, the faster you will go at lower heart rates (i.e. start out at 10-15mph in HR Zone 1, after months of training you'll be going 12-17mph at the same HR zone).

    - Intensity riding will increase your top speed and also improve you're endurance speed through building muscle strength


    Obviously other things such as dropping fat etc.. will all help towards increasing your average speed. But remember, it's a slow process.... Just don't go and do all out rides all the time, you won't improve much doing that.
  • teulk
    teulk Posts: 557
    junglist_matty wrote:
    teulk wrote:
    I went out on my normal route yesterday of 23mile and averaged 18mph. There wasn't much wind so i can only assume it was all my own effort. I generally average about 16 - 16.5mph (17mph was my previous best ) over that route. I don't care what anyone says an average of 18mph is quite a hard thing to do as obviously you have to ride faster than that to get that average. Anyway i was well pleased with my time. I weight 15 stone so im no light weight.

    Congratulations, thats a good effort mate, 18mph average over 23miles is more than respectable & as you say, it's certainly not easy. Do you GPS track your route? If you have a GPS phone/bike computer (edge200 is about £100) get the free Strava app, it's brilliant for motivation, and post ride analysis. If your training to try and get faster its a great way to keep track of historical rides and making comparisons between yours and others rides.

    Thanks, i use my Garmin 705 to track all my rides. The route is relatively flat with total elevation 805ft and max elevation 228ft. I realise that my average is only really relative to that route but still its an improvement for me. I do longer routes of around 60 -70miles and average anywhere from 14.5 - 15mph over them. Total elevation for them being between 2500 - 3000ft and max elevation 450 - 550 ft - again i guess pretty flat my most peoples standards.
    Boardman Team 09 HT
    Orbea Aqua TTG CT 2010
    Specialized Secteur Elite 2011
  • Dmak
    Dmak Posts: 445
    Manc33 wrote:

    Why is that? What is wrong with me!

    If I am averaging 12.5MPH then how much more effort is it to go at 25MPH average? I know I won't ever get there being 36 and all, but how much more power? 3 times more? 5 times more? 10 times more? More than 10 times more?

    If I biked 10 miles a day, how long before I can coast along at 18MPH like MOST road cyclists do?

    Nothing is wrong with you, you're just not conditioned to it.

    With you weight and bike; 12.5mph requires about 50watts. 25 mph requires about 275 watts. SO just over 5x the power is required, 25mph solo requires a very high level of fitness.

    10 miles daily would see you at a reasonable pace in a few months depending on how much effort you put in.

    Just keep pedalling, enjoy yourself.
  • limoneboy
    limoneboy Posts: 480
    houndlegs wrote:
    Here's what I'd do. Take the computer off the bike,then ride the bike cos you enjoy it. Don't worry about speeds at all,just get out and have some fun.

    i got a new bike 3-4 weeks ago and haven't got a round to putting my computer back on, i have got to say i enjoy my training rides much more now and i think you know in your mind if you are working hard or not, also i just check when i left and when i get back that's been my guide. monitoring average speeds can be very depressing as at the beginning of the year (winter) they are always crap but improve as the year goes on. i would say the old motto 'ride ride ride' as what you need to do and try to included plenty of hills as that will give the best indication of your improved fitness, conquering that 7km climb in a lower cog makes me smile much more than average speeds :D
    last month wilier gt -this month ? bh rc1
  • hoolio
    hoolio Posts: 139
    As someone else said - check the brakes aren't rubbing. Sounds simple, but I had a absolutely knackering ride into work one morning after a couple of weeks off and after an equally tough ride home I checked the brakes and sure enough the wheel was slightly out of true and the rear brake was rubbing on.

    Slow pace could also be attributed to impending cold/flu, poor breakfast (no energy in the tank), or just a bad day!
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,462
    Just out of interest, you mention the slow cadence of the MTB rider - are you sure your not just spinning a very low gear and getting nowhere fast as a result? It's good to have a reasonable cadence but a lot of newbies I see just ride in too low a gear a lot of the time.
  • limoneboy
    limoneboy Posts: 480
    Pross wrote:
    Just out of interest, you mention the slow cadence of the MTB rider - are you sure your not just spinning a very low gear and getting nowhere fast as a result? It's good to have a reasonable cadence but a lot of newbies I see just ride in too low a gear a lot of the time.

    Totally agree, and there seat too low which also effects efficiency , i saw a guy tonight grinding up a 15% incline on his 50 ,he was goosed and i was spinning i advised him and he just ignored me ,his loss i suppose, but use your gears that's what they are for :)
    last month wilier gt -this month ? bh rc1
  • okgo
    okgo Posts: 4,368
    Everyone rides at a different pace/cadence. You only have to look at the TT in the Olympics to see that. Martin riding at 75-80 if that, Wiggins at 90-95.

    Oddly I was also quite obsessive about the average speed of my rides before I started using a powermeter. When you do, you realize how little the speed matters, as the conditions make so much difference that its very difficult to compare like with like with just speed. Whereas if I can see how much effort I've put in then its immediately obvious whether I'm improving or not.

    If you keep riding you'll get faster, but don't get too hung up on averages, they're really not that important. I used to think doing 20 mph avg over say 30-40 miles with a couple of hills would be beyond me, but when you actually arrive at being able to do that you realize how irrelevant it is.
    Blog on my first and now second season of proper riding/racing - www.firstseasonracing.com
  • Manc33
    Manc33 Posts: 2,157
    Cadence seems to be related to leg muscle. Thinner equals higher cadence. Unless its Lance Armstrong who was a freak and could do it all in one guy. The physics of it means it has to be that way. Why Cav can sprint etc but is "crap" on the hills lol (his hill climb times are probably still unattainable by 99% of cyclists). Bigger legs powering more at a lower cadence are running at the best efficiency (the best for that rider) as smaller legs powering less at a higher cadence. The thing is where stamina is concerned the thinner legs will always win (again except Lance). Well its what I have seen anyway looking at legs trying to work out how they win. :mrgreen:

    What does a cyclist do when his coach says you got your leg muscle slightly too big and have to carry the weight? Do they have to do insane training/sleep deprivation/starvation to try to "lose" that muscle mass again and become perfect again for cycling far?

    Its a science I know that.

    I biked again today 20 miles, managed 12.8 MPH this time. So, a 2 day break since the last 25 miler. Again it felt easier. Came up the hill from Gun Inn on the 2nd to lowest gear, not the lowest gear. :lol:

    For me this has been the best indicator - if the same ride felt easier than last time, or you always look at the comp and think "bloody hell I am going quite fast more often here". Long may it continue. KEEP KICKING!
  • junglist_matty
    junglist_matty Posts: 1,731
    okgo wrote:
    Oddly I was also quite obsessive about the average speed of my rides before I started using a powermeter. When you do, you realize how little the speed matters, as the conditions make so much difference that its very difficult to compare like with like with just speed. Whereas if I can see how much effort I've put in then its immediately obvious whether I'm improving or not.
    If you keep riding you'll get faster, but don't get too hung up on averages, they're really not that important. I used to think doing 20 mph avg over say 30-40 miles with a couple of hills would be beyond me, but when you actually arrive at being able to do that you realize how irrelevant it is.

    Well said.

    My commute to work two days ago was 17.1mph average with HR average 127 (was controlling my HR between 125-130). This morning, the same route averaging 16.5mph, again keeping average HR 127. Why? wind was not the same and it was raining today. Averages should be taken with a pinch of salt.

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