+3mph...how hard?

ianbar

i have set myself a few targets once i have i may then treat myself t a new bike(feel i should be a much faster cyclist to earn one).one of my criteria was to hit 16mph over a certain route,havnt decided the exact route yet but similar to what i rode on saturday but a little shorter so something like 40 miles...maybe i should just make it 50 side its close.the point is, i rode it at 13mph I'm pretty sure i could have gone certain half a mile an hour faster for various reasons but really i need to add 3mph to achieve tis goal. is this a very hard and unlikely target? i am 16 st(lost a st since mid june) and i know i would lie to get down to 14 st, i am 6'3".

pinarellokid

im only a relative road novice but i have noticed if i keep checking my gear i go faster,, sounds daft written here

but what i mean is i always go up a gear whenever i remember,, that way im going a little faster for only a little effort,,

i find i seem to sit in a lower gear when a change makes relatively little more effort.

like i say im only a novice but it works for me at the minute over distances of 15 miles.

styxd

Assuming you were going as hard as you could on saturday, then adding 3mph is going to be very tough. Probably the easiest way to do it is pick a flat route if you're 16 stone.

16mph on a fairly flat route is easily achievable. Throw in a few hills and your weight starts to hold you back.

Leeuw

Since March, I've added 3mph avg to my rides - now climbing on big ring when I used to grunt on little ring (and biggest sprocket!). You'll get fitter, shed more weight and you'll see the speed go up.

I'm 6' 5" and now under 14st

cje

Just keep riding. You'll get fitter, and faster. I was quite slow when I started (a year ago) but now I average about 17mph over an 'undulating' 40 mile route, and 18 mph if it's flat. And I weigh more than you!

estampida

or total overkill

aerobar - check

sperm helmet - check

skinsuit - check

might look out of place on bike lanes..........

ianbar

I pushed the last 12 miles or so I probably averaged 16 easy at that part the first 35ish I did ride within myself a bit as was heading out to a climb.this Saturday will be a test as its the local sportive and is a similar route,I don't want to achieve my pace on a flat route just feels like cheating to me, I quite like the climbs...must be something wrong with me lol

Bozman

There's no need to get hung up on averages, just cycle more, cycle further and you'll get fitter, your weight will drop and your average over that route will naturally increase.
I used to pace myself over certain routes by using a basic bike computor and that worked for me but you need plenty of drive because you haven't got anbody kicking your a**e.

charlie_potatoes

A new bike will see an improvement of 3mph easily.
Then once you have achieved this then you can get that new bike that you promised yourself



:roll:

ianbar

i was waiting for someone to say that about a bike lol

blackpoolkev

Bear in mind the effort needed to overcome wind resistance goes up very sharply with airspeed, in fact as a cube function.Therefore you will require more effort to go from 15mph-16mph than from 13mph-14mph,so don't fret if the final improvement seems a bit harder.
16 mph is definitely do-able,and with a new bike as motivation it'll probably happen sooner than you expected!Good luck.

Anonymous

It will be as hard then as it is now. As someone said, it never gets easier, you just go faster. So keep suffering until you hate cycling so much you want to throw your bike into a ditch and never look at it again.

THEN you will have added 3mph.

TheEnglishman

No one's mentioned dangling a piece of carrot cake in front of your face.

So I will....

briantrumpet

blackpoolkev wrote:

Bear in mind the effort needed to overcome wind resistance goes up very sharply with airspeed, in fact as a cube function.

I'm an expert, as I got an E in A level physics 31 years ago. Isn't it a square, as we're dealing with area, not volume? Anyway, we need a graph, preferably one with some nice colours.

centimani

coriordan wrote:

It will be as hard then as it is now. As someone said, it never gets easier, you just go faster. So keep suffering until you hate cycling so much you want to throw your bike into a ditch and never look at it again.

THEN you will have added 3mph.

A great deal of truth there...I upped my average by 2 mph over a season...and worked so hard to achieve it, it stopped being fun.

Also, when you've achieved that extra 3 mph, let me know which ditch you've chucked yer bike in

Millerman007

its just a matter of keeping on riding and you will get fitter and faster last year i could average 14-15 mph over 10 miles
after a year of riding i can average 17.5 over 60 miles and I'm 18 stone, i was 21 stone when i started, just keep at it

biscuit959

briantrumpet wrote:

blackpoolkev wrote:

Bear in mind the effort needed to overcome wind resistance goes up very sharply with airspeed, in fact as a cube function.

I'm an expert, as I got an E in A level physics 31 years ago. Isn't it a square, as we're dealing with area, not volume? Anyway, we need a graph, preferably one with some nice colours.

Pretty sure that Kev's correct, and I did get a D in A level physics haha but A in maths haha

Couldn't do nice colours sorry, but this graph shows it pretty well I think.
So to go from 0 to 100 requires only a little bit of power, but to double the speed from 100 to 200 is 4 times more(i.e. 2 squared times more). And there will be a point where there is an asymptote on the curve(where the curve approaches a line but never touches it, look it up lol). This means that even with an infinite amount of power you can never reach that value. Unless you are Jens Voigt of course

nbuuifx

I don't pay that much attention to my average as it depends so much on distance and terrain. It would only be any use if you always cycled the same route everytime which would be boring.

Having said that I do hope to up my average on any given route by swapping to a road bike in the near future so will be checking on it. On a good flat route I can get about 18ish average over a 30 mile ride on my MTB - would like to hit the magic 20 on a road bike!

springtide9

Just keep cycling and speed will come with time.

A good idea to increase speed might be to introduce interval type training, pushing harder for specific sections. You could also on some rides cut the distance and ride harder (or ride hard for 50% of the ride, and 'limp' home)

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

Terrain and wind has huge effects on average speeds, so you need to make sure you compare 'apples' with 'apples' in terms of performance.

bill57

If you cycle regularly and put in the appropriate effort, getting from 13mph to 16mph is perfectly achievable. It's getting from 16mph to 19mph that will kill you.

CiB

Advice I was given - that still holds - was 'pedal harder and faster'. That should see you add some MPHs on.

13 to 16 is quite doable; 17 & 18 is too but once you start getting up to around 20 mph averages that's some serious effort you're making. Reality is if you wanna go faster you gotta make more effort. That's what works for the rest of us.

fatdaz

springtide9 wrote:

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

I thought they all hurt - is this just me - does everybody else actually enjoy themselves?

cje

fatdaz wrote:

springtide9 wrote:

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

I thought they all hurt - is this just me - does everybody else actually enjoy themselves?

Dear God no! I do it for the elation of getting home and having a bath. The reason my average speed is reasonable is that I try to get it all over with in the shortest possible time.

Mikey23

Following the same principles I applied to road running, I do one ride a week over my time trial course of 10 miles at a speed that puts me under stress, the rest at steady endurance pace and focus on the strava segments where I find them. My tt is approaching 15 and the rest getting towards 13. Doesn't sound a lot but I live in Cornwall and it is rather hilly and I am 60. I am satisfied with my progress and try not to compare with anyone else. I can feel and measure that I am getting faster and stronger over time and that's all that matters to me

nbuuifx

fatdaz wrote:

springtide9 wrote:

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

I thought they all hurt - is this just me - does everybody else actually enjoy themselves?

Last year was my first proper year of cycling and I got some sort of ache after every ride. This year I seem to have got to the point where to get any aching I really have to push it and even then any aching is gone by the morning (I used to hobble around the next day with aching thighs etc)

The only things I have done are, after a long or hard ride I try and drink a pint of milk as soon as I get back. I'm also eating eggs a bit more. Other than that it could just be that my body has got used to it?

I quite enjoy just about every ride

springtide9

nbuuifx wrote:

fatdaz wrote:

springtide9 wrote:

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

I thought they all hurt - is this just me - does everybody else actually enjoy themselves?

Last year was my first proper year of cycling and I got some sort of ache after every ride. This year I seem to have got to the point where to get any aching I really have to push it and even then any aching is gone by the morning (I used to hobble around the next day with aching thighs etc)

The only things I have done are, after a long or hard ride I try and drink a pint of milk as soon as I get back. I'm also eating eggs a bit more. Other than that it could just be that my body has got used to it?

I quite enjoy just about every ride

It sounds like you have got used to your current effort. Most rides I can say 'don't hurt' and the following day I'm good to go again. Long rides obviously take their toll and take a bit longer to recover.

The last few months (mainly due to shortage of time and the weather).. I have been concentrating on increasing speed (but probably at the expense of endurance as haven't done a long ride for a while), using interval work.

When I talk about making a ride hurt... it's not about pushing hard for hours on end.. it's about really hard pushes for short periods of time (but repeated during an overall ride, but with 'rest' periods inbetween).

If you use a HR monitor... it's about staying at 95+ % Max HR (or as high as you can stand) for short periods. e.g. 1 mins & 5 mins. 10 min and 20 min efforts are also good bt obviously not at the same effort. And keep repeating these multiple times during a ride, remembering to recover between efforts (not stopping, but allowing yourself to recover by cycling with less effort). If you use Strava, there are lots of 1 min and 5 min segments around to allow you to track progress (or you can create them)
Generally, at the end of a very hard 5 min push I will feel very light headed and often very close to throwing up (and not because I have just eaten!). Once recovered (a little), repeat, repeat, repeat....
The following day my legs will know they have been pushed.

After a while, you should be able to see a trend on increasing your "power" for these interval sessions (if you use Strava, by seeing your segment times reduce)

I think it's stated/guesstimated that your FTP (1 hour power) is 95% of your 20 min power (and 1 min, 5 min, 20 min power all have relationships), so increasing these shorter intervals also increases your power for the longer sessions.

I have bought the 'training books' (and have had a quick read)... but the training plans were overly complex and not something that I figured I could easily do and keep the rides enjoyable (it's not like I'm trying to be an Elite racer at 40+ years of age), so this has been my attempt at trying to improve but keeping rides enjoyable.

It seems to be working so far with noticeable improvements, although probably best not to quote any improvement data to confuse matters. I have a powermeter, but only for the last month or so, so I don't really have enough data to really give firm increases.

I also have been riding more during the week than normal, which has obviously helped with my fitness, so the interval training is just one of a few factors that could be due to my improvement.

Alex_Simmons/RST

briantrumpet wrote:

blackpoolkev wrote:

Bear in mind the effort needed to overcome wind resistance goes up very sharply with airspeed, in fact as a cube function.

I'm an expert, as I got an E in A level physics 31 years ago. Isn't it a square, as we're dealing with area, not volume? Anyway, we need a graph, preferably one with some nice colours.

The power-speed equation is cubic, not quadratic.

ianbar

well this morning was the current benchmark my local sportive! 42 miles averaging 14.4mph pretty pleased with it actually, at one point had delusions of 15mph lol so not as much of an increase required as i thought although having targets in front is a good incentive

snoopsmydogg

fatdaz wrote:

springtide9 wrote:

The saying, no pain no gain really does hold true. Making some of your rides hurt (and allow time for recovery) will be a big benefit.

I thought they all hurt - is this just me - does everybody else actually enjoy themselves?

wouldn't do it if I didnt enjoy it. pain doesnt last long but the extra weight loss/fitness/speed stays for longer

Mikey23

42 at 14.4 sounds excellent. Hope for similar in a fairly flat 60 tomorrow

The point about fast and slow hard and easy is a good one which I hadn't fully grasped as how to cycle and improve. What runners would call fartlek (speed play) which is pretty much what it says on the tin. Emphasis being on testing yourself in an enjoyable way...

ianbar

well i tend to try and hit the local climbs as often as i can which helps i think like in running hills are speed work in disguise plus of course will make me faster on the climbs too.its more the false flats or long low climbs that damage my times.today thought i worked on what i should do relatively better...flats and downhill and using my power to gain as much time as i could.