Tubeless Vs. inner tube

stone28

Hi Guys,

I have rims which are apparently tubeless ready (Ritchey WCS). What are the advantages of going tubeless? Is it worth doing? If rims are tubeless ready I imagine I would just need to change to special tyres right? Is there anything else I need -hmmm probably special valve as well?

Thanks for all advice.

VWsurfbum

Spend a bit of time doing a search for peoples opinions.
Mine would be yes its worth it, depending on the system depends if you need new tyres (i dont use specific tubeless ready)
Yes you will need a new valve.
Advantages lower rolling resistance,
Less punctures / pinch flats
Disadvantages, a right Faff the first time you do it, if you can get someone to help who has done it before.

stone28

My tyres are Continental SpeedKing 2.1 (26x2.1)

Ok, so it looks like it's not that straight forward to switch/change.... hmm... Shame but as you say it's definitively worth doing so have to investigate more.....

Thewaylander

VWsurfbum wrote:

Spend a bit of time doing a search for peoples opinions.
Mine would be yes its worth it, depending on the system depends if you need new tyres (i dont use specific tubeless ready)
Yes you will need a new valve.
Advantages lower rolling resistance,
Less punctures / pinch flats
Disadvantages, a right Faff the first time you do it, if you can get someone to help who has done it before.

How does it provide lower rollng resistance? surface area of the tyre should be the same, and the friction levels of the rubber of the tyre wouldn't have changed either?

This is a genuine question? not trying to annoy or anything

njee20

How does it provide lower rollng resistance? surface area of the tyre should be the same, and the friction levels of the rubber of the tyre wouldn't have changed either?

It's to do with the amount of rubber one is deforming, ie less because you've not got the tube as well, so the tyre is more supple.

Thewaylander

Ok but surely this would put more rubbber in contact with the ground, therefor increasing resistance? Or am I missing something?

nicklouse

Thewaylander wrote:

Ok but surely this would put more rubbber in contact with the ground, therefor increasing resistance? Or am I missing something?

yes but you are still not deflecting the tube as well.

it is a bit of give and take on that one.

for a given pressure the resistance is less.

mrmonkfinger

nicklouse wrote:

for a given pressure the resistance is less.

...which then goes out the window, because you can run lower pressures without snakebites.

That aside, apparently (for us off roaders) lower pressure = lower rolling resistance.

njee20

I think there's a vast amount of conjecture and subjectivity on anything around rolling resistance! I'd not say there's much in it either way myself.

Thewaylander

Ah now that makes sense, so the force required to colapse the tube is greater than additional rolling resistance extra tread on the ground creates. so more grip plus less resistance due to force required to deform the innertube? roughly speaking?

Majski

I would say run tubeless. They feel a bit more 'pingy' off stuff if that makes sense (it does in my head) but much less hassle. You'll probably also want some tyre sealant to stick in there incase you get a thorn.

Regarding fitting I've just done a couple of sets and it wasn't too bad. Put the valve in and tighten lightly with pliers (not too tight), seat one tyre bead, pour some tyre spunk in, seat rest of bead and lie the wheel flat on your knees. Some poeple put fairy liquid around the tyre wall to help a quick seal - but I didn't have to. Then blast it up with a c02 cartridge. I didn't even bother trying with a pump.

cooldad

IM(not)HO - no.

Banxi

done mine today tried with a track pump with no luck had a look at co2 but was shocked at the price so i got hold of a can of air duster witch is just compressed air in a can worked a treat was quite shocked how easy it went up.

Chunkers1980

Please enlighten us to this air duster. Sounds like a very good idea.

mrmonkfinger

http://www.play.com/PC/PCs/4-/15407335/ ... d:15407335

£4 a shot?

think I'll stick with my diy coke bottle reservoir...

cat_with_no_tail

My advice is that if you've got proper tubeless rims, get some proper tubeless tyres and a little sealant (not essential) and give it a go.

I tried it and liked it and will now stick with it. Most of the people I know who don't like tubeless never actually tried it *properly* anyway. The ghetto setups seem a bit hit/miss.

There can be either a weight loss, or a weight gain, it really depends on what tyre/tube combo you were using to start with. I was already using snakeskin tyres with thick tubes, so there is a (minimal) weight saving for me. If you're using flyweight tyres and ultra-thin tubes, you'd most likely have a slight weight gain.

The main advantage for me is no more snakebites, ever. In 2 years I've had 2 flats on the trail, both times it was a sliced tyre and both times I'd have been fooked either way. That's a dramatic reduction for me. Means I can plough through the big sharp edged rockes without worrying about it (too much).

mrmonkfinger

Cat With No Tail wrote:

The main advantage for me is no more snakebites, ever.

Good summary, +potato, etc.

Banxi

Its just compressed air in a can like said you can get it from 4 quid but the 200ml can will easy do 10 tires. Whats this about dite coke? I love diy

giantAstax

I've run tubeless for the past 12 months with only I problem when I popped the seal on the front tyre out on the trail. Did just about get enough air back in to ride 'home'. Other than that no punctures at all despite running no more than 30psi and I'm a lardy b@sta@rd at 16 st.

No idea about any other benefits though. Running on tubeless rims with Stans fluid.

mrmonkfinger

Banxi wrote:

Its just compressed air in a can like said you can get it from 4 quid but the 200ml can will easy do 10 tires. Whats this about dite coke? I love diy

in action:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePbjM6wQ1I8&feature=g-upl

cooldad

giantAstax wrote:

I've run tubeless for the past 12 months with only I problem when I popped the seal on the front tyre out on the trail. Did just about get enough air back in to ride 'home'. Other than that no punctures at all despite running no more than 30psi and I'm a lardy b@sta@rd at 16 st.

No idea about any other benefits though. Running on tubeless rims with Stans fluid.

I've not had a puncture for almost three years. And never had a tyre pop off the rim, which by your logic makes tubes better than tubeless.

mrmonkfinger

cooldad wrote:

I've not had a puncture for almost three years.

Lucky you!

cooldad

mrmonkfinger wrote:

cooldad wrote:

I've not had a puncture for almost three years.

Lucky you!

Nope, slow - everyone in front of me picks up the thorns etc.

mrmonkfinger

your ride buddies aren't in one of these things are they?

bails87

Cat With No Tail wrote:

My advice is that if you've got proper tubeless rims, get some proper tubeless tyres and a little sealant (not essential) and give it a go.

I agree with what you've said in as much as I tried a conversion and it was just a pain. Unreliable and then messier to fix than a tube due to sealant spraying everywhere.

But I still got pinch flats. A couple of times I put a hole in the tyre itself, only small but the sealant just sharted out without sealing. Obviously that would have meant a puncture on a tubed setup, but I wouldn't have wrecked a pair of gloves by covering them in sealant replacing a punctured tube.

If I ever get a new set of wheels they'll be on stans rims just because they seem to be the best about, and I'll give it a try, but as said above, do it properly or don;t bother.

bennett_346

I wouldn't bother. If you get that upset by the occasional 5 minute puncture repair or care about the slightly lower amount of grip from tubes then i think you need to reassess why you're riding in the first place.

njee20

I wouldn't have wrecked a pair of gloves by covering them in sealant replacing a punctured tube.

Why would sealant ruin gloves? Even if you do get it on your clothes it washes straight out... :?

mystery h

just go for it, i crossed over two years ago and have never looked back

no punctures, no messing around fitting tubes, just top the fluid up periodically and you should be fine

you can see the patches of sealant on the tyre where it has come through in the process of sealing and it is suprising how many punctures i would have suffered running tubes

you know it makes sense

Chunkers1980

Not all holes in tubeless (where you see the seal) would have caused a puncture in a tubed wheel.

allthegearnoidea

ive been on tubeless now for 18 months, currently using one tubeless and one not tyre, mainly due to a heavy angled landing when 4rsing about off a tree route on the side of the path on the school run, caused a burp and stretched the bead edge a smidge! had a couple of issue on the rear one (non tubeless tyre), mainly down using the sealant and not pouring it in through the valve, - learnt now!! but the frotns been spot on, in the time its been on ive only ever put about 10psi in it!
its one of those things that i'd heard about all over the forums, but untill i tried it i had no idea how much different it Can feel, twice ive had to put a tube in the rear due to managing to snap the american clasasic valves (look nice but not very strong) and you can certainly notice the difference!

give it a go and see what you think, as someone mentioned up a lot, A Lot of the people that slate tubeless havent Actually tried it!

cooldad

allthegearnoidea wrote:

burp, a couple of issues, managing to snap valves

So it's a faff.