Cycling forum or not

Frank the tank

COME ON ENGLAND do the Azzure tonight. NO APPOLOGIES AT ALL!!!!!!

I love cycling and football too,I'm gagging for tonights game a couple of beers (at home) and hopefully a date with the Germans.

Cleat Eastwood

Cycling forum or not

mmmm I say not.

Le Commentateur

Anthems on - time to pop over to the offie for some supplies.

verylonglegs

We are gash, thank god we got beat.

Cleat Eastwood

woy has us playing like fulham. first half not too bad, but it would been a poor decision had we got to the semis. bottom line we are just not good enough.

Smokin Joe

Rooney was awful. He just doesn't do it at international level, Defoe would have been a better bet.

Le Commentateur

Well, we were like an unfit rider in a 4th cat race. Good for 30 minutes then out the back forever after.

One other thing: Penalties are not an option. Contingencies are for losers.

Frank the tank

If you lack ambition you can't complain if you achieve nowt.

However, I still think Woy is the man for the job.

Defenders taking penalties though?

verylonglegs

Most of the blame lies with our limited pool of players to pick from overall which isn't the managers fault. The only real crticism I have of Roy was Henderson coming on, I'd have rather seen Chamberlain and some throw caution to the wind attacking for ET than pens that we ended with.

heavymental

Predictable demise of a team that can't keep the ball. Did ok for the first half then all Italy. England players just aren't technically as good as their opposition. This is true for most teams they face, including Algeria in the World Cup. Its far easier to play the game with the ball than without it. Can't blame Roy. What can you do when your players run into trouble and lose the ball. Basics. No surprise either. Followed the same pattern as every majopr tournament we play in. Wasn't there an investigation/report into why we're so sh1t a couple of years back?

CiB

Smokin Joe wrote:

Rooney was awful. He just doesn't do it at international level, Defoe would have been a better bet.

This is the core of it - we have an apparent talisman who will guide the team through to greater glory yet the reality is that in all the tournaments he's played in the man's a liability not an asset. Tonight his ability to turn and run into a clutch of defenders and emerge without the ball was his most consistent trait, and let's compare and contrast his 'wonder goal' v man city (the overhead kick into the top corner) with his comedy attempt tonight. Drop him, or play in the qualifying rounds the tell him he's not needed in the tournament thanks. It won't matter - he'll be at his last tournament in Brazil anyway so save the excess baggage and leave the fat useless twunt at home, rather than build him up as the saviour of a nation only for him to have us clutching our heads in despair again.

And while I'm at it, Ashley Young should stick to winning penalties, not taking them.

nicensleazy

Well, not being a particular football person, I did watch last nights game. This really confirmed my opinion about England and the game in general. The Italians deserved to win, they were indeed the far better team. They were more hungry for victory!

I did make me laugh when playing into extra time, the commentator stated that Rooney didn't have the legs to play into the extra time. These are so called professional football players that supposedly train. You can just imagine a member of the pro cycling team saying, he didn't have the legs to finish a particular race.

All I can say, well done Italy....you were by far the better team!

vitesse169

...having said all that, after 2hrs of football the Azzuri still could not put one past a v mediocre team - that must be something in the +ve for the English defence, must it ???

fast as fupp

Rooneh drinks and smokes- that says it all.

it looked like he had t1ts last night as well

DavidBelcher

verylonglegs wrote:

Most of the blame lies with our limited pool of players to pick from overall which isn't the managers fault. The only real crticism I have of Roy was Henderson coming on, I'd have rather seen Chamberlain and some throw caution to the wind attacking for ET than pens that we ended with.

I would've taken Young off well before extra time, too. Kept losing possession too easily (lack of confidence?), would have been better leaving Milner on. Ah well, benefit of hindsight and all that....

Johnson was easily the stand-out England man last night, worked his socks off and seemed to be here, there and everywhere with some good attacking play as well as defending.

David

airbag

vitesse169 wrote:

...having said all that, after 2hrs of football the Azzuri still could not put one past a v mediocre team - that must be something in the +ve for the English defence, must it ???

It shows that Joey Hart should be awarded man of the match - he was on spectacular form and held the england side up IMO.

Pross

Is anyone aware of any statistics based on international teams performances versus the squad average wage? England would surely rank very lowly in that. I'm not anti the English football team but I am glad to see the back of them as the media had started to build them up in their usual way after they qualified top in a mediocre group (I'm especially glad that the smug look will have been wiped off Adrian Chiles' face although I was hoping Roy Keane would punch his lights out ). Last night they looked like a team playing for penalties from at least the start of the second half, it was good to see such negativity get what it deserved.

Come on Germany, do it for my £30 sweep stake win!

Pross

airbag wrote:

vitesse169 wrote:

...having said all that, after 2hrs of football the Azzuri still could not put one past a v mediocre team - that must be something in the +ve for the English defence, must it ???

It shows that Joey Hart should be awarded man of the match - he was on spectacular form and held the england side up IMO.

Really? I can't recall him having that much to do despite the Italian's domination. I thought Glen Johnson was the best player but also Italy just lacked the finishing to go with their passing play.

CiB

Add John Terry to that; he blocked everything that came his way and played as though it meant something to him, unlike Rooney and Young. Hart barely had a save to make and put a couple of clearances straight out for throw-ins so MotM is a bit much for him. Terry or Johnson would get my vote. Another of Hart's failings was that despite being flagged up as World's Number One Keeper, he only got close to one penalty. The rest he was nowhere; exactly the same situation as Shilton v Germany in 1990 in fact, world's best keeper, didn't look like saving one of them.

I got the impression that Italy fairly quickly had Milner sorted out, then Young (who was largley ineffective), and especially Rooney - once the Italians had got him weighed up he was a complete waste of space; Hodgson really should have taken him off rather than persevering with something that wasn't working.

Yossie

Hart Man of the Match? You serious?

Pirlo was well deserved M of the M - a lesson on the pitch for every single English player and schollkid wanting to be any kind of footballer.

En-ger-land were outclassed - time to wake up and smell the coffee lads. Why there are still people in the crowd crying I don't know - surely they can't be expecting any better by now?

Final stats according to the papers are

Shots on TargetEngland: 1
Italy: 8

Total shotsEngland: 9
Italy: 36

Passes England: 364
Italy: 833 (eight hundred and thirty three!!!!!!!!!!!!)

PossessionEngland: 32%
Italy: 68%

End of lads - ciao, ciao, ciao, ciao Wayne et al. Enjoy your summer shopping at the Trafford Centre.

airbag

Pross wrote:

Really? I can't recall him having that much to do despite the Italian's domination. I thought Glen Johnson was the best player but also Italy just lacked the finishing to go with their passing play.

Johnson would definitely be my second choice, but I felt Hart made a couple of great saves and was generally the most 'on the ball' so to speak. Even as an armchair critic I'm probably ignorant though.

Ben6899

IMHO, scapegoating one or a few individual players is completely missing the point. England were undone by their own tactics: playing defensively, not man-marking Pirlo and - when attacking - trying to be too expansive and not concentrating on posession.

Who here has played football competetively? Think back to the games when you've had not just an off-day, but a real sh1tter; I'll bet the team came away with no points. Football is a team sport, if the majority of your mates are struggling, then there's a massive chance you will be as well.

Against Italy, the whole team under performed and on top of that there were some awful performances from one or two players: Rooney, Young, Milner, Gerrard, Parker were all found wanting. But they mustn't be scapegoated; they were victims of the system and one of the best midfield performances I have seen in a very long time. Pirlo in the main, backed up by de Rossi doing the leg work.

You'll remember a certain midfielder being made a pariah back in 1998. "Liability", "can't beat a man", "can't head the ball", "too busy stepping out with his celebrity wife" etc. 4 years later, all those knuckle-dragging heathens are lauding him as hero for his freekick against Greece and then praying for him to score from 12 yards against Argentina. Make your fuck1ng minds up.

Gerrard was England's most consistent performer this time around. Ashley Cole has been the most consistent for the past decade. Much of the squad craves experience and self-belief.

CiB

Ben6899 wrote:

You'll remember a certain midfielder being made a pariah back in 1998. "Liability", "can't beat a man", "can't head the ball", "too busy stepping out with his celebrity wife" etc. 4 years later, all those knuckle-dragging heathens are lauding him as hero for his freekick against Greece and then praying for him to score from 12 yards against Argentina. Make your fuck1ng minds up.

You mean Beckham? I made my mind up then yeah, when he did his act of petulant stupidity and in one moronic act reduced quite substantially England's chances of beating Argentina. Fair do's to the bloke he picked himself up and reinvented himself, but he deserved a lot of the flak (if not the death threats and mock hangings of his effigy) that came his way in the immediate aftermath. The fact that some years later he grew up and become a reliable dependable player is good but I've given up hoping that Shrek will ever become the sort of player that England can rely on in their moment of need, as witnessed by his repeated failings at the last few tournaments. How long does he need? How many times are England going to fail to progress because their talisman, their one true world class player ((c) all newspapers) has been found wanting when it matters?

I've lost hope - every tournament since 1970 resulting in yet another honourable, not so honourable or complete and utter failure to trouble the match day programme printers for The Final. After 42 years of it it gets a bit boring, this hope and then the repeated failure.

Ben6899

CiB wrote:

I've given up hoping that Shrek will ever become the sort of player that England can rely on in their moment of need, as witnessed by his repeated failings at the last few tournaments. How long does he need? How many times are England going to fail to progress because their talisman, their one true world class player ((c) all newspapers) has been found wanting when it matters?

He does the business for United. Consistently. What does that tell us?

It tells us that he obviously benefits from being surrounded by better players - as we all would. It's not enough to rely on one player to drag a nation through European and World Cups. We don't rely on Ashley Young or James Milner to do it. They're fine players, but not true world class: they were average at best all tournament and yet they aren't being blamed for England's failure - yet again - to bring home the gold.

Ronaldo - as gifted as he is - will be further proof against the one-player theory this evening, when I fear Spain will knock out Portugal. However; I hope he proves me wrong and makes that next step to being one of the greatest ever.

PS. good debate, at least none of us are talking bollocks or stood next to a very fine line like a certain someone in Commuting Chat!

daviesee

CiB wrote:

After 42 years of it it gets a bit boring, this hope and then the repeated failure.

At least you have hope.
Last time we had hope was '78 and look how that turned out.

Pross

daviesee wrote:

CiB wrote:

After 42 years of it it gets a bit boring, this hope and then the repeated failure.

At least you have hope.
Last time we had hope was '78 and look how that turned out.

'78? That's a mere 34 years, my nation hasn't qualified for a tournament final in over half a century and even then it was by default!

CiB

daviesee wrote:

CiB wrote:

After 42 years of it it gets a bit boring, this hope and then the repeated failure.

At least you have hope.
Last time we had hope was '78 and look how that turned out.

Thing is, in 78 you actually no hope whatsoever. One tuneless song and a ragbag assortment of players who'd never been that far abroad doesn't make a World Cup winning team.

daviesee

CiB wrote:

daviesee wrote:

Thing is, in 78 you actually no hope whatsoever. One tuneless song and a ragbag assortment of players who'd never been that far abroad doesn't make a World Cup winning team.

Check out the squad. We had some damned fine players back in the day....
Buchan, McQueen, Rioch, Masson, Dalgleish, Jordan, Hartford, Gemmill, Macari, Souness, Robertson, Burns.
And thats just the ones you will know. The others playing in Scotland weren't too bad either.
Main problem was that they believed all the hype and thought they could win it whilst going out on the lash and s#@gging all and sundry. The autobiographies are very "interesting" but damning.

rick_chasey

I'm bored with possession and passing stats.

They don't mean sh!t unless both teams play a possession game.

verylonglegs

At least the underpants salesman and surrounding circus won't be blighting the olympic football.

Frank the tank

Rick Chasey wrote:

I'm bored with possession and passing stats.

They don't mean sh!t unless both teams play a possession game.

There is only one stat that matters.