Canyon Ultimate 9.0 Ultegra Di2

baldwin471

Hi everyone. Thinking about upgrading to this lovely beast but would like some advice as to any alternatives at the price point. Also, has anyone on ridden or own the Canyon Ultimate 9.0 Di2? How do you find the Electronic group set? Is it a big improvement over mechanical? The other thing is that the frame is aluminium. My current bike (Boardman team carbon 2011) is obviously a carbon frame and I've read a lot about how aluminium is quite a lot harsher than carbon. The roads around my area are pretty atrocious so I'm not sure if i want a rougher ride or is the Di2 worth the pain? Cheers. Alex.

baldwin471

79 views and no comments? Come on guys help me out! Haha that sounded desperate.

cogidubnus

Why not buy one of the ultimate CF's?

baldwin471

Cogidubnus wrote:

Why not buy one of the ultimate CF's?

I can't go over £1900. The Ultimate AL 9.0 is £1869 and the only CF in my price range is the 9.0 which is also Ultegra but not Di2. So does Di2 Ultegra being better than Ultegra mechanical outweigh Aluminium vs Carbon frame?

speshsteve

Think I'd go carbon, like the idea of Di2 but surely your better off putting your money into the frame 1st and my personal pref is carbon over Alu (he waits for the many replies stating that Alu is superior in every way!).

northpole

I have no direct experience with Canyon bikes but if you want some opinions:
- a friend has a Canyon carbon fibre bike which came with super record - light as a feather and he's super pleased with it.
- another friend has a new bike with ultegra di2 - he loves it; it makes great whirring noises changing between front rings; but I have to say the rear derailler is pig ugly; a decent mechanical shifting groupset pound for pound will be lighter.
- Dura ace is about to be reinvented with 11 speed mechanical system closely followed by new electro version. My understanding is that the 2nd gen DA will spawn others incl ultegra to have a standard platform with upgradable components for ultegra etc. What this means is that 10 speed ultegra will soon be very old hat and like last year's computer you'll have thrown a right chunk of money down the drain.
- Generally speaking (there are exceptions) aluminium frames will feed alot more road buzz back through your hands/ wrists/ backside and be more uncomfortable/ fatiguing over longer rides. Some carbon frames can be harsh too.

In summary, my opinion, you'd be mad as a hatter to spend best part of £2k on ali frame with 10 speed ultegra di2.

Well, you did ask for opinions!

Peter

baldwin471

northpole wrote:

I have no direct experience with Canyon bikes but if you want some opinions:
- a friend has a Canyon carbon fibre bike which came with super record - light as a feather and he's super pleased with it.
- another friend has a new bike with ultegra di2 - he loves it; it makes great whirring noises changing between front rings; but I have to say the rear derailler is pig ugly; a decent mechanical shifting groupset pound for pound will be lighter.
- Dura ace is about to be reinvented with 11 speed mechanical system closely followed by new electro version. My understanding is that the 2nd gen DA will spawn others incl ultegra to have a standard platform with upgradable components for ultegra etc. What this means is that 10 speed ultegra will soon be very old hat and like last year's computer you'll have thrown a right chunk of money down the drain.
- Generally speaking (there are exceptions) aluminium frames will feed alot more road buzz back through your hands/ wrists/ backside and be more uncomfortable/ fatiguing over longer rides. Some carbon frames can be harsh too.

In summary, my opinion, you'd be mad as a hatter to spend best part of £2k on ali frame with 10 speed ultegra di2.

Well, you did ask for opinions!

Peter

Thanks very much Peter. Some very helpful points there. So what would you recommend for sub £2000? Preferably something with 11-28 rear cassette and compact chain set and SRAM/Campag

ALaPlage

For what it's worth as I cannot comment on the Canyon as I have never seen one in the flesh so to speak never mind got my leg over one but I have moved from an aluminium bike to carbon and now have a carbon Trek Madone 5.9 with Di2

From my experience stick with the Carbon frame as your priority as the ride is definetly smother in my experience. If the Canyon CF frame is Di2 compatible you could always upgrade later if you wanted.

As to Di2. It is brilliant. I also don't find it that ugly as many do as on the bike the gloss grey of the groupset looks pretty Swish. Smooth and quick changes with no rattling or chain bouncing as it tries to engage the cog. Just clicks up and down seamlessly. Also pushing on uphill then changing gear without backing off the pressure is pretty good as it doesn't upset your rythmn. The electronic kit does the work of taking the tension off the chain whilst it changes leaving you to keep the pedal action rolling.

So tough call I guess but my priority would be the carbon frame with a quality mechanical groupset over an Alu frame with Di2.

baldwin471

ALaPlage wrote:

For what it's worth as I cannot comment on the Canyon as I have never seen one in the flesh so to speak never mind got my leg over one but I have moved from an aluminium bike to carbon and now have a carbon Trek Madone 5.9 with Di2

From my experience stick with the Carbon frame as your priority as the ride is definetly smother in my experience. If the Canyon CF frame is Di2 compatible you could always upgrade later if you wanted.

As to Di2. It is brilliant. I also don't find it that ugly as many do as on the bike the gloss grey of the groupset looks pretty Swish. Smooth and quick changes with no rattling or chain bouncing as it tries to engage the cog. Just clicks up and down seamlessly. Also pushing on uphill then changing gear without backing off the pressure is pretty good as it doesn't upset your rythmn. The electronic kit does the work of taking the tension off the chain whilst it changes leaving you to keep the pedal action rolling.

So tough call I guess but my priority would be the carbon frame with a quality mechanical groupset over an Alu frame with Di2.

Thanks a lot for that. I'm thinking of just purchasing parts from the LBS and maybe getting them to set it up for me. That way might be able to combine a CF frame with Di2.

ALaPlage

Not sure if it helps but Evans were offering the Jamis Bike in a carbon frame with Di2 reduced end of season to £2399 as per link below. I know it's over budget but may be cheaper than buying Di2 separately for fitting.

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/jam ... e-ec031738

baldwin471

ALaPlage wrote:

Not sure if it helps but Evans were offering the Jamis Bike in a carbon frame with Di2 reduced end of season to £2399 as per link below. I know it's over budget but may be cheaper than buying Di2 separately for fitting.

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/jam ... e-ec031738

Yeah is a bit over budget to be honest. Also i would like an 11-28 with 34/50 if possible, as my area is very very hilly and I'm still not very good uphill yet.

northpole

Thanks very much Peter. Some very helpful points there. So what would you recommend for sub £2000? Preferably something with 11-28 rear cassette and compact chain set and SRAM/Campag

If I were in your position, I'd stick with the bike I have. If the Boardman has a standard chainset and a 12-25 cassette, your most economical solution would be to buy a compact crankset, new cassette and chain and try that out for this summer season. This will give you a really good idea on any geometry issues and let you make an informed decision on any change of frame or bike for next season.

Otherwise, you'll lose a packet on the amount paid for the Boardman and you may well end up with a bike still not quite to your liking.

Not sure what groupset you have on the Boardman, but you don't have to go mad with new crankset and cassette - 105 or Veloce should be fine to give you a good idea.

Peter

baldwin471

northpole wrote:

Thanks very much Peter. Some very helpful points there. So what would you recommend for sub £2000? Preferably something with 11-28 rear cassette and compact chain set and SRAM/Campag

If I were in your position, I'd stick with the bike I have. If the Boardman has a standard chainset and a 12-25 cassette, your most economical solution would be to buy a compact crankset, new cassette and chain and try that out for this summer season. This will give you a really good idea on any geometry issues and let you make an informed decision on any change of frame or bike for next season.

Otherwise, you'll lose a packet on the amount paid for the Boardman and you may well end up with a bike still not quite to your liking.

Not sure what groupset you have on the Boardman, but you don't have to go mad with new crankset and cassette - 105 or Veloce should be fine to give you a good idea.

Peter

I have the 105 Groupset and 34/50 compact crankset with 12-25 cassette. The problem with the board man is everything seems to keep going wrong. I've probably ridden less than 100 miles in two months of ownership, due to things going wrong and it going back and forth from the LBS (Not halfords, a proper bicycle store). So I'm not 100% sure. That Di2 is luring me in....

ShutUpLegs

The limited edition Di2 canyon looks a stunner, stiff frame but not harsh, probably because of the quality of the carbon forks and seatpost. Personally I'd go for better wheels than the gruppo.

northpole

You already have a compact chainset - even better!! A decent mechanic will have your gear shifts working perfectly. A poor mechanic will almost certainly make your life a misery faffing about, not quite sorting it. I'm not sure if you are having fundamental component problems or just the hangover of a bike being set up by the kind folks at Halfords. If the latter, save yourself a pile of cash, swap over the cassette for a 12-28 and go spend a few months getting some miles in - if you have only done a few hundred miles I wouldn't even bother changing the chain.

The di2 provides a good gear change and the particularly neat thing about it is the constant correction of the front derailer to make sure the chain never snags, but honestly, if your gears are set up properly, you will rarely suffer this minor inconvenience. And remember, di2 will become obsolete when shimano follow campag and introduce their replacement 11 speed groupsets. My understanding is that existing shimano wheels will not be compatible with the new 11 speed cassettes.

Peter

antonyfromoz

As with all bike choices, in the end you just have to decide what works for you but the bike radar review of the Canyon with Di2 was very positive about its ride characteristics despite the alloy frame: http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... 2-12-45907

Good luck whatever you decide!

DHA987S

Am sort of in the same boat. Am looking for a Di2 bike but don't want to spend the £3500 that most of the mainstream manufacturers are charging for a Di2 bike. I looked at Rose and Canyon and you can get an alu fram Di2 bike for under £2k as you know. The Rose allows more customisation but of course that increases price. Canyon offers a pretty decent spec for the money when you look at the bits other than the groupset.

On the carbon v alu Di2 canyon bike there are two things, first the cost. £1900 v £2700 is quite a jump irrespective of anyones budget. Secondly have a look at the weights, canyon list the alu as 7.55kg and the carbon as 7.6kg - not a massive amount but it flies in the face of carbon is super light compared to aluminium. The comfort thing I can't really comment on, but if you look at the limited number of reviews of the Ultimate Al they all comment that the frame is comfortable, have yet to see one that says it is a harsh frame (the seatpost might have a fair amount to do with this though).

Whilst there is the new 11 speed dura ace Di2 coming out, it will be no doubt as expensive again as the current Dura Ace Di2. The reviews of Ultegra Di2 also say that the shift quality is pretty much the same as the DA version, would an amateur notice this?

And for the OP, keep an eye on Canyon prices (I have) the flucutate with the € and the AL is now £1879!

gabriel959

The weight difference is all down to the different wheels. The Cosmic Elite in the carbon one are 100g heavier than the Ksyrium Equipes in the alu one. In any case the Aeroroad frame is not built for weight saving but for aero.

giant_man

you guys need to get your leg over a decent carbon bike, they all vary in feel as do aluminium frames. I would go for carbon for nearly two grand, whatever the groupset quite frankly. Don't get too excited about the whole di2 thing, very nice though it is. The LE canyon is hardly a looker, though ....

nferrar

A good alu frame is better than a bad carbon one, that said both the alu and carbon canyon frames always get good reviews. Although Ui2 is tempting I'd go carbon + mechanical personally as I reckon the novelty of the Ui2 shifting would soon wear off and then you'd be left wondering how much better the carbon frame one would have been. Also Ui2 mechs are FUGLY.

bisoner

I've got a Canyon Aeroad CF 9.0 - coming from to SRAM Rival to Dura Ace is night and day for me. Gear changes are now so slick and quiet. I did have a go in a store on a Di2 equipped bike and whilst nice, unless it goes fully wireless, I don't see it as a big step up from mechanical. This will be down to personal preference though.

If I were in your shoes, I'd get the Ultimate CF 8. Standard Ultegra is bullet proof and it's an excellent and proven carbon frame.

baldwin471

bisoner wrote:

I've got a Canyon Aeroad CF 9.0 - coming from to SRAM Rival to Dura Ace is night and day for me. Gear changes are now so slick and quiet. I did have a go in a store on a Di2 equipped bike and whilst nice, unless it goes fully wireless, I don't see it as a big step up from mechanical. This will be down to personal preference though.

If I were in your shoes, I'd get the Ultimate CF 8. Standard Ultegra is bullet proof and it's an excellent and proven carbon frame.

Cheers for the feedback. Out of interest, how much better is the dura ace than the 105? At the moment the 105 seems very noisy and clunky when changing gears.

styxd

Noisy and clunky gears will be down to poor setup or worn out cables.

Set it up properly!

baldwin471

styxd wrote:

Noisy and clunky gears will be down to poor setup or worn out cables.

Set it up properly!

I've taken it to the lbs 3 times now and it is fine for a day and then starts clunking again. Gears have been aligned and cables are new. Can't do much more than I have without buying a new group set, and if that's the case I may as well upgrade the whole thing.

styxd

If the cables are new then they end up bedding in after a few rides. They'll need tweaking again to sort them out.

OfficerDigby

I've taken it to the lbs 3 times now and it is fine for a day and then starts clunking again. Gears have been aligned and cables are new. Can't do much more than I have without buying a new group set, and if that's the case I may as well upgrade the whole thing.

Probably just need to tighten the cable barrel adjusters as they stretch a bit!


Di2 - because CBA on gear indexing?!....

It's probably not what it was originally developed and marketed for however WFDIK. Go for it!.

P.s. Out of interest what else went wrong with the Boardman?

jonny_trousers

No offence Baldwin, but I wonder if you should maybe take a little step back with your desire for such an expensive bike given your road cycling experience and the fact that money clearly is some kind of an issue. I can sympathise fully as I'm forever considering purchases I can't really afford and for the wrong reasons just because I get carried away.

Like someone has already said, get the Boardman (a very highly reviewed bike) set up properly (time to change LBS, I'd say), maybe treat yourself to a nice set of wheels, and force yourself to put the hard work in with your training. If you hit your goals you can promise yourself a nice, blingy bike next year. I have no problem with people buying themselves flash bikes they really don't need if they have the money to do so (I would too), but if you're at all like the vast majority of us, have a look at what you really need to do to improve your riding before considering expensive purchases.

Killjoy lecture over!

gsk82

i've just got a cf slx 9.0sl and love it.

i'd definately go for the carbon frame with mechanical gearing. ultegra di2 is ugly as sin and in a year will be completely outdated with the technology being so new

baldwin471

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

No offence Baldwin, but I wonder if you should maybe take a little step back with your desire for such an expensive bike given your road cycling experience and the fact that money clearly is some kind of an issue. I can sympathise fully as I'm forever considering purchases I can't really afford and for the wrong reasons just because I get carried away.

Like someone has already said, get the Boardman (a very highly reviewed bike) set up properly (time to change LBS, I'd say), maybe treat yourself to a nice set of wheels, and force yourself to put the hard work in with your training. If you hit your goals you can promise yourself a nice, blingy bike next year. I have no problem with people buying themselves flash bikes they really don't need if they have the money to do so (I would too), but if you're at all like the vast majority of us, have a look at what you really need to do to improve your riding before considering expensive purchases.

Killjoy lecture over!

Sometimes a bit of a lecture is just what the doctor ordered. I'm going to take your advice. The problem is there are only two LBS' around me, and one of them is excessively expensive, with the other responsible for my previous 'fixes'.

giant_man

+1 - I do agree!

giant_man

nferrar wrote:

A good alu frame is better than a bad carbon one, that said both the alu and carbon canyon frames always get good reviews. Although Ui2 is tempting I'd go carbon + mechanical personally as I reckon the novelty of the Ui2 shifting would soon wear off and then you'd be left wondering how much better the carbon frame one would have been. Also Ui2 mechs are FUGLY.

yeah I do agree with you ...