Road V MTB value for money

kela66
kela66 Posts: 32
edited July 2012 in Road general
Do you get more bang for your buck with road bikes? for example if you spent £500 on a MTB and £500 on a road bike would you have a better class of machine with the road bike ? would I be correct in thinking because it would not have a suspention fork disk brakes fitted the manufactrer will have more of the build up buget free to fit higher up the range components. or am i wrong in thinking a carbon road fork must be cheaper than a suspention one and a road frame uses less metal and must be more mass produced :?:
Drop bars n beat's

Comments

  • desweller
    desweller Posts: 5,175
    Road bikes are simpler and less influential on performance than MTBs, so you're right; you reach the point of diminishing returns far sooner.
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  • ShutUpLegs
    ShutUpLegs Posts: 3,522
    MTB's have been dumbed down over time to make allowances for the riders ability.
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    ShutUpLegs wrote:
    MTB's have been dumbed down over time to make allowances for the riders ability.
    Don't understand; what do you mean by they have been 'dumbed down' ? Because suspension and disc brakes have been added :?


    I think you can get a fairly decent MTB and road bike for £500.

    I'm not sure either could be considered better value as they are very different. I think people generally have a price point for their hobby and will spend that on it; roadies I would say seem to have deeper pockets even if it's perceived that road bikes are less complex so offer better VFM.

    There is a big emphasis on weight on a road bike, and making stuff light isn't cheap. On the other hand, decent suspension and disc brakes are not cheap either.

    e.g. if you look at frame costs at Planet X / On One then...
    MTB carbon frames range from £350 (hardtail) - £750 (full suspension including shock)
    Road carbon frames range from £300 - £2000
    Simon
  • styxd
    styxd Posts: 3,234
    A road bike is probably better value for money since you wont need to replace or service parts every couple of weeks!
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    styxd wrote:
    A road bike is probably better value for money since you wont need to replace or service parts every couple of weeks!

    :-)

    Not sure whether I'd agree!

    An MTB would last a lot longer on the UK potholed roads than a road bike... and for sure I'm not sure how many feet (or metres) my road bike would last at an MTB trail centre. lol
    Simon
  • MountainMonster
    MountainMonster Posts: 7,423
    ShutUpLegs wrote:
    MTB's have been dumbed down over time to make allowances for the riders ability.
    Don't understand; what do you mean by they have been 'dumbed down' ? Because suspension and disc brakes have been added :?


    I think you can get a fairly decent MTB and road bike for £500.

    I'm not sure either could be considered better value as they are very different. I think people generally have a price point for their hobby and will spend that on it; roadies I would say seem to have deeper pockets even if it's perceived that road bikes are less complex so offer better VFM.

    There is a big emphasis on weight on a road bike, and making stuff light isn't cheap. On the other hand, decent suspension and disc brakes are not cheap either.

    e.g. if you look at frame costs at Planet X / On One then...
    MTB carbon frames range from £350 (hardtail) - £750 (full suspension including shock)
    Road carbon frames range from £300 - £2000

    Believe me, frames can get alot more expensive on their own for MTB's once you start getting into the bigger names. Quite a few retail frame only around 2k as well. Just not from Planet X.
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    Purely from a scale of manufacturing perspective, you get better 'value' from MTBs because they are produced in higher volume which drives down component costs. But what you pay in the shops is about 'perceived' value and often price-points artificially created by marketing people which bear no relations to the cost of the goods - if you look at many groupset components, the difference is spec is often purely a cosmetic finish. Likewise there are intangibles like branding and 'goodwill' i.e. lots of people pay a premium for a brand under the perception they get a 'lifetime' warranty which is just a cop-out to cover up a history of poor quality goods.
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  • rdt
    rdt Posts: 869
    An MTB would last a lot longer on the UK potholed roads than a road bike

    While you're probably right, road bikes seem plenty tough enough to cope with our roads. I've a 6 1/2 year old bike, and the only things replaced so far are a few consumables like tyres, tubes, bar tape, brake pads, chain and cassette, amounting in total to not a great deal really.
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    rdt wrote:
    While you're probably right, road bikes seem plenty tough enough to cope with our roads. I've a 6 1/2 year old bike, and the only things replaced so far are a few consumables like tyres, tubes, bar tape, brake pads, chain and cassette, amounting in total to not a great deal really.
    Yep I agree. Road bikes (even the carbon variety) are a lot more durable than people think. Like you've said, been riding a fairly light carbon bike for 18 months, hit many big potholes at speed, and everything is still true.
    Believe me, frames can get alot more expensive on their own for MTB's once you start getting into the bigger names. Quite a few retail frame only around 2k as well. Just not from Planet X.

    I do agree there are more expensive frames, but at the top of the scale a road frame will be more expensive than an MTB. Same for wheels etc.

    Show me an MTB as expensive as the lovely... http://www.factor001.com/the-factor-001

    And how many MTBers do you know riding with a £500 set of wheels? It's the majority on Sportive events, but most of them are dentists as everybody knows lol
    Simon
  • MountainMonster
    MountainMonster Posts: 7,423
    rdt wrote:
    While you're probably right, road bikes seem plenty tough enough to cope with our roads. I've a 6 1/2 year old bike, and the only things replaced so far are a few consumables like tyres, tubes, bar tape, brake pads, chain and cassette, amounting in total to not a great deal really.
    Yep I agree. Road bikes (even the carbon variety) are a lot more durable than people think. Like you've said, been riding a fairly light carbon bike for 18 months, hit many big potholes at speed, and everything is still true.
    Believe me, frames can get alot more expensive on their own for MTB's once you start getting into the bigger names. Quite a few retail frame only around 2k as well. Just not from Planet X.

    I do agree there are more expensive frames, but at the top of the scale a road frame will be more expensive than an MTB. Same for wheels etc.

    Show me an MTB as expensive as the lovely... http://www.factor001.com/the-factor-001

    And how many MTBers do you know riding with a £500 set of wheels? It's the majority on Sportive events, but most of them are dentists as everybody knows lol

    Shame I don't have a picture of my father-in-laws Merida 140 FS bike. He tricked every bolt out, got everything custom specced and tuned, and I think he is tipping the scales at just under 11kg, which for a bike that type is amazingly light. Lots of people in Austria have some serious bikes worth too much money to make it worth riding.
  • Redhog14
    Redhog14 Posts: 1,377
    OH has two MTB's where the wheels cost north of £500 -Crank Bros.

    I do think a road bike of decent spec and quality can be had for £500, however I do not think that money buys you the equivalent in relative terms on MTB's. Road bike component costs are in relation to their weight (or lack of ) MTB compnents costs rise in relation to strength, durability, performance and weight.I have SRAM Rival on my road bike and the dealer admitted this was a far more durable piece of kit than the Red, the sacrifice being weight of course.
  • dusk
    dusk Posts: 583
    I feel as if manufacturers have increased the price of road bikes to match the increase in mtb price, however I think mtb technology has advanced enough to warrant the price increase whereas road technology hasn't so much.
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  • gabriel959
    gabriel959 Posts: 4,227
    It is difficult for road technology to improve with the UCI in the middle.
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  • SPARTdAN
    SPARTdAN Posts: 26
    Buy what suits your requirements best. If you'll be riding to work on roads only, get a road bike. If you'll be jumping up and down kerbs maybe a MTB would be best, if you'll be doing any XC, well, that one will speak for itself. I think that is all you need to ask yourself when buying a bike with good value.
  • cycleclinic
    cycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    MTB's can be adapted for road/urban use but I would avoid suspension and discs, as these off road bits. Cheap disc brakes systems are still out performed by decent v-brakes with decent pads.

    Find an old retro rigid MTB and go from there.

    However road bike can go up and down curbs, you just need the right wheels and wide tyres. Rigida Sputnik rims and wide 40c tyres perhaps. Not going to find that on a fatory build though.
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  • tarbot18
    tarbot18 Posts: 531
    I ride a mtb and road bike and i see flash harrys from both camps with 5 grand bikes but i think after your spending 1.5grand for a road bike which will you get you a decent make carbon bike with 105 spec then there are diminshing returns , i mean how much better are the top end groupsets than 105 really !! A lot of its marketing hype a road bike is a frame with a fixed fork and and antique brakes due to the regs not a lot to it really .

    Wheras a decent full suss mtb has a lot of technology and costs involved, a complicated frame with bearings , rear shock that in some cases is 100 s on its own and front fork up to 6 or 700 for the top ones plus disk brakes with all their complexity.

    Back to the op s original point i think for the same price you get more road bike for 500 or even a grand than a mtb ,
    my road bike was £600 weighs 20 pounds and does the job with no probs but id want to pay a lot more than 600 to get a decent trail worthy mtb.
    i just wish manufacturers of road bikes wouldnt cater for the uci regs and make bikes your average punter wants, we are not all club riders wanting to emulate cancellara etc some of us like a pootle with mates in the country and would like the option of disc brakes or other new technology on our road bikes.
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  • t4tomo
    t4tomo Posts: 2,643
    tarbot18 wrote:
    i just wish manufacturers of road bikes wouldnt cater for the uci regs and make bikes your average punter wants, we are not all club riders wanting to emulate cancellara etc some of us like a pootle with mates in the country and would like the option of disc brakes or other new technology on our road bikes.

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  • styxd
    styxd Posts: 3,234
    Wheras a decent full suss mtb has a lot of technology and costs involved, a complicated frame with bearings , rear shock that in some cases is 100 s on its own and front fork up to 6 or 700 for the top ones plus disk brakes with all their complexity.

    Again though, thats "marketing hype" but it sounds like you've been sucked in by it.

    Disc brakes, shocks and pivot bearings really arent complicated at all.
  • desweller
    desweller Posts: 5,175
    styxd wrote:
    Wheras a decent full suss mtb has a lot of technology and costs involved, a complicated frame with bearings , rear shock that in some cases is 100 s on its own and front fork up to 6 or 700 for the top ones plus disk brakes with all their complexity.

    Again though, thats "marketing hype" but it sounds like you've been sucked in by it.

    Disc brakes, shocks and pivot bearings really arent complicated at all.

    It's all manufacturing /assembly / design oncost. They might not be complex in themselves but they're more complex than road bikes.

    The markups on these things must be astronomical anyway.
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  • El Zomba
    El Zomba Posts: 164
    For £500, Road beginners definately have the advantage, as £500 MTBs tend to have cheaper forks and parts that aren't really suited for purpose. Put two riders of similar fitness and ability on a budget MTB and a top-shelf MTB and chances are that the budget mountain bike will suffer in some way on technical terrain that flash harry will glide over on the pricer bike. In the same situation, someone on a £500 road bike can, in theory, ride the same distance/climb as someone on a £5,000 dream machine (excuses regarding component weight, Carrera livery, etc. notwithstanding) without too much of a drop in performance.

    The crossover point in my opinion is probably around the £1,500 to £2,000 mark, where performance increase can be noticably marked up on a mountain bike, yet road bikes start to suffer from diminishing returns in terms of 'bang for yer buck' (Canyon are a good example of this).
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,388
    styxd wrote:
    Wheras a decent full suss mtb has a lot of technology and costs involved, a complicated frame with bearings , rear shock that in some cases is 100 s on its own and front fork up to 6 or 700 for the top ones plus disk brakes with all their complexity.

    Again though, thats "marketing hype" but it sounds like you've been sucked in by it.

    Disc brakes, shocks and pivot bearings really arent complicated at all.

    Unless you ride a BSO from ASDA, that's cr*p! Yes the technologies are easy to make but making them light and strong and reliable is the challenging bit!
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  • styxd
    styxd Posts: 3,234
    Unless you ride a BSO from ASDA, that's cr*p! Yes the technologies are easy to make but making them light and strong and reliable is the challenging bit!

    The same applies for road bikes though.