Nobby nics. Lack of grip

Numpty121

i bought a Giant TranceX4 last year which came shod with 2.25 Nobby Nic's (performace compound/cheapest) as standard. I changed the tyres for specialized storms for the winter gloop which worked well if a little slow rolling but recently swopped back to the Nobby Nics as conditions improved. Although these tyres are grippy and fast when its dry, as soon as it gets damp/wet I struggle for grip (especially front end) becoming skittish and confidence sapping. I've tried different pressures (between 25-35psi) with no real improvements. I mainly ride in the Southdowns areas, Kingley vale and the trails at Queen Eliabeth country park where its chalky and rooty. These tyres have had good reviews in their higher specced forms but after a few off's I am becoming increasingly frustrated with them to the point of looking for a change. Has anyone else found this or is it me ? Conti mountainkings have been recommended as a replacement for mixed conditions but will they improve things ? Any others to consider ? Loving the Trance overall though, just need to get this sorted. Any helpful advice appreciated!!

Briggo

Are you sure the tyres are the root cause of the problem?

paulload

Trance X3 with NN and they perform well for me.

waby1234

paulload wrote:

Trance X3 with NN and they perform well for me.

Depends on conditions and riding style though, tyres are very subjective as what works for one doesn't for someone else.

sanchez89

the cheaper compounds are pretty hard so wont really help. the softer tyres are better, but technique is probably making a much bigger impact than your tyres.

if you wish try and get some softer pace/trailstar nics, black chilli conti's, super tacky maxxis etc. and see if they help.

Numpty121

happy to accept my technique could be an issue and a bad workman always blames his tools. Still fairly new to mountainbiking and learning all the time. The storms felt more progressive when they broke away whereas the NN are seem more grip/no grip. The main concern is front grip, its there then its gone. I have changed the stem (70mm) and bars(720mm) to gain a more upright postion so by doing this am i now not getting enough wait over the front wheel to aid grip ? Thanks guys for the replys.

steelie600

^^ might just be a trait of the tyres that. When I raced motorbikes Michelin slicks did that in spades. Grip like shit to a blanket then next thing you know your 10 feet in the air after a massive high side. Dunlops very progressive when they broke away. Pirellis gave you plenty of warning but it was always sudden when they let go.

DCR00

im of the opinion that the right tyres make all the difference

as riding styles differ as much as the tyre width/compound combinations, its worth experimenting

once you find what works for you, that will make a world of difference to your confidence (and hence your riding)

(BTW i love Minions)

Northwind

Yep, agree with that. TBH a good rider can get good results from any halfway-suitable tyre, but that doesn't mean it's not worth putting some thought into- after all they're the only bits that touch the ground (normally)

NN Orcs are OK but yep, could definately be better. TBH I don't even like the 2.25 Evo on the front much, too grip-or-die for my tastes. 2.4 is much better. Flipside though is that the Evos really don't last well.

welshkev

I bought some wheels that had bobby nics on them and I've tried to get used to them but I hate them, I've gone back to my conti verticals as I found the nobby nics don't give a lot of grip in mud.

Just my opinion :-)

Blue Parker

I have NNs on my Trance x5 I have tried nevagals (lots of great reviews - even had stike on the front) and hated them - lots of offs due to front wheel letting go - however I have noticed that the PSI plays a major part also and getting your weight over the front and being committed to the turn - now I lean too far as I am trustng the tyres more and more and unballancing not the tyres breaking.

1mancity2

Try getting more weight over the front wheel in corners but I used maxxis minion on the front and a high roller on the rear, both these tyres let go but you know when they are going too, 2.35 maxpro 60a compound.

andyrm

The OEM Schwalbe tyres have more a more "plastic" compound - you can see the difference compared to a higher spec model, it's much shinier.

Specialized tyres are much the same, very slippery in certain conditions.

But as always, tyre choice is such a subjective thing. Rider weight, style, pressure, prevailing conditions, bike setup and loads of other external factors all play a part.......

mrmonkfinger

welshkev wrote:

I've gone back to my conti verticals

Only been on these for about a month now but liking a lot.

peat

Aye. Tyres are indeed rider specific.

I love my Maxxis Medusa's as they stick like **** to a blanket thus giving me the confidence i need. However, my mate can still leave me for dust/spray on his semi-slicks on the loose and mud because he is fundamentally much better than me.

Thewaylander

welshkev wrote:

I bought some wheels that had bobby nics on them and I've tried to get used to them but I hate them, I've gone back to my conti verticals as I found the nobby nics don't give a lot of grip in mud.

Just my opinion :-)

Had a set of nobbies and this, there poo. any mud water root or rock and they cry. only they worked on a little was some dry dust ground.

sanchez89

i find the nics pretty decent to be fair, have enough bite on the softer ground of natural trials, they roll decent on hard pack aswell. mud they struggle with, but most non-mud specific tyres do.

damn light aswell, but they can be fragile and you can feel them rolling around on the rim when running tubeless, even at about 30psi.

sanchez89

Numpty121 wrote:

I have changed the stem (70mm) and bars(720mm) to gain a more upright postion

to get a more upright position you would need a shorter stem and riser bars of the same width or less than current setup.

increasing bar width will bring you forward as your arms are further apart.

MDobs

Numpty121 wrote:

Although these tyres are grippy and fast when its dry, as soon as it gets damp/wet I struggle for grip (especially front end) becoming skittish and confidence sapping..... I mainly ride in the Southdowns areas, Kingley vale and the trails at Queen Eliabeth country park where its chalky and rooty.

I ride predominantly chalky tracks in Wiltshire, the Ridgeway etc, and have yet to find a tyre (ok so i've only tried 3 options but still) that give any grip on wet chalk. wet roots are also notoriously lacking in grip as well. I'm inclined to agree with those that say technique is key in these conditions.

t0pc4t

I'd agree about NNs. They just don't suit me really. I bought some of the pacestar ones and I just didn't get on with them.

I suspect from my experience with motorbike tyres that it's a case of finding ones with characteristics that suit / flatter my riding.

craigw99

technique does play a big part in it but - from my own experience and from what is posted on here OEM tyres are generally Sh!t cheap plasticy compounds that dont work when in the wet/mud. my mountain kings had the same problems as your nic's they are now ditched for minions. I dont get the point of using cheap tyres for oem i'll never buy a mountain king again and will find it hard to trust continental as a brand now due to my poor exp.

steelie600

Just to add info here, Just got back from Delamere forest. On the dry bits my Racing Ralphs stuck like shit to a blanket. When the heavens opened I fell off!

Racing Ralphs, dry use only LOL

miss notax

I personally didn't get on with NN's - I tried one up front with a RR on the back. I felt they were very slidey and rather prone to just letting go without any warning :?

As others have said, it's all very personal though... I like my tyres to grip above anything else!

I stick to a Minion / High Roller combo all year around, and narrower Fire XC Pro's on my more racey number

Numpty121

I'm glad its not just me who doesn't get on with the NN. I've been riding the same trails all through the winter on the specialized storms with good results traction wise and not many falls so I think my technique for wet roots, off camber bends and slimy chalk is reasonable. But I've had more offs than that since putting the NN back on.

In this months MBUK mag they test ride a Scott Genius shod with Schwalbe Hans Dampf tyres with the cheaper performance compound. They say ' slippery as hell and their lack of grip is lethal'. These guys are experienced, good riders (I'd hope) and have described exactly what I feel.

As far as riding on damp/wet chalk is concerned maybe there aren't that many tyres that will grip well on this surface apart from possibly knobbly mud specific ones!

peter413

Having never rode Nic's properly I can't comment on the tyres but this does sound a bit like practice makes permanent, not perfect. You keep practicing the wrong things and they stick and are very hard to stop doing. Only saying that because of the more upright comments.

Are you braking at all when cornering? This is a big thing that many people do, myself included, that really reduces your grip levels, a lot of the time you don't even realise you are doing it until you make a conscious effort not to. Also your body positioning, saying you want to be more upright sounds totally wrong, you should have as flat a back as possible pretty much. If you look at downhill racing, all the fast guys are like this. If you just focus on getting your weight forward you end up loosing the back end and you have a very upright position. If you lean too far back you are obviously going to loose the front end so it's the same principal. And then there is this whole thing with feet during cornering to get the most grip but thats quite complicated so won't go into it. If you're really struggling with all that you are best to go on a skills course if you have the money.

bragawd

I've nobby nics evo on my trance... swore i'd be takin them off and puttin me high rollers on as they're superb tyres but as yet and in some wet/muddy N.wales trails so far can't fault the nobby's... so they is stayin put for now.

Numpty121

Thanks again for all the replys.
I shall persevere a while longer with the NN, experiment a bit more with tyre pressures and technique, position etc. I know the Nic's fly in the dry, so don't want to give up on them just yet. In the mean time I've just purchased some fox knee pads just in case !

sigorman85

go for mountin kings 2.4 big grip

Mojo_666

Nics stopped working for me when my pace increased, I would never have a nic upfront now, they are fine in the dry tho, which means they are not well suited to the UK.

CycloRos

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the evo compound schwalbe tyres. I run alberts, nics and ralphs in various combinations depending on conditions. The OPs issue sounds more to do with having the cheap OEM compound and a resultant lack of confidence.

Ditch the front tyre at least asap and replace with an evo or pacestar, if you're still lacking front end grip it ain't the tyres f

tarbot18

i have nn s in 2.25 evo and use them in a l weathers at llandegla penmachno and the marin trail with no problems .......
touch wood doh