Bike Crash - Claim Advice

benhben

As I mentioned in an earlier thread, I was knocked off my bike by a Taxi which cut me off in a cycle lane the other day. As expected the local bike shop (Leisure lakes bikes) have written off the frame. The bike is in all likeliness perfectly ok apart from a couple of scratches, however It looks like I am going to have to claim as the bike safety can no longer be guaranteed. I have not been involved in this before so have no idea of the process and need some advice.

The bike is a 6 month old (from new) Moda Stretto 56cm. However I bought this bike second hand so it was not brand new when I bought it. The bike was immaculate barely used no marks.

I am unaware of having any insurance that covered me whilst cycling.

The driver never accepted full liability at the scene. In my view however he would not have a case to argue as he cut me up whilst i was cycing in a cycle lane and admitted he didnt look for any cyclists.

I have the phone number of a witness who saw the accident and agreed the driver was at fault.

I will have a frame write off report from the LBS.

I have his name and phone number and taxi company he likewise has my details.

Can anyone advise on how to begin claim proceedings. Will the fact I didnt not buy the bike from new affect the outcome in getting a like for like replacement, bearing in mind the bike is only 6 months old and would cost £2,200 to replace. I paid £1,700.

Thanks,
Ben

NITR8s

Firstly taxi drivers are self employed and I doubt the taxi company has an insurance company that covers it drivers so you would need to make a claim agaisnt the drivers insurance company. Contact the taxi company advise of the accident and ask for the insurance details in order to make a claim. They should be able to advise you of who they are.

Once you know give them a call and advise them of the accident and the claim you will be making, hopefully they should have procedures in place and advise you what they want you too do. Usually you will need to send them a letter of claim, pointing out details of the accident and how much you are claiming. Obviously, you need to ask the bike shop for a quote to replace the bike with a like for like bike. It doesnt matter that you got it second hand.

Hopefully, the drivers insurance company agrees to your claim and pays out. If this is not the case you are going to need to insturact a solicitor to take legal proceedings possibly on a conditial Fee Agreement (no/win no fee). You could instruct a solicitor straight away, however there will be costs involved in this, so I would recommend sending the drivers insurance company a letter first and see if they pay up from there.

Source of Info: I am a Trainee Legal Executive and have studied law of Tort and civil litigation.

jonomc4

The insurance of the driver should cover for a new bike - or to replace parts on your bike that have been damaged.

Were you injured at all in the crash - if you were (and this is where you will be paid extra for personal injury) then you MUST report it to the police.

If the driver was involved in a crash he also MUST report it to his insurance company. He also MUST give you his insurance details (that is why having the police involved will make him more helpful).

Once you have the insurance details then contact them and they will ask for the damage details and contact details for the witness.

If he does not give you his insurance details - then contact the police and tell the the driver details AND the license plate number - along with time etc. of crash. The driver will then be in double trouble for a) the crash and b) not providing insurance details.

Make sure the witness and you versions of events are the same - it is worth giving them a call - without the witness you will be hard pushed to get any payment unless the driver admits liability.

If you have been injured in the crash - you will have to employ a personal injury claim lawyer - they will then deal with all of the above for you, but the whole thing will take about 3 months.

Best thing is to get insurance for you and your bike! for the above bike that would be about £22 a month.

cougie

I'd get the experts involved. Alyson France at Bikeline has done great work for a couple of my pals.

benhben

Ive had confirmation the witness saw everything and is willing to be used as a witness. Were both in agreement the driver was at fault.

So will the drivers car insurance cover cost for a bike replacement? During the argument at the side of the road the driver hinted that as a cyclist you wouldnt have any rights to claim insurance.

rolf_f

benhben wrote:

During the argument at the side of the road the driver hinted that as a cyclist you wouldnt have any rights to claim insurance.

The driver was an idiot - or just trying his luck to put you off. Third party insurance is what pays for the damage to the 3rd party (that being you). Whether you are a cyclist, pedestrian, gondolier or anything else, you have the right to claim off his insurance if he caused an accident to you. Don't worry about that.

Do as Cougie says.

kentphil

I went through something similar last year.

Contact the taxi drivers insurance firm firstly and report the incident saying that you want to claim for damage to your bike, giving your version of the accident.

Contact the witness and get them to write a statement and send it to the insurance company.

The first stage is getting the drivers insurance firm to accept liability. Once this has happend you can then claim for the damage to your bike. Take plenty of pictures and I believe you have already had the bike assessed by your local bike shop.

This is what I did anyway. It took several months and many phone calls but was worth it in the end.

Gizmodo

And you don't have to take his insurance company's first offer. When they eventually offer to pay you or pay a company to repair/replace your bike (it will not be quick) just remember that it is a negotiation, they will always start by offering less than they are willing to pay to see if you just say "thanks" and they save a few quid.

jonomc4

I think a saw a post on this on another part of this forum - you said you went over the handle bars etc. - No matter what injury you sustain it is an injury - get a personal injury lawyer doing all the leg work for you - it costs nothing and they will keep things moving faster.

NITR8s

jonomc4 wrote:

I think a saw a post on this on another part of this forum - you said you went over the handle bars etc. - No matter what injury you sustain it is an injury - get a personal injury lawyer doing all the leg work for you - it costs nothing and they will keep things moving faster.

It does cost, ususally you will have to pay for disburesments and an insurance policy to cover costs if your unsuccessful. However, if your claim is successfuly you can recover these costs.

slowbike

jonomc4 wrote:

I think a saw a post on this on another part of this forum - you said you went over the handle bars etc. - No matter what injury you sustain it is an injury - get a personal injury lawyer doing all the leg work for you - it costs nothing and they will keep things moving faster.

Yer - sue the pants of the guy - take him for all he's got ...

??
We all have accidents - sometimes it's through stupidity, sometimes it's through carelessness - just occasionally it'll be malice - but not often.
Whilst I agree that the party not at fault should not be out of pocket - is it necessary to encourage the "no win no fee" lawyers out there to get you a "quick buck" ... ?
Sure - if you've been injured and you've lost money due to it (days unable to work and/or medical expenses) then claim it back - but if it's just a graze then please - once you've been checked out - just get on with it - they are just part of life and you're just as likely to get a graze through your own stupidity as with someone else's ...

benhben

Slowbike wrote:

jonomc4 wrote:

I think a saw a post on this on another part of this forum - you said you went over the handle bars etc. - No matter what injury you sustain it is an injury - get a personal injury lawyer doing all the leg work for you - it costs nothing and they will keep things moving faster.

Yer - sue the pants of the guy - take him for all he's got ...

Whilst I agree that the party not at fault should not be out of pocket - is it necessary to encourage the "no win no fee" lawyers out there to get you a "quick buck" ... ?

Thats exactly my view and hence why I am not interested in any injury damage compensation, but to simply recoup the cost of bike replacement and smashed helmet.

I am being told to report the incident to the police prior to any claim. Not to press charges but to open up an active accident entry and gain a reference number.

slowbike

benhben wrote:

I am being told to report the incident to the police prior to any claim. Not to press charges but to open up an active accident entry and gain a reference number.

Why not drop into your local police station and talk it through with them?
If you're lucky they won't ask you for your driving licence and proof of tax disc, passport and inside leg measurement! Oh no - that was for an accident when a car drove into the side of our parked vehicle - the police wanted to see MY driving licence ?!? I wasn't driving - it was PARKED & LOCKED ... but once you get through the front office staff to someone who actually knows whats going on you should get some advice as the best way to proceed.

sungod

ffs stop trying to be nice/considerate, this isn't a personal matter, it's you vs. an insurance company, go for the throat

make notes of all the facts as you remember them, not opinion, not being nice, not being considerate, just facts

take photos and document all damage, bike, clothes, shoes, plus any bruises/cuts/whatever visible on you

go to police, get incident report form, fill it in, make a copy, return to police, get incident number

get a lawyer, there's a reference to one above, or get a copy of cycling weekly and choose one that advertises there

think you don't want a lawyer? so you just want to get messed around and burn lots of your time and effort instead?

get a lawyer, obey their instructions, await cheque

Monty Dog

Were you injured? If you were, then report the incident to the police and keep any records of doctors visits, treatment etc as it'll add weight to your claim, particularly if the driver drove off. As well as the cost of replacement bike parts, you should also be able to make claims for bus/train fares/petrol etc that you incurred as a consequence of your inconvenience - keep receipts / tickets etc as these carry more weight.Write to the taxi company with a clear claim - stick to facts, not subjecture and the consequences of the driver's action. Be reasonable, but specific about when and how you expect them to respond.

jonomc4

It is one thing to make a false claim and exaggerate injuries - it is another thing to state facts.

At the end of the day, if the driver made an error, it is not up to you to bear the brunt of the costs - there are fixed amount for injuries etc. Most personal injury lawyers will review you case - if they feel it is winnable they will act for you - it is their risk and not yours as to whether they make their fees back from the insurance company or not.

I have been hit twice - first time I went the nice route - the guy did a runner and because I had not followed the proper procedures and just trusted him - I got nothing paid (lost £400).

2nd time - I tried to be nice but the guy was cute and wouldn't give me his insurance details - I told my insurance and the police - got the lawyer and then sat back whilst my insurance fixed my bike (they got the money back from the driver's insurers later) and I got a check for £3,500 for the pain (which I still have a little). I would have settled for the £700 to fix my bike at the start! Point is - I told no lie made no exaggeration of costs (medical and travel). BTW the driver got a few points for careless driving and a fine as well, bet he will look out for cyclists next time he wants to save 3 seconds.

benhben

When you say you told your insurance, did you take out specific cycling insurance or do you mean your road/house insurance?

I will have to bike back from the LBS tomorrow complete with a certificate of damage assessment. Following this I will then begin proceedures.

kentphil

I phoned the police after my accident but they said as no one was injured and the road wasn't blocked they didn't need to attend. Wish I had said I was injured as the driver tried to dispute it was his fault and the police would have been another witness to back up my version of events.

thegibdog

I was knocked off my bike in November and I was heavily encouraged to get a lawyer involved by the bike shop who assessed my bike. I contacted the lawyers they were insistent I go down the personal injury route (I had a slightly swollen knee for 2 days) and it turned out the bike shop stood to make £600 referral fee from me despite them saying they wouldn't get anything out of the process.

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high, so decided to sort the matter out myself. Judging from the numerous phone calls I received about my accident I guess the lawyers subsequently sold my details on as they couldn't make money out of me any other way.

It was a long drawn out process dealing with the insurance company and I had to put up with varyious delaying tactics (fax not received, only part of the fax received, no record of it being received, document backlogs, now disputing liability, waiting to hear back from a witness etc etc) but eventually got the full RRP of the bike.

slowbike

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

bails87

Slowbike wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

So you wouldn't use a lawyer for a legitimate claim that could get you, say, an extra £1k because it would add a few pence to your car insurance premium ? Meanwhile other people are still making claims (both legitimate and not) and they're each adding a few pence onto your premium. So the end result of being nice to the insurance companies is that your premium goes up by almost exactly the same amount as it would have if you used a lawyer, but you're £1k worse off.

Nice.

slowbike

bails87 wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

So you wouldn't use a lawyer for a legitimate claim that could get you, say, an extra £1k because it would add a few pence to your car insurance premium ? Meanwhile other people are still making claims (both legitimate and not) and they're each adding a few pence onto your premium. So the end result of being nice to the insurance companies is that your premium goes up by almost exactly the same amount as it would have if you used a lawyer, but you're £1k worse off.

Nice.

whats the £1k for? Loss of earnings or just compensation ... ?

bails87

Slowbike wrote:

bails87 wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

So you wouldn't use a lawyer for a legitimate claim that could get you, say, an extra £1k because it would add a few pence to your car insurance premium ? Meanwhile other people are still making claims (both legitimate and not) and they're each adding a few pence onto your premium. So the end result of being nice to the insurance companies is that your premium goes up by almost exactly the same amount as it would have if you used a lawyer, but you're £1k worse off.

Nice.

whats the £1k for? Loss of earnings or just compensation ... ?

I don't know. Whatever. It would be money that you were legitimately entitled to and the difference between doing an 'amateur' claim and letting the lawyers deal with it on your behalf.

The point I'm getting at is you can either not use legal professionals, which won't stop the rest of the world doing it. So insurance premiums rise by basically the same amount as they would have anyway. And you miss out on money that you're entitled to.

Or you can choose to use legal professionals. Again, over the entire insurance industry one case won't have a significant impact, so your (and everyone else's) insurance goes up by the same as in the 'no lawyers' scenario, except you've also got £1k of compensation. So in my little, hypothetical scenario you're £1k better off by using lawyers, and gain nothing by handling it yourself. Apart from some sense of 'doing the right thing' by letting an insurance company have a slightly nicer Xmas party

Bozman

Insurance companies will try and run rings around you if you don't get a solicitor involved.
Rough break down - I got knocked off, open and shut case, car didn't stop at an island and i had witnesses, she admitted liability, bike written off.
I just wanted my bike back but they just dragged their feet, lying about witnesses and they even passed my details on to an ambulance chasing solicitor. I rang the insurance firm up and explained that i just wanted the money for my bike and that was that, they lied again about passing my details on and that they were waiting on witness statements.
I'd had enough, i rang a solicitor up and they delt with the lot, i had the money for the bike and clothing within 6 weeks and then i got £1500 for injuries(which i didn't really want but f**k em), the fees came to near-on £10.000 + the claim, if they'd played ball it would have cost them £1700.

Gizmodo

thegibdog wrote:

I was knocked off my bike in November and I was heavily encouraged to get a lawyer involved by the bike shop who assessed my bike. I contacted the lawyers they were insistent I go down the personal injury route (I had a slightly swollen knee for 2 days) and it turned out the bike shop stood to make £600 referral fee from me despite them saying they wouldn't get anything out of the process.

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high, so decided to sort the matter out myself. Judging from the numerous phone calls I received about my accident I guess the lawyers subsequently sold my details on as they couldn't make money out of me any other way.

It was a long drawn out process dealing with the insurance company and I had to put up with varyious delaying tactics (fax not received, only part of the fax received, no record of it being received, document backlogs, now disputing liability, waiting to hear back from a witness etc etc) but eventually got the full RRP of the bike.

Good for you, I totally agree with your sentiment.

I had a minor bump in my car, an RAC van went into the back of me. I was offered a hire car which I accepted whilst my car was being repaired. £650 a day they were claiming for this hire car! Guess what, the hire car company was owned by my insurance company, specifically setup to make money out of other insurance companies! I was livid when I found out the daily cost. I can hire a car for £30 a day!!!!

Companies ripping off companies - who pays, we do!

hjghg5

I went down the solicitors route. Not so much because I wanted to make a huge claim, but because I wanted to be able to sit down, put a pack of papers, receipts, photos etc together, put it in the post and let them deal with it. They're experts, I'm not, so why put myself through the hassle. They can do the chasing for me.

I'm actually a solicitor myself, but I don't do RTA claims (or any form of litigation) and I appreciate the limits of my knowledge. I wouldn't dream of doing that sort of stuff with my work head on, so why would I do it in my spare time?

In my case I didn't need to take out ATE insurance to cover the potential liability on fees - because liability was clear cut there was sod all chance of "losing" and the main issue he'd be dealing with was valuing the claim. We were both happy that the risk was negligible so insurance wasn't needed. I believe that even when insurance is taken out you don't end up paying for it, but I could be wrong.

I contacted a firm (Alyson France) directly. Everything's still going through the system at the moment so I don't know how it will turn out, but not having to do all the legwork myself has definitely helped me move on and forget about the crash.

thegibdog

bails87 wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

So you wouldn't use a lawyer for a legitimate claim that could get you, say, an extra £1k because it would add a few pence to your car insurance premium ? Meanwhile other people are still making claims (both legitimate and not) and they're each adding a few pence onto your premium. So the end result of being nice to the insurance companies is that your premium goes up by almost exactly the same amount as it would have if you used a lawyer, but you're £1k worse off.

Nice.

Personally if I had serious or lasting injuries I would have gone down the solicitor route. In fact I almost did anyway on numerous occasions following the accident, particularly when the insurance company were dragging their feet, but was put off for the reasons I mentioned. It did take 2 months to resolve what was an open and shut case so I imagine I would have saved time if I'd used a solicitor, assuming I found one that was interested in the damage to my bike rather than any injuries I might, or might not, have sustained.

And yes, one person choosing not to make the most out of a situation and get all the money they could isn't going to make a huge difference in the big scheme of things, but if everyone did the same then insurance premiums would probably be half of what they are now. As mentioned by Slowbike and Gizmodo it's not as if the insurance companies lose out either way, the costs just get passed on to the customers - all of us.

cougie

I'd go with the professionals. Much easier. And I've had the hire car scenario too - absolutely staggering the rates that they charge. The whole sordid business needs looking into.

benhben

The issue is now being dealt with by professionals. As the driver was unwilling to accept liability Connexus Claims Solutions are now managing the incident. They specialise in Cycle incidents. The company has already spoken to the driver and my witness who backs up everything I have said so hopefully things will start progressing quickly.

bails87

thegibdog wrote:

bails87 wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

I didn't want anything to do with this, since they're the two main reasons insurance premiums are so high,

Exactly - we end up paying for it all one way or another - we should try and make using lawyers a penultimate resort (last resort will be if the lawyer looses! )

So you wouldn't use a lawyer for a legitimate claim that could get you, say, an extra £1k because it would add a few pence to your car insurance premium ? Meanwhile other people are still making claims (both legitimate and not) and they're each adding a few pence onto your premium. So the end result of being nice to the insurance companies is that your premium goes up by almost exactly the same amount as it would have if you used a lawyer, but you're £1k worse off.

Nice.

Personally if I had serious or lasting injuries I would have gone down the solicitor route. In fact I almost did anyway on numerous occasions following the accident, particularly when the insurance company were dragging their feet, but was put off for the reasons I mentioned. It did take 2 months to resolve what was an open and shut case so I imagine I would have saved time if I'd used a solicitor, assuming I found one that was interested in the damage to my bike rather than any injuries I might, or might not, have sustained.

And yes, one person choosing not to make the most out of a situation and get all the money they could isn't going to make a huge difference in the big scheme of things, but if everyone did the same then insurance premiums would probably be half of what they are now. As mentioned by Slowbike and Gizmodo it's not as if the insurance companies lose out either way, the costs just get passed on to the customers - all of us.

Re the bits in bold: you're not going to stop everyone else doing it. By doing it yourself because of the 'moral high ground' you're just making yourself worse off.

In any case, I'm a British Cycling member so when I was involved in a collision recently I just passed the details onto their legal 'partners' and I'm letting them deal with it.

thegibdog

bails87 wrote:

thegibdog wrote:

one person choosing not to make the most out of a situation and get all the money they could isn't going to make a huge difference in the big scheme of things, but if everyone did the same then insurance premiums would probably be half of what they are now.

Re the bits in bold: you're not going to stop everyone else doing it. By doing it yourself because of the 'moral high ground' you're just making yourself worse off.

So, like I said then?

You'd suggest I contribute to the insurance spiral because everyone else is doing it (some parallels with the current tax evasion stories here)? I suppose it is very tempting when people gaming the system have cost me thousands in insurance premiums over the years but, although I can't provide a solution, I can choose to not be part of the problem.

Thinking about it maybe I should have claimed for multiple unprovable injuries and then used the payout to campaign for an end to the current situation!

OP, I hope you manage to get everything sorted.