Dulwich Paragon "Saturday" Route: Old Hill?

jonny_trousers

Anyone know what the deal is with riding up Old Hill from Shire Lane? I'm pretty sure the DP route takes you up it, but it is going the wrong way up a one-way street. The road is nice and quiet and perfectly wide, but when I went up it on Sunday I had some psycho in a minivan try to scare me into thinking he was going to run me off the road. I do kind of get why he was pee'd off, but I wasn't remotely in his, or anyone else's way, and that route does keep you off the A21 (as well as giving you a nice little hill to climb).

Now, I'm all for obeying the law when it comes to riding my bike, but it really does look like the DP route sends you up there. Or am I wrong? Might even be worth lobbying whoever owns that road to allow cycles only up it.

phy2sll2

Not sure where you picked up the DP route from, but as far as I know, they (we) only go over Old Hill when travelling South to North. Think you must have been doing the route back to front!

If we do go around the other way (which sometimes happens when there are a lot of riders out on a Saturday - they split into clockwise and anti-clockwise groups), everyone goes to the end of Shire Lane, around the roundabout and back up Cudham Lane North coming from the other direction.

Wouldn't recommend going the wrong way up a one way street. Especially one with blind corners. Also, people drive over that hill insanely quickly, especially at rush hour!

jonny_trousers

phy2sll2 wrote:

Not sure where you picked up the DP route from, but as far as I know, they (we) only go over Old Hill when travelling South to North. Think you must have been doing the route back to front!

If we do go around the other way (which sometimes happens when there are a lot of riders out on a Saturday - they split into clockwise and anti-clockwise groups), everyone goes to the end of Shire Lane, around the roundabout and back up Cudham Lane North coming from the other direction.

Wouldn't recommend going the wrong way up a one way street. Especially one with blind corners. Also, people drive over that hill insanely quickly, especially at rush hour!

Ha! That makes sense and it does explain why I see Paragon riders coming in the opposite direction. I just followed the route as I perceived it on the DP website. I guess at West Wickham I should be going straight on rather than left onto Glebe way? So you guys rarely get the downward joy of High Elms Rd and Beddlestead Lane then? I do like the idea of turning the tedious Cudham Lane into a downhill section, though. I'll try it properly tomorrow.

Cheers for setting me straight!

FoldingJoe

See quite a few Dulwich Paragon riders down for the Dartmoor Classic, anybody on here?

phy2sll2

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

So you guys rarely get the downward joy of High Elms Rd and Beddlestead Lane then? I do like the idea of turning the tedious Cudham Lane into a downhill section, though. I'll try it properly tomorrow.

High Elms is traditionally the point towards the end of the ride where one is duty bound to attempt to cook your fellow riders by jumping on the front and upping the pace every time the hill kicks up another percentage point. Not sure I would descend it now, having seen a tree lying across the road in the winter on more than one occasion!

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Cudham Lane (north and south) is fun downwards. Unfortunately, whoever came up with the route for the club 10 didn't think so, they put it in going upwards. Makes it a "sporting" course, apparently.

When you coming out on the Saturday ride then?

ketsbaia

phy2sll2 wrote:

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Not sure it gets up to 25%, but it's a real sting in the tail when you've done Biggin Hill, Toys Hill and Titsey Hill on my usual 60-odd miler round that neck of the woods.

phy2sll2

Yeah, sorry. Peaks at 17.2% according to Strava.

Pffft... I could do that in my sleep.

By which I mean: I would struggle on a good day.

jonny_trousers

phy2sll2 wrote:

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Beddlestead in that direction is gorgeous. Two miles of downward sweeping loveliness. Hessiers Hill definitely spoils the fun, though.

When you coming out on the Saturday ride then?

Just as soon as I can get around it at an average speed that would not have me being dropped by you lot on anything remotely resembling a slope. I can just about average 15mph on the version I've done three times now, but I have a sneaking suspicion the proper route will be quite a bit harder. I'm going to go do it in about an hour and will report back.

jonny_trousers

ketsbaia wrote:

phy2sll2 wrote:

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Not sure it gets up to 25%, but it's a real sting in the tail when you've done Biggin Hill, Toys Hill and Titsey Hill on my usual 60-odd miler round that neck of the woods.

You got a link to a map of that route Ketsabia? Would be fun to give it a try.

ketsbaia

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

ketsbaia wrote:

phy2sll2 wrote:

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Not sure it gets up to 25%, but it's a real sting in the tail when you've done Biggin Hill, Toys Hill and Titsey Hill on my usual 60-odd miler round that neck of the woods.

You got a link to a map of that route Ketsabia? Would be fun to give it a try.

Somewhere. Will try and dig it out tomorrow and post it, but it generally involves heading out through Beckenham, down Wickham Road, Hayes Lane, Pickhurst Lane and Baston Road up through Keston, then over Biggin Hill, down Westerham Hill, along the A25 to Toys Hill, over there and down to Four Elms, then back along Pootings Road and Kent Hatch Road, through Limpsfield and up over Titsey Hill, right there down to Beddlestead Lane and back towards London along the back roads.

There are a few variations along that theme you can try out. All with plenty of hills and descents.

phy2sll2

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

Just as soon as I can get around it at an average speed that would not have me being dropped by you lot on anything remotely resembling a slope. I can just about average 15mph on the version I've done three times now, but I have a sneaking suspicion the proper route will be quite a bit harder. I'm going to go do it in about an hour and will report back.

Ha - don't worry about average speed and stuff. We have to split into ~10 groups anyway because of the number of people who turn up. Outworking of which is that there's a group to cater for everyone's preferred pace. I would guess that 15mph wouldn't even be the lower end.

Plus, we're not allowed / wouldn't want to drop anyone on the way. That's what group riding's all about, right?!

If that's not enough to sell it to you, just think of the eggs florentine in the Cafe Paradou at the end of the ride!

jonny_trousers

Not long back. That's a much nicer route. At least doing the relentless uphill bit this way around you are gifted lovely views. It felt like I was cycling in France! I wish I'd had the balls to do Hesiers Hill full tilt, but I know it can be gravelly at the bottom and so I didn't have the balls. Neither Beddlestead nor High Elms were as steep as I'd expected them to be going up, but that's not to say I managed a blisteringly impressive time (15.1mph average), but I'm happy with the workout. I only wish I'd been doing Anerley Hill the wrong way around too :shock: Still, managed a PB on it,

phy2sll2 wrote:

Ha - don't worry about average speed and stuff. We have to split into ~10 groups anyway because of the number of people who turn up. Outworking of which is that there's a group to cater for everyone's preferred pace. I would guess that 15mph wouldn't even be the lower end.

Plus, we're not allowed / wouldn't want to drop anyone on the way. That's what group riding's all about, right?!

If that's not enough to sell it to you, just think of the eggs florentine in the Cafe Paradou at the end of the ride!

I'd love to come along, and eggs florentine you say? Mmmmm! I have to work Saturdays, but I don't leave home in the Gipsy Hill area until about 1:30, but you lot set off quite early, don't you? I'll look into joining whichever cycling body it is you need to be a member of and will look forward to joining you all soon. Cheers!

jonny_trousers

ketsbaia wrote:

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

ketsbaia wrote:

phy2sll2 wrote:

Beddlestead backwards - now there's an idea! |Must get up to about 25% going up "hessiers hill" or whatever it's called?

Not sure it gets up to 25%, but it's a real sting in the tail when you've done Biggin Hill, Toys Hill and Titsey Hill on my usual 60-odd miler round that neck of the woods.

You got a link to a map of that route Ketsabia? Would be fun to give it a try.

Somewhere. Will try and dig it out tomorrow and post it, but it generally involves heading out through Beckenham, down Wickham Road, Hayes Lane, Pickhurst Lane and Baston Road up through Keston, then over Biggin Hill, down Westerham Hill, along the A25 to Toys Hill, over there and down to Four Elms, then back along Pootings Road and Kent Hatch Road, through Limpsfield and up over Titsey Hill, right there down to Beddlestead Lane and back towards London along the back roads.

There are a few variations along that theme you can try out. All with plenty of hills and descents.

Thanks! That should do it!