Difference between 3k and 12k carbon frames?

ianbar
ianbar Posts: 1,354
edited June 2012 in Road beginners
I have just been looking at carbon frames, and they seem to be given a value like 3k,5k or 12k and what do these numbers actually mean?
enigma esprit
cannondale caad8 tiagra 2012

Comments

  • night_porter
    night_porter Posts: 888
    The cynical answer is......so the manufacturers can charge you more money for the "better" grades of carbon.

    But hey why shouldn't they jump on the bandwagon, Shimano do it all the time by saving half a gram and charging £50 more.
  • ianbar
    ianbar Posts: 1,354
    Lol so is 12k meant to be better?
    enigma esprit
    cannondale caad8 tiagra 2012
  • DavidJB
    DavidJB Posts: 2,019
    3k is the best I think.
  • itsnotarace
    itsnotarace Posts: 518
    edited June 2012
    The answer is no real difference, it's just a different cosmetic finish for most manufacturers

    http://www.velocite-bikes.com/carbon-fiber.html?sl=EN
  • Wirral_paul
    Wirral_paul Posts: 2,476
    Its just a different weave of the cloth - and is only a cosmetic surface finish anyway as said ^^. Go for whichever you prefer the look of.

    My chinese carbon frame has the Unidirectional (UD) finish as I was painting it anyway. This is simply made for structural strength with no surface "carbon" effect.
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    This explains it from Storck-

    http://www.yoeleo.com/weave
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    To put it another way - 12k looks terrible, 3k looks really nice, UD is trendy :lol:
    Faster than a tent.......
  • napoleond
    napoleond Posts: 5,992
    Rolf F wrote:
    To put it another way - 12k looks terrible, 3k looks really nice, UD is trendy :lol:

    Heh heh, I do agree, 12k looks bobbins!
    Insta: ATEnduranceCoaching
    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    Generally the larger the weave, the stiffer it is, but is also heavier.

    Some frames will use a mixture of materials to get the stiffness/flex characteristics the designer is looking for; other designers might use a mixture to keep the cost down.

    So as with any material used to make bikes... it's not the material - it's the way it's used that makes the difference.
    Simon
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    NapoleonD wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    To put it another way - 12k looks terrible, 3k looks really nice, UD is trendy :lol:

    Heh heh, I do agree, 12k looks bobbins!

    +! .. but there is always the option of adding paint :lol:
    Simon
  • spasypaddy
    spasypaddy Posts: 5,180
    9k.
    BMC TM01 - FCN 0
    Look 695 (Geared) - FCN 1
    Bowman Palace:R - FCN 1
    Cannondale CAAD 9 - FCN 2
    Premier (CX) - FCN 6
    Premier (fixed/SS) - FCN3
  • brettjmcc
    brettjmcc Posts: 1,361
    NapoleonD wrote:
    Rolf F wrote:
    To put it another way - 12k looks terrible, 3k looks really nice, UD is trendy :lol:

    Heh heh, I do agree, 12k looks bobbins!

    Looks alright on my Synapse top tube and forks, but it could just be the top layer
    BMC GF01
    Quintana Roo Cd01
    Project High End Hack
    Cannondale Synapse SL (gone)
    I like Carbon
  • MattC59
    MattC59 Posts: 5,408
    3k = 3mm weave
    5k = 5mm weave
    12k = 12mm weave

    12k is stiffest, but isn't suitable for certain parts of the bike, so frames are often a mix of different weaves laied up in all sorts of directions. The weave that you see is the cosmetic top layer, to make it look nice. Obviously, this is down to personal preference.
    Science adjusts it’s beliefs based on what’s observed.
    Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved
  • keef66
    keef66 Posts: 13,123
    My vague memory of O level algebra suggests the difference between 3k and 12k is 9k...
  • andy46
    andy46 Posts: 1,666
    My Forme is 12k I think it looks great, some parts are painted others not 8)
    2019 Ribble CGR SL

    2015 Specialized Roubaix Sport sl4

    2014 Specialized Allez Sport
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    The 3K, 12K etc refers to the cosmetic top-weave finish only - the unidirectional fibres are what provides the structural strength of the frame. UD is effectively a bare frame.
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    It is truly amazing how the right answers (Monty Dog, itsnotarace) are swamped by a load of utter bolleaux.
  • ianbar
    ianbar Posts: 1,354
    glad i asked now, think i would go with a 3k does look the nicer option.im not going to get one yet mind you but may be a winter project for myself ready for next spring!(need to get my current project finished first lol)
    enigma esprit
    cannondale caad8 tiagra 2012
  • Wirral_paul
    Wirral_paul Posts: 2,476
    P_Tucker wrote:
    It is truly amazing how the right answers (Monty Dog, itsnotarace) are swamped by a load of utter bolleaux.

    And its truly amazing how yet again you can do little but troll another thread with nothing constructive to say!!
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    Wirral_Paul wrote:
    P_Tucker wrote:
    It is truly amazing how the right answers (Monty Dog, itsnotarace) are swamped by a load of utter bolleaux.

    And its truly amazing how yet again you can do little but troll another thread with nothing constructive to say!!

    The best thing is I made you do exactly what you're criticising me for. On the plus side, I'm not a hypocrite and I as a point of order I did add something to the thread - I agreed with the correct answer.
  • rolf_f
    rolf_f Posts: 16,015
    P_Tucker wrote:
    It is truly amazing how the right answers (Monty Dog, itsnotarace) are swamped by a load of utter bolleaux.
    So why did you decide to add to the bolleaux? :wink:
    (ie that on this thread there was the usual general consensus plus the odd bit of silliness. There are plenty of crap filled threads elsewhere where your post might have made more sense. Possibly my reply was bolleaux but I think it had an element of truth - ie that for us normal riders actually the difference between the weaves itself is pure bolleaux in functional terms. Buy the finish you like the look of because you won't notice the difference any other way).
    Faster than a tent.......
  • Wirral_paul
    Wirral_paul Posts: 2,476
    P_Tucker wrote:
    Wirral_Paul wrote:
    P_Tucker wrote:
    It is truly amazing how the right answers (Monty Dog, itsnotarace) are swamped by a load of utter bolleaux.

    And its truly amazing how yet again you can do little but troll another thread with nothing constructive to say!!

    The best thing is I made you do exactly what you're criticising me for. On the plus side, I'm not a hypocrite and I as a point of order I did add something to the thread - I agreed with the correct answer.

    Utter tosh as usual - thinking you're clever while acting like a complete d!ck. I think everyone knows exactly what you're like to be brutally honest - there's PLENTY of evidence after all!
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    Where did I deny that I'm a dick?

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