Running out of steam on a 50miler - Nutrition advice.

mr_dobbo

Did a hilly (7000ft on memory map) 50 miles yesterday and at the end I felling totally empty, not just drained in my legs but literally empty inside as in tummy rumbling. I had a decent size breakfast bowl of cereal with 1/2 banana and raspberries plus a yoghurt. On the fairly leisurely paced ride at a I had the other 1/2 of the banana, 2 snack size snicker bars and a fun size mars bar. I also had 2 bottles with weakish Zipvit energy drink that both went. I would have thought that would give enough energy for that sort of ride but it's the empty felling in tummy that seems to hit in in the last few miles that finishes me off.

I did a 54mile sportive a couple of weeks ago in North Yorks and a few other local 50mile rides and ended with the same empty feeling. I want to start doing longer rides so I'd like to get on top of this problem/feeling so advice is very welcome.

My thoughts are:-
Do I need to take more bulky foods, if so it's not easy carrying it i.e. bananas, sandwich, maltloaf etc.)?
The more of longer rides I do the less I will crave food with improved endurance? (give it time!)
This is why tea/cake stops are incorporated into rides, I need a stop?

I don't know how riders do such long distances on sportives without and real stop.

Fursty Ferret

A lot of empty calories in those snickers and mars bars, as well as your breakfast cereal. Have porridge for breakfast and replace the sweets with a thick wedge of malt loaf and some handfuls of dried fruit. And I generally add salt and sugar to my water bottles as an easy isotonic blast.

turnerjohn

the snickers and mars will be doing you no good at all....they boost your sugar levels up but your hit the wall after soon after and it will come on suddenly....even if you haven't burnt off all those calories !
You need to try some proper nutrition; try SIS , GO or ZipVit energy bars,,,they releave both complex and slow release carbs and will keep you going much longer. Mix up your drinks with the manufactorers recommendations as well...also worth getting some electrolites in the drink as well.
What cereals did you have ? there are a lot of very bad cereals out there...high sugar content....I find simple porridge to be the best...slow release GI and keeps me full.
Your also need to fuel up (on longer rides) the night before; stay away from "heavy meat" go for fish or chicken and up slow release carbs like rice or pasta....your body may not have been fully fuelled before you started !
Other then that its just more training to get the body used to riding fast and far....I'm quite happy doing a hillyish 70miler over 80% max for 3 and bit hours not stopping but taking energy drink and one energy bar on the go...Im properly fuelled the night and morning before...makes a lot of difference IMHO

Herbsman

Sometimes no amount of extra food will help. I used to run out of steam all the time no matter how much I ate - in fact I used to overcompensate by eating lots and still ran out of steam. When you get fitter you can go for longer, without having to eat more / differently than usual.

mr_dobbo

Thanks for the answers. I'm surprised at the snickers/mars bar advice but it makes sense being pretty much all sugar, I suppose they act more like a gel as a boost rather than sustained energy. I've a huge stock of them it the only time I have chocolate, a well earned treat that does me good was the thinking . I'll be stocking up on malt and banana loaf, with some nuts from now on

I did have a big rice dinner the night before so doing that right, the cereal was a nut cluster type thing, I'll try to go on to porridge and give that a go, not to appealing if the weather fine, I associate it with cold winter days!

I agree Herbsman, I need to keep doing these length rides more then progress to longer, or doing longer flatter rides which I find more boring. I'm not good getting motivated if the weathers bad, which it is a lot of the time up here so getting out regularly can be hit and miss.

turnerjohn

check out the sugar and fat content of Clusters....not very good for you am affraid...though they taste great ! (no Frosties pun !)
Training does play a big part and am affraid that means all weathers...riding at -4 (less with windchill) in the winter isn't pleasent but I've been feeling the rewards come spring time

Bobbinogs

Herbsman wrote:

When you get fitter you can go for longer, without having to eat more / differently than usual.

^^ What he said.

The usual advice is that your body should have enough carbs for about 90 mins of cycling (if you have a decent balanced diet). After that you will need about 65g of carb for every hour if you are working really hard (so somthing to eat at 90 mins, something else at ~110mins, then ~130mins, etc.). A banana is about 20g, about 25g for a flapjack. A mixture of different GI foods will help smooth the carb release so you don't get highs/lows.

If you are eating the right amount and the right foods (forget the high sugar nonsense) but still feeling flat at the end then you just need to work on your endurance fitness. Might be worth trying the odd low zone ride to get the body adjusted to longer rides. I do some work every now and then with a HRM but an easier way is when I occassionally go out with a lower level group at the local club. This means that I get to spend 4 or 5 hours out cycling at chatting pace, taking in the scenary with good company and I am sure this all helps, as well as reminding me why I enjoy cycling (oh, and I have also learned not to try to chat too much going up the hills next to someone who is busting their lungs out, bad form you know ).

nickel

Yup as Bobbinogs said you need around 60g of carb per hour after the first 60-90mins, and as others have said the snickers and mars bars wont have done much good. Eat some malt loaf/flapjack/cereal bars such as nutrigrain which will give a good balance of different types of carb. Personally I wouldn't bother with energy bars; they don't give you anything that can't be gained from real food (which is a damn site cheaper as well).

alidaf

Some gels may give you an upset tummy so try before you go on a biggy. Mulebar gels agree with me more than any others I have tried and taste better too. Evans do a trial pack of various mulebar goodies. I've had various freebies given to me at sportives. High5 was one I particularly remembered because it tasted like warm rancid snot and really upset my tummy after a few miles. I find trying to digest some of the solid bars also a bit difficult. There may also be some synergy or otherwise to be gained from your hydration element as well.

MichaelW

Try riding on some proper food. Treat yourself to a Full English Breakfast and take some cornish pasties, scotch eggs or meat pies that you can nibble during your ciggie breaks. Personally, I think that a 50miler deserves a pub break somewhere in the middle.

mr_dobbo

Seems to be a consensus that I need to sort my food out, so no chocolate on ride on to the malt loaf, nutrigrain and bananas, I don't go for gels (unless at rock bottom) or energy bars because they taste so dire, Zitvip drink is bearable. Also get some longer distance flatter rides rather than just looking for getting big hills , and MTFU when the weather moves in.

65g of carb for every hour

If a banana is 20g and flapjack 25g, that means taking a fair amount on a long ride after the first 90 mins of cycling. I think I need bigger pockets or to find a shop!

check out the sugar and fat content of Clusters

Currently on Jordans Honey & Nut.
100g =
Fat 16.8g
Kcals 449 which seems high!
Carbs 62.7g

I'm trying to eat more healthily and drink less now, so time to get into some good habits.

MichaelW, I'm more of a pipe man than ciggies during rides as it doesn't go out so easily, but a pork pie and pub stop sound just up my street, maybe we should hook up a ride some time

Fursty Ferret

The trick with porridge is to liven it up. Quakers do really nice apple and blueberry porridge, and I usually lob some extra fruit in there too.

lastwords

Porridge in the morning with some currents , raisens etc (usually buy mixed dried fruit), then i add about 4-5 dried dates and a banana, sprinkle some cinamon on top for taste.

On a 50 miler i can get by on a banana and a good handfull of dried dates and mixed nuts by the time im finished i am ready for something to eat.

I have only been taking water out with me so far.

t.m.h.n.e.t

Bobbinogs wrote:

The usual advice is that your body should have enough carbs for about 90 mins of cycling (if you have a decent balanced diet). After that you will need about 65g of carb for every hour if you are working really hard (so somthing to eat at 90 mins, something else at ~110mins, then ~130mins, etc.). A banana is about 20g, about 25g for a flapjack. A mixture of different GI foods will help smooth the carb release so you don't get highs/lows.

90g if you use a fructose/glucose mix gels

Mr Dobbo wrote:

Seems to be a consensus that I need to sort my food out, so no chocolate on ride on to the malt loaf, nutrigrain and bananas, I don't go for gels (unless at rock bottom) or energy bars because they taste so dire, Zitvip drink is bearable. Also get some longer distance flatter rides rather than just looking for getting big hills , and MTFU when the weather moves in.

Yep ditch the chocolate

If a banana is 20g and flapjack 25g, that means taking a fair amount on a long ride after the first 90 mins of cycling. I think I need bigger pockets or to find a shop!

It's not hard to make your own flapjacks and carry them in a jersey pocket. Don't rely on buying bananas at a cake stop,little point if they aren't going spotty.

check out the sugar and fat content of Clusters

Currently on Jordans Honey & Nut.
100g =
Fat 16.8g
Kcals 449 which seems high!
Carbs 62.7g

449 for a breakfast/pre-ride is low for me personally. And that's before I add milk

Crankbrother

I just have normal brekkie (2 weetabix) and maybe a banana before a ride of tnat length ... Usually take 3 cereal bars (around 120 kcals each) and eat one every 10 miles for the first 30 to keep things topped up ... Never had any bother, ever ...

Only thing I make sure I do is stop to buy an extra 500ml of water (always carry 1200ml (500ml low sugar sports drink topped up with water to 700ml + 500ml water) with me) ... I always find it's the lack of fluids that has the bigger effect than water ...

If it's a longer ride things like peanut butter and jam sandwiches cut into quarters do the job ...

izza

1) I've started to take rehydration powder for day before and day of ride to help with dehydration.

Noticeable benefit in terms of preventing 'a bad day on the bike' and reducing cramps.

2) Have added whey protein to drinks I am having earlier in the ride in order that blood sugar levels don't peak and trough. Helps with energy and hunger management.

StevenW33

Plan ahead for big rides, it takes more than the morning of the event/ride to fuel up properly.

You should be well hydrated and eating plenty of carbs at least the day before, not to mention having an easy/rest day of exercise (unless a 50miler is easy for you).