Avoiding the Etape Sweeper

skippa76

Hi there,

I have signed up for the Etape Du Tour Act 2. My training - on the whole - has been going okay (I had a groin strain the other month which put me out of action for a few weeks but I'm getting back on track now). However, I am a little fearful of the sweeper.

Does anyone know what the time limit is for the Etape Act 2? I might need to keep this in mind to ensure that I'm putting in enough effort to stay ahead of it, but not over exerting and cooking myself.

alan_a

Worry not about the time limit at the end of the route, worry about the intermediate cut offs which will be at the top of the climbs and feed stops. If you are getting close to the end with the broom car nearby just make sure you get as many people as possible between you and it. The more people they have to DQ before you, the more likely you will beat it to the end.

Also if you are on the last climb and you get DQ'd then keep on going and finish the climb.

jhop

The attached link gives you a good idea of the key times:
http://www.letapedutour.com/ET2/us/Time-schedule.html
They always look achievable particularly from here in the UK in May but when you have done 4 major cols in excessively hot conditions they can end up being quite a challenge and year after year loads of starters fail to make it.

Tom Butcher

Just remember 5 minutes at a feed stop may not seem like long but it takes a lot of catching up on the road - so if you are close to a cut off waste as little time not moving as possible.

mabarbie

I remember back in 2010, the key was getting over the first mountain within the time and then I felt like I was safely home. The wagon seemed to stop at the bottom of the Marie Blanque, or slow down at least, and then there was plenty of time. Agree with Tom, 5 minutes here, there and everywhere will mount up quickly. I was in Argeles water stop after the descent of the Solour and wanted a pee, queues were huge, so I would carry on and pee somewhere else. Save time where you can, keep moving, you should be fine if you've put the training in.

cyclingsheep

I'm with you skippa. It's something I'm dreading as well. I'm assuming that as I don't have any previous Etape time that I'll be starting in the last few gates so that first cut off will be vital. Good luck to you and anyone else on here doing Act 2, I think we'll need it

I am the god of hell fire

Id be inclined to disagree with most of the earlier replies on this thread
In fact Id even go as far as to say dont worry about the sweep at all, just forget about it basically!

Reasons?

Well to be honest over 140km (or 210km) is 5 mins really going to make a big difference to being caught?
In that 5 mins at a feed station youd be giving your legs a rest as well as stocking up on the essentials you need to keep your body going

More importantly if you go off too quickly and get yourself deep into the Republic of Anaerobia you may initially put some space between you and the sweeper but at the cost of blowing up towards the end of the day

I really was one of the last 50 to start Act 1 last year from the last pen
In a photo taken by my mates 5km down the road you can see the pre broom lurking in the background :shock:

Naturally do your own research and plan a strategy as you feel appropriate
I hope my post gives you something to think about

Best of luck - its a corking day out

alan_a

I am the god of hell fire wrote:

Id be inclined to disagree with most of the earlier replies on this thread
In fact Id even go as far as to say dont worry about the sweep at all, just forget about it basically!

Reasons?

Well to be honest over 140km (or 210km) is 5 mins really going to make a big difference to being caught?
In that 5 mins at a feed station youd be giving your legs a rest as well as stocking up on the essentials you need to keep your body going

More importantly if you go off too quickly and get yourself deep into the Republic of Anaerobia you may initially put some space between you and the sweeper but at the cost of blowing up towards the end of the day

I really was one of the last 50 to start Act 1 last year from the last pen
In a photo taken by my mates 5km down the road you can see the pre broom lurking in the background :shock:

Naturally do your own research and plan a strategy as you feel appropriate
I hope my post gives you something to think about

Best of luck - its a corking day out

2 years ago at Pau I was the last person to cross the start line, accompanied by 3 drunken students, the broom was only 500 metres behind me.





5 minutes here and 5 minutes there really does make all the difference when avoiding the broom wagon.

By the time I got to the top of Marie Blanque I was 35 minutes ahead of the broom cut off. I would have been more but there was 3000 people walking up the climb in front of me.

I made the bottom of Col du Soulor with a 2 hours to get to the top b4 the broom. I made it by 3 minutes.

As a fast descender I hung about at the top of the climb for about 10 minutes knowing that there was only 2 more control gates to get through - at the feed station in Argeles Gazost and at the foot of Tourmalet.

Refreshed I powered down Soulor easily hitting speeds of 50mph+ and passing everyone. I got to the feed station in the village square to find the exit was in the process of being blocked by stewards with crash barriers. Riders were being prevented from continuing. Fortunately for me a support motorbike needed through, along with 1 other guy we dashed through and chain ganged our way towards the Tourmalet. Everyone ahead of us was gubbed... so were we.

There are two avalanche control tunnels on the valley road. It being a hot day there was approx 100 riders taking rest in each. At the first one I cycled to the far end of the tunnel and watched the broom DQ those at the other end.

I made it onto the Tourmalet, I made it almost to Super Bareges where the broom vehicle finally caught up with me. After taking my chip and crossing my number out they drove 100m up the road and stopped for a coffee. Apparently I was the last person they DQ'd on the road. Had I made it passed the ski lift onto the final 6km climb I would have been allowed to officially finish.

These are the 2 b@st@rds that DQ'd me.



My advice for finishing before the broom would be...

1. Forget about stopping at the first feed station. The "climb" from Aubisque to Soulor is nothing. It's almost downhill to the 2nd feed stop. Carry enough food and water to get you to the 2nd stop. The more time you hang about at stop 1 the less likely you will be to get into a big group and draft your way along the surprisingly long false flat of the valley floor to the foot of Tourmalet.

2. It's better to knock you speed off in the valley and be in a group rather than be 300m further up the road on your own.

3. Don't worry about getting to the front of your pen. Stay in bed for an extra hour, enjoy a relaxing brioche and espresso in the square and sit on a bench overlooking the park. The alternative is to waste energy standing on your cleats for 45minutes impersonating cattle.



4. Don't take your wife and 3 month old daughter with you and only get 3 hours sleep the night before in a campsite 15km from the start and TT to the start with 5 minutes to spare.

Rob Somerset

Alan,
The mention of the Tunnels on the valley road towards the Tourmalet brought back some memories, I did a 5 minute break from the sun in there. Jeez it was hot. If it wasn't for the locals tipping water over me in Bareges I think I may have melted. I avoided the last cut off by about 20mins and finished prbably in the last 300 riders. I think you need to allow plenty of time for some stops, and a contingency for the weather it can be very hot or very cold. The ony way to do this is by training. I was doing about 150 to 200 miles a week for the 2 months before the event, which as it turned out was probably the minimum I could have gotten away with. Its a good day out but you don't want to ruin it by turning it into a slogging match with the broom wagon. Rob

TheStone

They're really strict on the cut-offs in the Etape and they're not as generous as many other big rides.

In the past, I've printed off the cut-off times and kept an eye on them.

Datameister

It's an obvious thing to say but, now that the time schedules are published, plan your ride.

The wagon does slow on the uphills, so you need to achieve a lower speed to stay in front. Judge how fast you CAN go up the climbs, and don't try to go any faster, you may as well book your wagon ticket now if you try that. If your at a feed station, and close to cutoff, leave your bike on the far side of the potential cutoff barrier, and walk back. 'Pedestrians' have been seen to jump barriers.

Most important is to plan, plan, plan though. I completed the 'easy' Tourmalet & Hautacam in 2008 whilst weighing over 100kg. The plan was:
1. find group
2. keep in/on back of group (dig in so as not to lose it)
3. climb at own pace (inevitably losing group)
4. Repeat 1-3 as required

And it may be obvious to say it but, if you're aiming to finish just ahead of the wagon, you do not need to build up a 1 hour lead. Unless you are last off, you'll have 20-30 minutes leeway, just seek to maintain that by going at "broom wagon speed" up all the climbs

lochindaal

I've done the Etape 3 times now and this really comes down to your training. If you have trained then it's no issue.

The "excitement" of the broom wagon certainly plays on your mind before your first Etape. Assuming you can make a reasonable pace though you realise after a couple of hours bar a mechanical it will never catch you. By a reasonable pace I mean 26-28km/hr on the flat, 12 uphill and 60+ downhill.

By the the time I did my 3rd one last year I wasn't even thinking of it at the start.

Your biggest mistake would be to go too hard at the beginning to avoid it as you will certainly pay for it on the climbs at the end.

On the Pau - tourmalet stage mentioned above when people started walking on the Solouer this climb came right near the beginning and we were already talking about if you can't get up here now you have no chance to finish because you've obviously not trained.

cyclingsheep

As part of my training for the Etape Act 2 this year I rode the Fred Whitton loop, plus an additional 22 miles to and from my accommodation, this weekend. 134 miles in 11 and a half hours including stops and solo so no groups to help tow me along. I'm glad I did it as now I'm pretty sure I'll beat the broom wagon and can just enjoy the ride.

skippa76

Nice effort Cyclingsheep... you'll be fine with that prep.

My training took a bit of a hit a few months back with a bad groin strain so I'm on the road to recovery at the moment.

In the last few weeks I've upped the mileage to over 220 miles a week (longest being around 65 miles with three 50 odd milers). Whilst my single ride distance isn't quite there yet I do feel myself getting stronger and my stamina/endurance/recovery is improving too. Whilst there is nothing around me that will match the profile of the etape, living in the Pennines does provide it's fair share of climbs. My remaining plan for upping the distance for the Etape is as folows.

28 May – 3rd June – Longest ride = 75 miles, total miles 230
4th June – 10th June – Longest ride = 90 miles, total miles 240
11th June – 17th June – Longest ride = 100 miles, total miles 250
18th June – 24th June – Longest ride = 110 miles, total miles 250
25th June – 1st July – Longest ride = 120 miles, total miles 260
2nd July – 8th July – Longest ride = 120 miles, total miles 260
8th July – Etape Act II - Small rides and acclimatisation

Hopefully that'll be enough to get me around!

Rob Somerset

Thats an impressive schedule, but I thinks its spot on what you need for Acte 2 which is a monster. I thought my 2010 etape from Pau was hard, but there is added pain this year. I'm no athlete and in my 50's but I put in the best training effort that I could. I was astounded on the day by the number of riders, practically all British, who clearly had little chance of completing the course. Enjoy the day.

xscreamsuk

I've made a little cutout of avge speeds needed to get to certain points, hopefully will be ok, put plenty miles in and am now upping intensity of the shorter ones as per my training plan. Really looking forward to first foreign sportive.

Boleynboy

xscreamsuk wrote:

I've made a little cutout of avge speeds needed to get to certain points, hopefully will be ok, put plenty miles in and am now upping intensity of the shorter ones as per my training plan. Really looking forward to first foreign sportive.

You do not need to do this, you will be given a pocket size sheet with all the cutoff times along the route when you sign on. This is really helpful as you can keep referring to it throughout the ride, and you will know exactly how much time you have before the dreaded sweeper arrives.
I did my first etape last year and I was anxious about it, but the cut off times are fairly generous as long as you have put the miles in, I stayed 45-60 mins in front of it the whole way round, and I knew that because of the timing sheet, so it is very reassuring!

I am the god of hell fire

^^^^^^ This

I wrote down the elimination times and places, along with food stops, on a scabby bit of paper which I taped to my top tube for easy reference

oneof1982

Having a look at the sheet in advance is essential. We also found it useful to do some average speed calculations in advance to give us some idea of what was expected. The times are clearly geared to clearing out the crud by the first food station, so it is worth having an idea at what speed you will need to go at. Last year, I was only 15 mins ahead at first station (though it was chaos anyway because of the drop out rate - Acte II), but was 90 minutes ahead by the end.

For Acte I this year there is at least 2h45mins (if you start last) to get to top of Madeleine. If you make this it eases off.

mrc1

Alan A wrote:

I am the god of hell fire wrote:

Id be inclined to disagree with most of the earlier replies on this thread
In fact Id even go as far as to say dont worry about the sweep at all, just forget about it basically!

Reasons?

Well to be honest over 140km (or 210km) is 5 mins really going to make a big difference to being caught?
In that 5 mins at a feed station youd be giving your legs a rest as well as stocking up on the essentials you need to keep your body going

More importantly if you go off too quickly and get yourself deep into the Republic of Anaerobia you may initially put some space between you and the sweeper but at the cost of blowing up towards the end of the day

I really was one of the last 50 to start Act 1 last year from the last pen
In a photo taken by my mates 5km down the road you can see the pre broom lurking in the background :shock:

Naturally do your own research and plan a strategy as you feel appropriate
I hope my post gives you something to think about

Best of luck - its a corking day out

2 years ago at Pau I was the last person to cross the start line, accompanied by 3 drunken students, the broom was only 500 metres behind me.





5 minutes here and 5 minutes there really does make all the difference when avoiding the broom wagon.

By the time I got to the top of Marie Blanque I was 35 minutes ahead of the broom cut off. I would have been more but there was 3000 people walking up the climb in front of me.

I made the bottom of Col du Soulor with a 2 hours to get to the top b4 the broom. I made it by 3 minutes.

As a fast descender I hung about at the top of the climb for about 10 minutes knowing that there was only 2 more control gates to get through - at the feed station in Argeles Gazost and at the foot of Tourmalet.

Refreshed I powered down Soulor easily hitting speeds of 50mph+ and passing everyone. I got to the feed station in the village square to find the exit was in the process of being blocked by stewards with crash barriers. Riders were being prevented from continuing. Fortunately for me a support motorbike needed through, along with 1 other guy we dashed through and chain ganged our way towards the Tourmalet. Everyone ahead of us was gubbed... so were we.

There are two avalanche control tunnels on the valley road. It being a hot day there was approx 100 riders taking rest in each. At the first one I cycled to the far end of the tunnel and watched the broom DQ those at the other end.

I made it onto the Tourmalet, I made it almost to Super Bareges where the broom vehicle finally caught up with me. After taking my chip and crossing my number out they drove 100m up the road and stopped for a coffee. Apparently I was the last person they DQ'd on the road. Had I made it passed the ski lift onto the final 6km climb I would have been allowed to officially finish.

These are the 2 b@st@rds that DQ'd me.



My advice for finishing before the broom would be...

1. Forget about stopping at the first feed station. The "climb" from Aubisque to Soulor is nothing. It's almost downhill to the 2nd feed stop. Carry enough food and water to get you to the 2nd stop. The more time you hang about at stop 1 the less likely you will be to get into a big group and draft your way along the surprisingly long false flat of the valley floor to the foot of Tourmalet.

2. It's better to knock you speed off in the valley and be in a group rather than be 300m further up the road on your own.

3. Don't worry about getting to the front of your pen. Stay in bed for an extra hour, enjoy a relaxing brioche and espresso in the square and sit on a bench overlooking the park. The alternative is to waste energy standing on your cleats for 45minutes impersonating cattle.



4. Don't take your wife and 3 month old daughter with you and only get 3 hours sleep the night before in a campsite 15km from the start and TT to the start with 5 minutes to spare.

Great post and a fine use of pictures - had me in stitches in places!

cyclingsheep

Have I read the timing sheets incorrectly then? By my calculations the avg speed needed to make the first feed stop is just over 8mph but to complete ahead of the sweeper you need an avg of 10.5mph which suggests it's getting faster not slower as the distance increases.

davidof

For Acte I this year there is at least 2h45mins (if you start last) to get to top of Madeleine. If you make this it eases off.

Isn't the start in Albertville which is around 30 minutes from the base of the climb; the Madeleine is fairly long and fairly steep in places (9-10% over some km) so that's not a huge amount of time.

cyclingsheep

Sorry, I should have specified, I was calculating for Act2, and on leaving last (as I suspect I will be)

richa

cyclingsheep wrote:

Have I read the timing sheets incorrectly then? By my calculations the avg speed needed to make the first feed stop is just over 8mph but to complete ahead of the sweeper you need an avg of 10.5mph which suggests it's getting faster not slower as the distance increases.

It is based upon the terrain, so is faster downhill than flat or uphill etc.

xscreamsuk

First feed stop is at 52 K and if off last you have 2.59 to get there, making it 10.9 mph, but to get to Bielle at 28 K in you need to avge 15.7mph if off last, after that it drops dramatically as the climbs start, eg to big food stop 2 avge needs to be 11.6 mph.

I plan to shake the legs / bike out on the starting few K a day or so beforehand, really looking forward to it,