Silly Commuting Protest
Comments
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Unfortunately subtlety won't work in getting a message across that many people don't want to hear. When it comes to raising awareness and getting funding I think its a case of he who shouts loudest, the squeaky wheel get's the oil, and so on.0
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it was a good (bloody and wet and cold!!!) ride with a positive vibe and carnival atmosphere if like me and my brother, you positioned yourself near to the guy with the booming soundsystem
the tourists were all smiles, many people had dressed up, people were generally happy despite the weather (how many more would've turned out if sunny?!?!?) and the message went out over all the main news channels.
2 noobs (me and my brother) are now committed to the cause and better educated, and the main mayoral candidates are now signed up to the go dutch campaign.
Bloody successful day really, screw the minor inconvenience to the people who choose to drive through central london at any time. If you have to then fair enough (white van men on business, cabbies and so on) but you know what? I'm a londoner born and bred and I dont know anyone who drives through central london - why the hell would you? I've always been amazed at the numbers of cars I see in london rush hour stuck in traffic...why why why???
Anyway mini rant over. Nothing to see here, it was all good on the day
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There is nothing inherenty wrong or criminal with driving through Central London at anytime and those roads are not solely intended for bicycles and pedestrians. The roads are there for shared use. Cyclist trying to claim ownership of roads for themselves is as bad as motorists claiming we don't pay road tax and thus have no right to be on the roads.
I have driven and drive through London for many reasons (there are hospitals, houses, restaurants etc in central London I may be transporting someone who cannot get PT safely or in comfort), none of which need to be justified beyond the fact that I felt it necessary to do so and that there was no viable alternative routes to the destination/s (and I feel that is explanation too much). Not least of which I pay road tax, both of them.
Now, I'm not keen on parts of this 'Go Dutch' bollox (the parts that would segregate us from cars and have us ride on narrow cycle lanes restricted to the speed of the bike infront and no space to ovetake - or parts that advocate lowering speed limits to 20mph when there is no real reason to do that to cars).
I'm even less keen on the doom and gloom reports I keep reading and watching that detail the perils of cycling. I also grow tired of this supposed cyclist-motorist war it's a shared space get over it. How about something positive for a change or a positive slant on things.
Yes, raising awareness to cycling is a good thing but in many ways the approach is to take something incredibly negative and then shock as many as possible and be cantankerous (the Addison Lee 'die-in' for example - there were better ways to make and argue the point). There are other more positive ways to raise awareness to cycling and safety for cycling.
The motorists I speak to don't sympathise with cyclists, they don't emphathise with the cause and worse still they don't and don't want to know why we ride bikes. In all of our complaining, campaigning, film footage and protesting I fear the message of "how great it is to ride a bike" is often forgotten or drowned out, when I believe that should be the main message.
Furthermore there are still many cyclists who refuse to see where they might have gone wrong or where they could have given way, tapped the brakes, signal their intent or even GIVE WAY. Cyclists can be unreasonable. So we aren't always blameless in the reduction of our safety, a safety that we are primarily responsible for. We are also largely untrained and I'd argue 10, 20, 30yrs driving experience arguable makes a better driver than 1, 2 ,3yrs commuting makes a cyclists. So we need to acknowledge that and take some responsbility in learning how to ensure our safety on the roads as well. In other words if we are going to campaign for safer roads how about asking for compulsory training at schools as well? Or free training and more insurance options - with discounts if you've passed said test.
For all the roads and cycle lanes and phased lights that are being asked for, the biggest contributing factor to ensuring our safety is knowledge, road sense and the ability to anticipate situations, all of which can be taught through training.
What bothers me most is how we've alienated ourselves from motorists. They've labelled us cyclists, we call them motorists and somehow have forgotten that some of us drive to work too (I do 120miles driving a day when I do) and that some motorists actually ride bikes. We no longer invite motorists to come and join us on a bike because it's fun. No, many of us fall upon the maxim "us and them" and all of that is what I take issue with.
I may be wrong, probably am.
Still, I'm done.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
I thought I was done with this too.DonDaddyD wrote:There is nothing inherenty wrong or criminal with driving through Central London at anytime and those roads are not solely intended for bicycles and pedestrians. The roads are there for shared use. Cyclist trying to claim ownership of roads for themselves is as bad as motorists claiming we don't pay road tax and thus have no right to be on the roads.
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Now, I'm not keen on parts of this 'Go Dutch' bollox
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Furthermore there are still many cyclists who refuse to see where they might have gone wrong or where they could have given way, tapped the brakes, signalled their intent when they encounter a car. Cyclists can be unreasonable. So we aren't always blameless in the reduction of our safety... So we need to acknowledge that and take some responsbility in learning how to ensure our sfety on the roads as well. In other words if we are going to campaign for safer roads how about asking for compulsory training at schools as well? Or free training and more insurance options - with discounts if you've passed said test.
For all the roads and cycle lanes and phased lights that are being asked for, the biggest contributing factor to ensuring our safety is knowledge, road sense and the ability to anticipate situations, all of which can be taught through training.
What bothers me most is how we've alienated ourselves from motorists. They've labelled us cyclists and we've forgotten that some of us drive to work too (I do 120miles driving a day when I do) and that some motorists actually ride bikes. We no longer invite motorists to come and join us on a bike because it's fun. No, many of us fall upon the maxim "us and them" and all of that is what I take issue with.
I may be wrong, probably am.
Still, I'm done.
You're not always wrong, only sometimes. ;-).
I agree with many of your points. I actually enjoy driving through London on occasion, but, I pick my moments. I don't agree with all of the points on these campaigns, but, I support the majority and think it would improve things for the rest of my family (being selfish for a moment). I am all in favour of training in schools. The ridiculous thing being the school would only give my son a place if he already cycled to school, so I argued that I wanted the training BEFORE he cycled to school. Which he has now had. We shouldn't completely alienate drivers, but using other useless analogies, you have to break some eggs to make an omelette.0 -
Nobody drives in London, theres too much traffic...0
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DonDaddyD wrote:...Furthermore there are still many cyclists who refuse to see where they might have gone wrong or where they could have given way, tapped the brakes, signal their intent or even GIVE WAY. Cyclists can be unreasonable. So we aren't always blameless in the reduction of our safety, a safety that we are primarily responsible for. We are also largely untrained and I'd argue 10, 20, 30yrs driving experience arguable makes a better driver than 1, 2 ,3yrs commuting makes a cyclists. So we need to acknowledge that and take some responsbility in learning how to ensure our safety on the roads as well. In other words if we are going to campaign for safer roads how about asking for compulsory training at schools as well? Or free training and more insurance options - with discounts if you've passed said test.
For all the roads and cycle lanes and phased lights that are being asked for, the biggest contributing factor to ensuring our safety is knowledge, road sense and the ability to anticipate situations, all of which can be taught through training.
Still, I'm done.
Just thought I'd point out that training for cyclists is part of some of the campaigns1. Lorries entering a city centre should be required by law to fit sensors, audible turning alarms, extra mirrors and safety bars to stop cyclists being thrown under the wheels.
2. The 500 most dangerous road junctions must be identified, redesigned or fitted with priority traffic lights for cyclists and Trixi mirrors that allow lorry drivers to see cyclists on their near-side.
3. A national audit of cycling to find out how many people cycle in Britain and how cyclists are killed or injured should be held to underpin effective cycle safety.
4. Two per cent of the Highways Agency budget should be earmarked for next generation cycle routes, providing £100 million a year towards world-class cycling infrastructure. Each year cities should be graded on the quality of cycling provision.
5. The training of cyclists and drivers must improve and cycle safety should become a core part of the driving test.
6. 20mph should become the default speed limit in residential areas where there are no cycle lanes.
7. Businesses should be invited to sponsor cycleways and cycling super-highways, mirroring the Barclays-backed bicycle hire scheme in London.
8. Every city, even those without an elected mayor, should appoint a cycling commissioner to push home reforms.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I'm talking about the 'Go Dutch campaign'. And to be honest, I think training should be at the forefront of these campaigns.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
Why?DonDaddyD wrote:I'm talking about the 'Go Dutch campaign'. And to be honest, I think training should be at the forefront of these campaigns.0 -
DonDaddyD wrote:There is nothing inherenty wrong or criminal with driving through Central London at anytime and those roads are not solely intended for bicycles and pedestrians. The roads are there for shared use. Cyclist trying to claim ownership of roads for themselves is as bad as motorists claiming we don't pay road tax and thus have no right to be on the roads.
I have driven and drive through London for many reasons (there are hospitals, houses, restaurants etc in central London I may be transporting someone who cannot get PT safely or in comfort), none of which need to be justified beyond the fact that I felt it necessary to do so and that there was no viable alternative routes to the destination/s (and I feel that is explanation too much). Not least of which I pay road tax, both of them.
Now, I'm not keen on parts of this 'Go Dutch' bollox (the parts that would segregate us from cars and have us ride on narrow cycle lanes restricted to the speed of the bike infront and no space to ovetake - or parts that advocate lowering speed limits to 20mph when there is no real reason to do that to cars).
I'm even less keen on the doom and gloom reports I keep reading and watching that detail the perils of cycling. I also grow tired of this supposed cyclist-motorist war it's a shared space get over it. How about something positive for a change or a positive slant on things.
Yes, raising awareness to cycling is a good thing but in many ways the approach is to take something incredibly negative and then shock as many as possible and be cantankerous (the Addison Lee 'die-in' for example - there were better ways to make and argue the point). There are other more positive ways to raise awareness to cycling and safety for cycling.
The motorists I speak to don't sympathise with cyclists, they don't emphathise with the cause and worse still they don't and don't want to know why we ride bikes. In all of our complaining, campaigning, film footage and protesting I fear the message of "how great it is to ride a bike" is often forgotten or drowned out, when I believe that should be the main message.
Furthermore there are still many cyclists who refuse to see where they might have gone wrong or where they could have given way, tapped the brakes, signal their intent or even GIVE WAY. Cyclists can be unreasonable. So we aren't always blameless in the reduction of our safety, a safety that we are primarily responsible for. We are also largely untrained and I'd argue 10, 20, 30yrs driving experience arguable makes a better driver than 1, 2 ,3yrs commuting makes a cyclists. So we need to acknowledge that and take some responsbility in learning how to ensure our safety on the roads as well. In other words if we are going to campaign for safer roads how about asking for compulsory training at schools as well? Or free training and more insurance options - with discounts if you've passed said test.
For all the roads and cycle lanes and phased lights that are being asked for, the biggest contributing factor to ensuring our safety is knowledge, road sense and the ability to anticipate situations, all of which can be taught through training.
What bothers me most is how we've alienated ourselves from motorists. They've labelled us cyclists, we call them motorists and somehow have forgotten that some of us drive to work too (I do 120miles driving a day when I do) and that some motorists actually ride bikes. We no longer invite motorists to come and join us on a bike because it's fun. No, many of us fall upon the maxim "us and them" and all of that is what I take issue with.
I may be wrong, probably am.
Still, I'm done.
Holy smoke, I don't think I've ever agreed with you before DDD, at least not 95% of what you've said. Absolutely agree with the roads are for everyone, cyclists AND motorists bit, the responsiblity for our own safety bit, the need to give way occasionally and the Go Dutch bollox.
And congrats on fatherhood, btw.
Cori0 -
Many thanks Cori!Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
All positive I think, I got very cold and wet given I'd swung by post training in the park and wasn't dressed for walking pace. Hence I didn't do the full route.
Only real irateness I saw was one cabby telling us we'd be the death of London but given it was raining and he was stuck in traffic with a fare I don't think he had anything to complain about!
There was the wedding couple on Picadilly who we could have caused some serious delay for but maybe they were fine. I agree with comments that no one knew whate we were protesting for.If I know you, and I like you, you can borrow my bike box for £30 a week. PM for details.0 -
Quite difficult to cycle and hold a placard innit.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Meanwhile in sunny Rome, as many as 50,000 took to the streets on two wheels.
:shock:0 -
DonDaddyD wrote:There is nothing inherenty wrong or criminal with driving through Central London at anytime and those roads are not solely intended for bicycles and pedestrians. The roads are there for shared use. Cyclist trying to claim ownership of roads for themselves is as bad as motorists claiming we don't pay road tax and thus have no right to be on the roads.
That's a deliberate and dishonest straw man, NOBODY is saying roads are just for cyclists, where are you getting this garbage from?
The ride wasn't about inconveniencing your shopping trip, it was about people dying.0 -
notsoblue wrote:
Why?DonDaddyD wrote:I'm talking about the 'Go Dutch campaign'. And to be honest, I think training should be at the forefront of these campaigns.
To answer that question people could perhaps address the point that in the 16 London cyclist's deaths last year blame was applied to the cyclist in only one example.0 -
Boris really isn't the cycling mayor that he is made out to be is he*. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-17902307
*Disclaimer: I never thought he was.0 -
50,000 people on one bike?! That's a good trick!iPete wrote:Meanwhile in sunny Rome, as many as 50,000 took to the streets on two wheels.
:shock:
I'm not a Laahndaahna or Edinburgh-er, but from the photos and tweets I saw relating to the big ride(s) at the weekend it seemed fairly positive. Just lots of people saying "we're here, there's loads of us, can you pay some attention to us when you're making planning/policy decisions please".
However, the "die in" looked a bit like one of those silly PETA protests, although I think the AL boss was being stupid, I'm not sure the amateur dramatics were necessary.0 -
I expect Mrs Dowling enjoyed Boris's glib remarks about cyclists with dreadlocks, clad in lycra jumping red lights.0
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LOLZ but he was on HIGNFY, so you should vote for him. BOZZER!mybreakfastconsisted wrote:I expect Mrs Dowling enjoyed Boris's glib remarks about cyclists with dreadlocks, clad in lycra jumping red lights.0 -
Mrs Dorling, I beg your pardon, Brian Dorling's widow. I think Boris misjudged the mood there quite badly.0
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bails87 wrote:
LOLZ but he was on HIGNFY, so you should vote for him. BOZZER!mybreakfastconsisted wrote:I expect Mrs Dowling enjoyed Boris's glib remarks about cyclists with dreadlocks, clad in lycra jumping red lights.
LOL! LEGERND!0
