Heavy cargo bike - mechanical or hydro discs?

msw

I know this is the MTB forum but I thought you guys would know the most about disc brakes...

I'm buying a cargo bike, and reviews say it has one main weak spot - the stock (mechanical) disc brakes, which are quite cheap ones, are prone to fading and need lots of adjustment. So I'm thinking I'll ask the shop to switch out at least the front one when they set the bike up, since I'll be carrying my daughter on the back and I don't want to take any chances with braking.

So the question is, what are the relative advantages/disadvantages of good mechanical v entry-level hydraulic discs, for this type of use? At the moment I think I'm looking at comparing something like Avid BB7s with something like Avid Elixirs or Shimano Deore or XT, but do let me know if I'm way off in assuming they're comparable.

To sum up: I'm not going to be braking all the time as if I were riding downhill; I don't think I need to worry about standing the bike on its front wheel with shopping and kids on the back; I don't care about the weight of the brakes; I don't mind learning to set up hydro brakes properly if it means less regular tinkering than mechanicals.

Thanks in advance!

thel33ter

A pair of Deore XT's will stop you no problem, and are wayy above a set of BB7's, or any mechanical disc.

Once they're bled properly, odds are all you'll have to do is change the pads for the first couple of years, and after that bleeding is as simple as maintaining a pair of cable discs IMO.

nicklouse

BB7 and a 203 disc will sort you out right.

Things to consider is the shifters are they combined with the brake levers? Added cost if you are going hydro.

msw

Thanks guys, in the end I've gone for a BB7 on the front and Avid levers, mainly for cost reasons.

The Rookie

Good choice, a friend runs BB7 on the front of his tandem that regularily clocks 50mph downhills, did swap to XT but it didn't stop any faster so he put them back on his MTB.

billyripper

Hey! Any feedback at this point on the bb7's? I am planning to travel from Germany to India on a cargo bike and am still not sure which brake system would be best.
Thanks!

nicklouse

billyripper wrote:

Hey! Any feedback at this point on the bb7's? I am planning to travel from Germany to India on a cargo bike and am still not sure which brake system would be best.
Thanks!

your requirements are toltally different as you need to think of available parts and spares. I would NOT go hydro for this.

I may even consider different braking altogether.

The Rookie

BB7's work just fine, they do need adjusting (Hydro's self adjust), but as Nick says for that trip I'd consider going V-brake as the parts will be easier to access in the middle of nowhere.

I ride in India occasionally, PM me for any hints and tips for that neck of the woods!

john2002

billyripper wrote:

Hey! Any feedback at this point on the bb7's? I am planning to travel from Germany to India on a cargo bike and am still not sure which brake system would be best.
Thanks!

What nicklouse said. you need to think about repairs and spares if your to do this sort of trip. i would choose
v-brakes. you should be able to find spares anywhere and you could also do temp repairs if you really needed to (macgyver style)

The Rookie

To be fair
Germany - OK
Turkey - OK
Pakistan (?) - not OK
India - OK (just find a Decathlon dealer, they are spreading fast across the country and the Btiwn stuff is cheaper there than here!

BB7's are just a unique caliper, the pads I would expect to carry as spares, the lever and cable are generic.

billyripper

That is indeed the plan, Germany, Turkey, Iran, Pakistan, India..

I am considering taking quite some tools with me on the road. The last couple of years I've been working as a bicycle mechanic and I'd like to be able to fix other people's bikes as well, maybe in exchange for some food and/or shelter. Thus I thought it's not a bad idea to go hydraulic as they need less maintenance than mechanical ones and since I carry the tools around anyway, repairs are not really an issue. Spares though are.

Okay, so you say either BB7's or different braking. Another idea I had was mounting BB7's and carrying around a set of V-brake spares (same levers). But, since my cargo bike is really quite long, I am unsure whether or not I lose too much braking power on the front due to the length of the cable (compression issue?).

Then, the third consideration, there is braking power. I weigh around 65 kilos, the bike around 26 and the cargo will be somewhere between 60 and 70 kilos (i know, that's a lot...). Will mechanics stop me going down a steep hill? I am lucky to be able to say I am dutch as an excuse to not have ridden mountains once in my life, but I might run in to a few on the way. My experience here is lacking, also in knowledge but I really would like to be able to stop. And I'd like to not brake through my rims either.

With all this in mind, any more thoughts?

nicklouse

the biggest concern i have with the hydros is spare hose.

taking that out of the equation then hydros could be the way. now here is a where i would recomend some steel braided hose.

what bike is it? got a link? what size front wheel?

I have some good ideas but just need to see what you have.

billyripper

This one, without the cargo-frame:


It has a 20"(406) front and a 26"(559) rear wheel.

nicklouse

interesting
http://www.pedalpower.de/produkte/laste ... ong_harry/

so it comes with a kick stand that will hold it in place.

been doing my usual thinking and I think i would like dual front brakes so mod the fork to take a second caliper and rebuild the wheem with a dual disc hub, mod a pair of lever assys to work with one lever.
eg

for the rear I would lose the rear mech and go for an internal gear hub. (disc or drum brake? not sure) I would also fit a set of V brakes operated by a locking lever to act as a parking brake if needed (also an emergancy brake if needed.) would not need to be bar mounted.

I would also look at some gearing on the cranks. as you might not get the range you want from a hub or even a cassette set up.

but again I am nuts.

The Rookie

Nick is nuttier than a fruit and nut bar!

203mm front disc and BB7's well maintained will be upto the task at the front, for the rear I would defiantely go rim brakes.

My Friend with the Tandem has BB7's and a rear rim (operated by the stoker) and the whole outift with luggage is heavier than yours and that copes fine, for long trail braking periods use the rim brakes, for stopping the disc(s).

While an internal hub gear is more reliable, if it does go wrong you'll be stuffed whereas a derailleur is easier to cobble to keep you going, personally I'd stick with a derailleur. You'll want the widest range at the rear you can get, the site seems to imply it's 24 speed, so you'll want a 11-32 or the (harder to find) 11-34 cassette.

Though I notice that this one http://www.pedalpower.de/produkte/laste ... 1475-1.jpg has a hub gear!

nicklouse

should also add a mate and his lass often charge around on this.



oh and the reason for the dual fronts is only for if one fails.

The Rookie

So your friends are nutty as well!

nicklouse

The Rookie wrote:

So your friends are nutty as well!

totally.

billyripper

Thanks! Funny: the downhill tandem is from the same manufacturer.

About the gears: we will be travelling for a not yet determined amount of time, so if we are in need of replacements, I'd have to be able to find them. Therefore I choose to ride 3x9 Shimano, even though I much prefer SRAM. Internal gear hubs are great when they work. When they break, they are a pain in the butt. I used to do messenger work in Berlin and every year the Alfine in our Bullitt broke, forcing us to buy a new one. Of course you can order things online and have it shipped everywhere, but this takes time and costs money, also with import rights in mind. So, 3x9.

Brakes: great idea with the double pull lever. I used to ride a 3-wheeled cargo bike that used a similar lever for the two front wheels. It's nerving to adjust though. The particular one you posted looks great, is it a mechanical one? The ones I keep finding are cheap things or the Paul ones (which are probably for caliper brakes). With a double pull setup, I'd probably best be looking at a combination of BB7 and V-Brakes, both front and rear.
I also considered the Sturmey Archer XL-FDD -since I want to ride a dynamo hub anyway-, but it weighs a staggering 1350 grams. Just the hub! But no heat issues.

Still having a hard time deciding. The braking is a bit different from tandem braking. We will be riding through the Alps, the Balkan Alps and will run in to plenty of downhill sections where a moderate speed is preferred with a loaded cargo bike with a 20" front wheel. But modulating speed downhill is just not a good idea. Nervous! I will see if I can find some decent double pull levers.