Wheel Upgrade £350 to £400

Kevyb

Hi Guys,

I'm looking to upgrade my wheels - Currently have Hope Pro 2 with EN321 rims

Looking at :

Hope Pro 2 evo with Mavic UST rims £350 (merlin cycles)

Mavic Crosstrail wheels set £360

Whats your opinions / recomendations

Kev

nicklouse

what are you looking to gain from the change?
what is wrong with your current ones?
which UST rim as Mavic do make more than one UST rim.

Kevyb

Mavic XM819

My wheels are at least 6 years old now and someone has offered me a good price. Looking to save weight as always. I have a GT Force Carbon.

spongtastic

Hope Pro 2 Evo on Flow.
Or Superstar Switch on Flow.

The XM819s are heavy.

The Rookie

Crank brothers Cobalt?

http://www.discountcyclesdirect.co.uk/p ... s_id=12836

Simon

Northwind

819 is a good but very old rim, but Stans Flow is stronger, wider and lighter (and though not UST, is still tubeless ready- once taped up it makes practically no difference). Arch EX is lighter still but I've not used one so can't comment on strength. That doesn't sound like a particularily good price either tbh.

How hard do you ride? Force can be all things to all men I'm a big fan of my Roval Traverses, they're £360 and are miles lighter than what you're looking at but still sturdy. Not as sturdy as a Flow or probably even a well-build 819 though, but my 2 pairs have done good service- I did manage to break one a little after some enduro racing at innerleithen on a 6 inch bike, and popped a spoke on the worldcup route at fort william but that's OK. It won't be as strong a wheelset as your current one but then, do you need it? Yours have lasted 6 years, are they still in good nick or are they hammered?

Kevyb

wow those crank brother wheels are nice, forgot to mention 15mm from axel

cooldad

Kevyb wrote:

wow those crank brother wheels are nice, forgot to mention 15mm from axel

And quite cheap because they are made out of cheese.

toasty

spongtastic wrote:

Hope Pro 2 Evo on Flow.

I'd do that too personally. They'll be cheaper if you get them as Hope Hoops too:

http://www.winstanleysbikes.co.uk/product/40400/Hope_Pro_2_EVO_No_Tubes_Flow_Standard_Lacing_Rear_Wheel
http://www.winstanleysbikes.co.uk/product/41996/Hope_Pro_2_EVO_No_Tubes_Flow_Standard_Lacing_Front_Wheel

Pop some yellow tape in if you want to run them tubeless, mine have been fine with Nobby Nics and High Rollers tubeless with just tape for a couple of years. Much wider rim than the 819, similar weight.

Kevyb

cheers guys, I think its Hope Hoops. Is straight pull or standard pull spokes better ?

toasty

Kevyb wrote:

cheers guys, I think its Hope Hoops. Is straight pull or standard pull spokes better ?

Either way, I go with standard as they're far easier to find replacements for.

Kevyb

Would it be exspensive to replace just the rims, I know the rims would be £150 but what about paying someone to swap them over ?

toasty

Stans rims are quite expensive separately, I think you'd be better off selling your current ones and buying some new ones personally. You'll potentially need rims + spokes.

Kevyb

With the stans rims what tyres do I need, tubeless or ust

Northwind

Neither- you can go tubeless with most normal tyres too. Or you can use tubeless ready or UST.

IBISMojoHDamon

spongtastic wrote:

Hope Pro 2 Evo on Flow.
Or Superstar Switch on Flow.

The XM819s are heavy.

Mavic 819 UST Rims (each) = 450 grams

Stans flow rims (each) = 470 grams (black) or 510 grams (white)

819's are not the lightest rims agreed, but they are durable and lighter than Stans rims...

I've had them on my Ibis Mojo HD for a year (winter wheels) and I weigh 18ish stone.... Never had an issue and I land sideways all the time... :0)

Evidence

http://www.mavic.com/en/product/rims/mo ... M-819-Disc

http://www.notubes.com/Flow-Rims-C22.aspx

IBISMojoHDamon

Northwind wrote:

Neither- you can go tubeless with most normal tyres too. Or you can use tubeless ready or UST.

Not strictly true.... In theory yes you can, in reality...Hmmm It's a different story... The non UST Swalbe tires won't work (too baggy) and the Continental X-King non UST, leaks air with 4 caps of stans sealant in.

Sure the TPI matters as a 60/65 TPI tire will leak air and may last a few hours, but I'll have money on the fact that they will flat in the morning... trust me, I've lived that issue...

Northwind

IBISMojoHDamon wrote:

819's are not the lightest rims agreed, but they are durable and lighter than Stans rims...

Mavics claimed weights don't include the nipple inserts- and you can't build the wheel without them. Very dishonest tbh, the actual weight is 507g ready to build so a fair bit heavier than Flows. As well as narrower and less strong. Stans don't make a single rim as heavy as an 819, and the nearest competitor- the Arch Ex- is just 395g!

IBISMojoHDamon wrote:

Not strictly true.... In theory yes you can, in reality...Hmmm It's a different story... The non UST Swalbe tires won't work (too baggy)

Not my experience at all.All Schwalbe's current Evo range are tubeless ready- the only problem you find with those is that sometimes they're actually too tight. (I've never had one that wouldn't fit with a track pump and a little effort but others have had issues getting them to bead up). And I've had older Nics and Ralphs from before they were rated tubeless-ready, fitted no problem at all and sealed better than most.

Conti don't seal well but that doesn't mean they don't work... My Barons go down over the course of a few days (with a cup and a half of sealant) which is slightly irritating but they work so well once reinflated that I'll forgive them. My Rubber Queens took ages to seal well but did eventually, they did need a couple of wee internal smears of rubber solution over persistent holes though.

By avoiding Panaracer, I've only ever had a single tyre that wouldn't go tubeless - a wire bead Nevegal. But it was pants anyway

cat_with_no_tail

Northwind wrote:

IBISMojoHDamon wrote:

Not strictly true.... In theory yes you can, in reality...Hmmm It's a different story... The non UST Swalbe tires won't work (too baggy)

Not my experience at all.All Schwalbe's current Evo range are tubeless ready- the only problem you find with those is that sometimes they're actually too tight. (I've never had one that wouldn't fit with a track pump and a little effort but others have had issues getting them to bead up).

Also my experience. Had a couple of sets of the TLR Nicks on the old Edison on Flow rims. from the regular ones to the snakeskin, DD, HDguard guff. All of them have seated fine but were an absolute baaaastard to get on. And the SS DD HD ones would only seal with a compressor / Co2 pump.

I had 1 that was too baggy, but that was my fault because I'd over-inflated to get it sealed, then forgot about it and left it overnight and it blew off the rim and stretched the bead.

Strippy

Northwind wrote:

Mavics claimed weights don't include the nipple inserts- and you can't build the wheel without them. Very dishonest tbh, the actual weight is 507g ready to build so a fair bit heavier than Flows. As well as narrower and less strong. Stans don't make a single rim as heavy as an 819, and the nearest competitor- the Arch Ex- is just 395g!

Wll that's true, but to run them tubeless you need rim strip. Standard id 56g while Olympic is 36g. To quote NoTubes.com:

The Standard rim strip is thicker and creates the best seal (weight about 56g), while the Olympic rim strip is a little bit thinner, but doesn't create as tight of a seal (weight about 38g).

So for black (lighter) flow it's 526g or 508g and as they say have not as tight seal. On Mavics it's 510g and have as good as it gets seal since there is no fiddling with any kind of rim strip.

njee20

DT240s on your choice of Stan's rim - perhaps an Arch EX from Actionsports.

Not strictly true.... In theory yes you can, in reality...Hmmm It's a different story... The non UST Swalbe tires won't work (too baggy)

I also disagree with that - I prefer the older non-tubeless ready Schwalbes as they go on more easily. I've got at least 5 sets and all go onto (and inflate on) my Podiums and Alpines with no issues.

toasty

Wll that's true, but to run them tubeless you need rim strip. Standard id 56g while Olympic is 36g. To quote NoTubes.com:

That's rubbish too, you don't "need" a rim strip. Some yellow tape has done me fine for about 3 years now, on 2 sets of wheels (Flows and old 355s). Actually using a few sets of Schwalbe, the older ones with the solid white text, and a newer set, both zero issues. Also had some Specialized Tubeless Ready and a set of standard Ardents on them.

So for black (lighter) flow it's 526g or 508g and as they say have not as tight seal. On Mavics it's 510g and have as good as it gets seal since there is no fiddling with any kind of rim strip.

Are you really comparing a set of 19mm internal rims to a set of 22.6mm internal Flows? Totally different rims. No sealing issues with my Flows either.

njee20

I find Stan's rims (with yellow tape, I've used the rim strips but they add nothing) less faff than Mavics unless you use (heavy) UST tyres.

Edited to make sense! :?

Levi_501

Definitley go for Hope hubs then just choose your rim, I went for Mavic EX721 with SP spokes.

One of the great things about Hope front hubs is that you can change the axle size via end caps.

toasty

You can with most of the hubs suggested, a lot of DT hubs, most Superstar hubs etc. That said, I do like the Hope Decent price for the Stans options too.

Levi_501

Toasty wrote:

You can with most of the hubs suggested, a lot of DT hubs, most Superstar hubs etc

Noted

Northwind

Strippy wrote:

Wll that's true, but to run them tubeless you need rim strip. Standard id 56g while Olympic is 36g.

Absolutely wrong, Stans rims are designed to work without strips- with just the yellow tape and valve (which combined weigh a hair less than my Mavic valves and no tape). I have both Flows and 819s and the strength of the seal and the ease of fitting tyres is identical.

You've quoted out of context a section from the Stans website which describes their rim strips, but nowhere does it say they're required. Because they aren't.

Incidentally, since this thread was last active, Stans have launched the Flow Ex- an outright downhill rim. People (inc me) used Flows for downhill previously but they were always a bit marginal. Reason this is relevant to the thread? Because this rim is still lighter than Mavic's XC tubeless rim.