2013 Shimano SLX

bails87

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/s ... iled-33285
It looks good!

Shadow Plus mechs, with the clutch to keep the chain under control, look good. Not sure about the direct mount rear mech though. Will this mean the mech breaks rather than the hanger?

After trying the new XT stuff on a demo bike last weekend I'll definitely by shifting (oh ho ho) over to Shimano in future.

ST also have some stuff about it.
http://singletrackworld.com/2012/03/shi ... 3-new-slx/

And they talk about the electric shifting for the Alfine hub gear. Interestingly they're making a flat bar lever for it.
http://singletrackworld.com/2012/03/shi ... mano-tech/

Seeing as an electronic XTR group was apparently spotted being tested on a pro's bike, it looks even more likely that it's on the way.

Thewaylander

Interesting,

but i honestly can't see electronic gears of any kind taking off in the mainstream. people like reliability but also really want items they can bodge fix on the fly if they snap something.

but the SLX looks good, have been an SRAm fan for a while on the rears, but shimano have been gettign there recently for me.

bails87

I'm not sure what's likely to be snapped that could be repairable on a 'manual' shifting system that couldn't on an electronic one. Break a lever or a mech and you're buggered either way. Snap a cable? There's no tension in the electronic wires, so the'y're no more likely to break than a hydraulic hose (probably less so), but we all happily use those rather than the easily repairable cable brakes.

I agree thaty only time will tell as to whether it's reliable, but plenty of roadies use Di2 and there's the cheaper 'lower level' Ui2.

Still veeeery expensive though. A £1k difference between Ultegra and ultegra Di2.

njee20

but plenty of roadies use Di2 and there's the cheaper 'lower level' Ui2.

Di2 stands for Digital Integrated Intelligence, the D is nothing to do with Dura Ace, so it's Ultegra Di2 or UDi2, not Ui2. Sorry, annoys me that one.

+1 on your comment that the 'fixable in the wild' argument is daft when we all use hydraulic brakes.

bails87

njee20 wrote:

but plenty of roadies use Di2 and there's the cheaper 'lower level' Ui2.

Di2 stands for Digital Integrated Intelligence, the D is nothing to do with Dura Ace, so it's Ultegra Di2 or UDi2, not Ui2. Sorry, annoys me that one.

+1 on your comment that the 'fixable in the wild' argument is daft when we all use hydraulic brakes.

I've just seen lots of other people calling Ultegra Di2 "Ui2", I'm never going to buy it so my interest is limited to what I pick up in passing from other's comments. You know what I meant!

Thewaylander

Argh my reply didn't post nightmare!!

Uhm there is plenty of trail fixes for gears to get you home Bails seriously. broken cable one you should have a spare. 2 a mech is a simple design you can bodge a stick into it to get it central in the cassette for a usable gear(same applies to the front). you can also get it running in a fixed gear with a single jockey wheel. most things can easily be bodged to get you home on a cable gear system.

Also i can't see an electronic system ever weighing less than a cable set up, batteries are heavy

bails87

Thewaylander wrote:

Argh my reply didn't post nightmare!!

Uhm there is plenty of trail fixes for gears to get you home Bails seriously. broken cable one you should have a spare. 2 a mech is a simple design you can bodge a stick into it to get it central in the cassette for a usable gear(same applies to the front). you can also get it running in a fixed gear with a single jockey wheel. most things can easily be bodged to get you home on a cable gear system.

Also i can't see an electronic system ever weighing less than a cable set up, batteries are heavy

Sorry, are you comparing a derailleur system to the electronic Alfine hub gear? I agree that a hub gear is more difficult to fix on the trail, but I was talking about an electronic derailleur system like Di2:

All those fixes can still be used on Di2, except for the cable, but then there's no need to replace the cable because it's so unlikely to break in the first place!

Thewaylander

Ooo so is the sifting taking place at the derailer, or shifter and going through a cable?

oodboo

I don't care about all this electronic shifting malarky. I just want a set of drop bar hydro levers for the alfine hub. Then it'll be upgrade time for the commuter.

Just recently upgraded my mountain bike to 2012 XT, only had a quick ride in the street so far but glad I made the move from the SRAM the bike came with. First thing I noticed was how much stiffer the XT cranks are compared to the deore m440 (or whatever they were) that they replaced. That's one thing I didn't expect to notice. No doubt next week they'll come out with the XT+ rear mech making me want to spend more money. Grrr.

bails87

Sorry, linking to the Alfine Di2 was probably confusing!

You press the shift button, which sends a signal to the mech, which contains a motor, which moves the mech up or down a cog.

"A solution to a problem that doesn't exist." "Unnecessary." "A marketing gimmick." Those are lines offered time and again by armchair critics of Shimano's new Dura-Ace Di2 electronic drivetrain, yet few of those pundits have spent any time on the stuff. After our initial sampling last summer in Japan and now two solid months of near-continuous use on a proper test group, we can confidently say that shifting-by-wire doesn't just work; it's flat-out awesome.

Shifting performance that's second to none
Di2's most obvious benefit is its remarkably smooth and precise shifting action, even compared to the most ideally adjusted and tuned mechanical setup from Shimano or any other component manufacturer – yes, even Campagnolo. It hits its target each time, every time, and nails each gear without fail in virtually any condition. If there's such a thing as a tireless 'shift robot', this is it.

Tap the rear upshift button and you're rewarded with that telltale 'ka-chunk' of a perfectly executed change. Go a step in the other direction and the transition is so seamless as to be virtually imperceptible save for the feeling in your legs of an easier ratio. In fact, it's almost too smooth.

Shift action is astounding up front, particularly when used in combination with Shimano's ultra-stiff Dura-Ace chainrings. The Di2 front derailleur faithfully moves the chain onto the big ring – or down to the inner cog – even when mashing the pedals in a low-cadence grind with an uncanny silkiness we've experienced with no other system. Think about how well one-tooth shifts work out back, translate that up front and you've pretty much got the idea.

Even better, however, is that Di2's performance is unflappably repeatable and doesn't degrade over time. Commands issued by the levers are always received and translated exactly as intended at the other end with no 'telephone effect' that can plague cable-actuated systems as a result of cable wear, housing compression or system contamination. Barring things such as a bent hanger, what you get on day one is seemingly what you get every day afterwards

Weight-wise, there's only a modest penalty to be paid. In comparison to 7900, Di2 only adds about 50g by our measurements – right in line with Shimano's claims.

http://www.bikeradar.com/road/gear/cate ... 0&ns_fee=0

Thewaylander

Then bails the jam the stick is unlikely to work, the motor will most like be a stepper motor, and will in all likely hood when broken sit at top or bottom and be difficult to move. plus your adding in a good few electricity issues on a mtb. Nah not convinced by that in the slightest.

leave me with my bits of wire hehe

bails87

It is a stepper motor (whatever that is!), but when a normal mech has no cable it sits at the top or bottom too.
Anyway, I'm not going to be buying it, too expensive!

BTW, don't use a stick, just adjust the 'stop' screws! Di2 has no stop screws, so you may have a point there, but as alreayd said, we all happily use hydro brakes that are unrepairable outside a workshop, unless you take barbs, hose and a bleeding kit on the trail with you.

lawman

it all looks very promising, not so sure on electronic stuff, massively expensive and considering I use 1 x 10 on both bikes, i see no real point in it tbh. the likes of shadow+ however is a different story, an xt level mech would be great, so ever so tempted to stick with a double and use an xtr+ mech before i went 1 x 10. its a great idea, so simple and will be commonplace in the next few years, as I see no reason why you would chose a standard mech, unless you are seriously anal over an extra 20-30g...

Thewaylander

bails87 wrote:

It is a stepper motor (whatever that is!), but when a normal mech has no cable it sits at the top or bottom too.
Anyway, I'm not going to be buying it, too expensive!

BTW, don't use a stick, just adjust the 'stop' screws! Di2 has no stop screws, so you may have a point there, but as alreayd said, we all happily use hydro brakes that are unrepairable outside a workshop, unless you take barbs, hose and a bleeding kit on the trail with you.

moving a mech against a spring ncie and easy, moving a stepper motor dependng on the set can be really really awkward mate potentially you could cause some dmg

bails87

Thewaylander wrote:

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a stepper motor dependng on the set can be really really awkward mate potentially you could cause some dmg

Ah well, it's not like it'll cost much to repla......oh!

lawman: Yeh, I've got all my 1x10 stuff ready to go on the 456, but I'm tempted to sell the xt mech and get a slx+ one instead, then lose the chain guide.

bluechair84

Happy days on the 1x10 Torque. However, I have a spare SLX rear mech that I should use before upgrading but I haven't wrecked a rear mech in years, not likely to happen any time soon (I'd happily jinx myself to give me a reason to upgrade to the clutch...).
For this reason, I'm thinking that the bolt on rear mech that removes the hanger is because shadow has been successful in reducing crash damage. If shadow design is effective enough that screwed hangers rarely happens, then maybe there is a reason to get rid of them. I'd certainly not be opposed.

lawman

yep, I'll prbably try a xt+ mech later in the year, drop the the LG1 down to an XCX perhaps, although I like the taco for rock strikes, saved my bacon a few times already! Shimano really seem to be stepping up their game, their new kit is by far and away their best in my time of riding, and they are miles a head of sram, truvativ and avid in overall terms across the board, if I were sram I'd be very, very worried, as I can see more and more people making the switch

cat_with_no_tail

Hmmmmm, May eh? Is this when the 2013 XT stuff will be landing too? I was all set to buy a 2012 XT group with a 2012 XTR mech, but if the 2013 stuff is due around the same time, I'll just wait for that. Wont be back on the MTB Until late june anyways.

FWIW, I'm one of the people switching back from SRAM (something I previously swore I'd never do).

cooldad

Cat With No Tail wrote:

FWIW, I'm one of the people switching back from SRAM (something I previously swore I'd never do).

Obviously that fall, whilst painful, has fixed the short circuit in your head.