Hubs for wheel build – 105 or Ultegra?

jomoj

Hi, I’m getting parts together for a pair of 32 spoke wheels to be built using some DT RR465 rims. Just wondering whether the extra for Ultegra hubs over 105 is worth it, mainly concerned with the quality of the freehub as I expect the bearings are much of a muchness.

I have one pair of wheels on Tiagra hubs and another on some older Dura Ace and the freehub & bearing quality is markedly different – not surprisingly – but I’d like to know if the 105 is closer to Ultegra or Tiagra, if you get what I mean.
105 hubs can be found for about £50 a pair, Ultegra for £95 so what does the extra £45 buy you? If its mainly cosmetic then I’m not too fussed.

Anyone with experience of either / both?

pitchshifter

I run 105's with Open Pro's. Lovely wheels.

Ultegra will be lighter. Probably the only noticable difference.

ugo.santalucia

All Shimano hubs run ball/cone bearings, which are very smooth if set up properly and a nightmare if not... they can be cleaned, serviced, the balls changed for peanuts (also because they get pitted rather quickly) etc etc... however, these days I prefer hubs with sealed bearings for road use... mechanically inferior, they take less load... blah blah... but you can get a pair of Novatec/Ambrosio for well under £ 100 and they'll be your friends for a long time, without being particularly needy.

If you want to stay on Shimano, buy the best you can afford, low end Shimano hubs are cack...

rake

jomoj wrote:

Hi, I’m getting parts together for a pair of 32 spoke wheels to be built using some DT RR465 rims. Just wondering whether the extra for Ultegra hubs over 105 is worth it, mainly concerned with the quality of the freehub as I expect the bearings are much of a muchness.

I have one pair of wheels on Tiagra hubs and another on some older Dura Ace and the freehub & bearing quality is markedly different – not surprisingly – but I’d like to know if the 105 is closer to Ultegra or Tiagra, if you get what I mean.
105 hubs can be found for about £50 a pair, Ultegra for £95 so what does the extra £45 buy you? If its mainly cosmetic then I’m not too fussed.

Anyone with experience of either / both?

i recently built the same vwith 105 hubs. im very pleased. given the price differecnce you can buy another hub in a few years if need be. fronts never really give any bother. for about £160 they take some beating. hub weight doesnt add much inertia near the axle. i built mine with cross 2 and cross 3 right rear dt competition with 12mm brass nipples. lovely set. i can give you the spoke lengths if need be. they should be nice and straight rims. i used linseed oil on the threads, should lock them on mildly with a few days drying.

gwillis

I've just build up a set of open pro,s on 105 hubs with dt Swiss spokes with help from local bike shop and forum members
especially mr ugo.santalucia . Mine weigh 1830g which I think is great the hubs seem to roll fine but my lbs suggests watching the grease in the hubs as they often come out under lubricated. Must say I'm just about to source bits which will include dt465 as they come highly recommended by other far more experienced builders.

rake

jesus. how many sets of wheels do you need willis.

jomoj

hi all, thanks for the replies

ugo - yes, I've looked at the Ambrosio Zenith / Novatech hubs and considered them as an option. Read mixed reviews about the sealing and robustness of the freehub, I take it you've had no problems?

thanks for feedback on the 105 hubs, if you're looking for DT rims then Planet-X have the RR465 in 32h, black and silver for 30 quid each, Fatbirds have the 28h white for 24 quid - it's actually the R1.1 double but is the same rim, different sticker

decisions...

gwillis

rake wrote:

jesus. how many sets of wheels do you need willis.

Crickey it's like having a wife only in forum form.

The open pros are going on a winter / training bike , the other set are going on a genesis croix de fer so will have discs on them.

rake

oh. happy building.
i might look inside my hubs for grease, they seemed a little catchy at first. would they be adjusted too tight with not much grease then?
buy them. they are great hubs.

gwillis

rake wrote:

oh. happy building.
i might look inside my hubs for grease, they seemed a little catchy at first. would they be adjusted too tight with not much grease then?
buy them. they are great hubs.

I'm sorry rake I wouldn't know given how little I know about wheel building and hubs although I've been riding a number of years But I'm a total novice when it comes to wheel building but have been told that from the factory they are often under lubed or very dry not out as in loose. Or maybe are you talking tounge cheek?

rake

ive heard people say they are usually slightly overtightened as supplied. made me feel a lot better.
cant find my cone spanners so i havent looked into it yet.

gwillis

I'm the whole wheel building thing really interesting I'm sure my first set are way under what others build but it's something to get my teeth into. Just been given a jig to use and some old rims to practice as the mavic were done under 'supervision' .what weight did your come out at Rake?

rake

i havent got any scales. but advertised weights seem to be around 17 0r 18 kg. mostly hub weight i think with steel axles and freehub. they feel sturdy and accelertate well. i cant notice any more drag from 32 spokes instead of 20/24.
just have a few go's at it, its not the art people make out. just need to know the tricks like which spokes to turn and stress relieving the wheel.

keef66

"i havent got any scales. but advertised weights seem to be around 17 0r 18 kg."

I think I'll stick with the factory wheels if that's what handbuilts weigh :shock:

rake

i missed the dedimal point sorry.
dt comp 64 spokes =382g according to dt swiss.
dt 465= 465g according to dt swiss
dt brass nipples= 64g for 64 pieces aqccording to dt swiss.
105 5700 rear hub= 417g ? with sqewer
105 front=207g ? with qr
so 382+465+465+64+417+207=2kg without tape. a bit more than i thought. dont know if those hub weights are accurate. thats with qr though so probably about 1850g the set without. could have saved 100g with fancy spokes and a few with alu nips. i think the eyelets are 50g per rim over the non version but wont be as durable.

ugo.santalucia

rake wrote:

dt comp 64 spokes =382g according to dt swiss.
dt 465= 465g according to dt swiss
dt brass nipples= 64g for 64 pieces aqccording to dt swiss.
105 5700 rear hub= 417g ? with sqewer
105 front=207g ? with qr
so 382+465+465+64+417+207=2kg without tape. a bit more than i thought. dont know if those hub weights are accurate.

Are you mad? Quoting weight of weels including QR? that's a NO NO NO... you have to strip them of any non essential before putting them on the virtual scale

rake

my mistake sorry. i can ride them at that weight.

Alex99

ugo.santalucia wrote:

All Shimano hubs run ball/cone bearings, which are very smooth if set up properly and a nightmare if not... they can be cleaned, serviced, the balls changed for peanuts (also because they get pitted rather quickly) etc etc... however, these days I prefer hubs with sealed bearings for road use... mechanically inferior, they take less load... blah blah... but you can get a pair of Novatec/Ambrosio for well under £ 100 and they'll be your friends for a long time, without being particularly needy.

If you want to stay on Shimano, buy the best you can afford, low end Shimano hubs are cack...

I wouldn't change the balls for peanuts. Crazy idea

MisterMuncher

6800 hubs are great. I've been using a set laced to H Plus Son TB14 for a couple of years, in all weathers, and they spin as well as the day they were built. The tool-free adjustment is a nice feature on paper, but in real life, being able to adjust with minimal concern to opening the races or what QR pressure does is great. 5800 hubs don't have that, but neither did the previous Ultegra or DA.

cycleclinic

Use the 6800 hjbs and check for pay as often as yoj remeber, if you ever see it remove it that will save the cones and cups. Open up the hubs every 5000 miles or once a year throw away the old bearings (they are cheap and not worth saving) and reassemble with a good persistant bearing grease. I like rock n roll Super web for this but there are other apparantly.

Do this maintance and 6800 hubs will last a very long time indeeded.