Garmin v Mobile Phone v usefulness

samsbike

Again following on from my post regarding the components - does the Garmin thingy give you more than a smart phone, if so what.

I guess battery life, cadence and the heart rate monitor bit would be the ones I would expect.

Also what you do find the garmin/ cateye etc useful for.

thanks

sam

sagalout

One of the most useful features of a Garmin, is that if you end up stranded for whatever reason, your phone will still work because you havent just drained all its battery running a GPS app

Seriously though, you've already identified the main reasons, and battery life really is excellent on the Garmins. I get at least 15 hours on my old 705. Its also a useful head unit for a power device

velvetytoast

I moved from a mobile to a 705 about a year ago. I like the virtual partner, setting up a training schedule and downloading (beeps for change and tells you what you should be doing) and the routes thing (can't remember what it's called) where you get a turn by turn info. I'm not sure how the sites / smartphone thing has improved over the last year or so but for me the gar in wins hands down.

mrbrightside

I've just started using endomondo and really rate it, i'm using it for running also. I've removed the computer from my bike on the basis that i can go now ride on perceived effort (base miles/weight loss) and you get a audio mileage and pace for the mile plus total trip time update every mile.

App £0 v's Garmin £100/200/300

godders1

I only have the Garmin Edge 200 so definitely a case of convenience for me, I imagine there's an iphone app that does everything the 200 does.

But I don't particularly want my £500 phone exposed to the elements and I don't think it looks great mounted on the bike anyway. And there's the battery issue someone mentioned above, I like to be able to use my phone for the rest of the day to actually like, you know, make phone calls and stuff!

Gizmodo

I got the Garmin Edge 800 because it has the full maps and sat nav functions.

From what I can find there are 2 types of sat nav apps on mobile phones:
1. Like Google tracks or Endomondo will simply record where you've been so you can plot your route after a ride
2. Full sat nav apps that will direct you via the shortest route from point A to point B.

What I can't find is a mobile phone app that will do what the Garmin will do, that is follow a pre-determined route. So point A is my house, point B is my house and I want to plot and then follow a 40 mile route between them. I use http://ridewithgps.com/ to plot the route I want to follow and then upload it to my Garmin. The Garmin gives me turn by turn directions.

Try that on a smart phone sat nav app and it just tells me the shortest route from point A to point B is to go back in the house!

Trickyh

Gizmodo wrote:

What I can't find is a mobile phone app that will do what the Garmin will do, that is follow a pre-determined route. So point A is my house, point B is my house and I want to plot and then follow a 40 mile route between them. I use http://ridewithgps.com/ to plot the route I want to follow and then upload it to my Garmin. The Garmin gives me turn by turn directions.

Try that on a smart phone sat nav app and it just tells me the shortest route from point A to point B is to go back in the house!

I've been playing with android apps for a month or so now... basically I want to do the same as you Giz... thats download or plot a new route/loop and follow it when riding... After a bit of fiddling Google Maps seems to be working really well (?!?) Unfortunately its KML based but that's only a problem when downloading other peoples routes. A GPX to KML fixes that easily though.

Plotting Routes

Use Google map (My places) to plot routes. Make a simple A to B and then grab the endpoints. If Google ovverrides and plots the shortest route then just grab the route in the middle and move it to where you want it to be. Save and name the route under my places.

Precache the route

On your phone, go to Labs and enable Precaching. Precache your areas in 10km chunks to save bandwidth when out and about or bad signal areas

See and follow route

On layers select My Maps and select your route. Zoom in to a comfortable zoom level (i use 1km) and press the compass symbol twice. The route will now follow. rotate and center on your route automatically. You will also have to wind up your screen timeout setting to max to stop it switching off.

I use a cheap Huwaei Blaze (£59.00) sim free from phones4u cos its cheap and i dont care too much if it gets broken

As stated by everyone else, battery life is the killer. I'm going to try out a 2200mAh Powermonkey to supplement my phone battery (£24 from Amazon) which is giving approx 2hrs from full :!:

After all that its prob far easier to buy a Garmin... But then i'm a tightwad


Rich

fossyant

I've used both - used GPS tracking on the MTB via my phone once or twice and also have an Edge 705. no contest, the Edge is very robust and can stay on your bars in monsoons - a phone can't. I used the phone in my rucksack, and it hammers battery life - two hours on GPS. The Edge will last all day.

TBH if worried about cost, just get a standard computer (wireless) and be done. The new Edge 200 is a cracker though.

deadhead1971

Locus Pro is a great android app which can do virtually anything you're likely to need.
I moved to a Garmin because of the robustness of the unit. My Samsung galaxy s2 doesn't look very waterproof, I'm sure the screen would crack if I dropped it from a height, and if the screen remains on for any length of time, the battery drains quicker than my legs up Peniel Hill ("road to hell" in that greatest climbs book).
Check my blog for a few posts about android apps for cycling, and a few tutorials about mapping options on the garmin edge 800. Www.scarletfire.co.uk

jimm1909

deadhead1971 wrote:

Locus Pro is a great android app which can do virtually anything you're likely to need.
I moved to a Garmin because of the robustness of the unit. My Samsung galaxy s2 doesn't look very waterproof, I'm sure the screen would crack if I dropped it from a height, and if the screen remains on for any length of time, the battery drains quicker than my legs up Peniel Hill ("road to hell" in that greatest climbs book).
Check my blog for a few posts about android apps for cycling, and a few tutorials about mapping options on the garmin edge 800. http://Www.scarletfire.co.uk

Wow Locus Pro is nice. I wonder if it will integrate with my Voip Phones and Mobile Phone. It would also be nice if it integrated with my Business Mobile Phones.

Also- thanks for the tutorials!

-Jim

velocanman

Great summary of features and recommendations here! I just use good old distance, rate, and time. I save the smartphone for map checks, emergency calls, or the infrequent recording of tracks. Guess I need to get with the times...

itsnotarace

samsbike wrote:

does the Garmin thingy give you more than a smart phone, if so what.

1. A degree of weatherproofing
2. The ability to operate it wearing gloves
3. Battery life
4. Accuracy when using the wheel magnet
5. Turn by turn directions
6. The ability to re-route on the fly
7. Mapping when no mobile signal is available
8. Lots more post ride data

Trickyh

Just to add

1. Buy a weatherproof handlebarmount from ebay
2. True, but thats just a winter thing
3. True, alternatively get a powermonkey or a bigger phone battery
4. Not sure which is more accurate but the phone GPS is more accurate than my cycle computer
5. The overhead is far more clear than turn by turn (imho)
6. True. but then you can just plug in ''get directions'' and it will plot your new route
7. Rubbish, Precache the required areas and you do not require a moby signal
8. Use Strava/My Tracks for lots of pr data

9. Cost... its loads more cheaper than a dedicated unit and its good to try out if you like all the benefits of technology.. Some do and a lot don't... i'm using it to learn new routes, then back to the regular bike comp

deadhead1971

jimm1909 wrote:

deadhead1971 wrote:

Check my blog for a few posts about android apps for cycling, and a few tutorials about mapping options on the garmin edge 800. http://Www.scarletfire.co.uk

Wow Locus Pro is nice. Also- thanks for the tutorials!

-Jim

Thanks Jim, it's great when people leave positive comments, so thank you.
Locus Pro is a great app, and it's what I use if I'm just out and about on a family walk or whatever. For bike use, only the garmin will do!

Schobiedoo

Garmin are the VW Golf of gps units... You know the advert, "but it sounds just like a golf".

Now you may not like VW Golfs, think they're overpriced and can get better performance from a Fiat. But they're still the car that others are compared with.

IMO it's better to review each solution on its merits and working out whether it's right for you rather than checking whether a Garmin can or can't do it, otherwise you get caught up in the endless analysis of which difference you can or can't handle.

Trickyh

Schobiedoo wrote:

Garmin are the VW Golf of gps units... You know the advert, "but it sounds just like a golf".

Now you may not like VW Golfs, think they're overpriced and can get better performance from a Fiat. But they're still the car that others are compared with.

IMO it's better to review each solution on its merits and working out whether it's right for you rather than checking whether a Garmin can or can't do it, otherwise you get caught up in the endless analysis of which difference you can or can't handle.

Definitely, i am not slating Garmin or other dedicated units... I'd prob get one myself if they weren't so expensive... I've got other bling to spend my squids on 1st, and my foray into Android apps was to see what could be done with the tech that i've already got in my pocket 8)

The biggest drawback is battery life and useability... i'm also finding too much tech is distracting and getting away from me just being out and enjoying a ride on my bike

cryocon

I used to use my Android smartphone with some great apps and excellent mapping. All worked really well apart from the dreaded battery life. Now use a Bryton Rider 50, which is great apart from the maps suck.

I was recently looking at a SE Xperia Active phone. Waterproof/Dustproof and with built in ANT+. A neat little handle bar mount coming from the SportyPal people too. From what i've read it could squeeze a bit longer battery life due to the smaller screen, but it'll still never beat a dedicated unit.

http://www.sonyericsson.com/cws/product ... c=gb&lc=en

gloomyandy

I started off using my Android phone to track my rides, but have recently switched to a Garmin Edge 500 (which I got with HR monitor and Cadence sensor + 2 bike mounts for £174 from Halfords). Things I like about the Garmin...
1. It works my phone had this nasty habit of losing the GPS signal halfway round a route.
2. Battery life
3. It acts as a cycle computer rather than being in my pocket
4. I love having the HR and Cadence data available, adds a new dimension to training
5. It is really easy to use, just turn it on and go, no fiddling running a particular app and making sure the app stays running.
6. My phone now stays safe and dry (and turned off a lot of the time).
7. Very simple to upload the data.
8. More accurate elevation data due to the barometric sensor.
9. Easy to move between bikes, thanks to the two mounts, that it came with.
10. I don't really seem to ever need to charge it. The time it spends hooked up to my computer seems to be enough to keep topping it up.

I'm sure if my phone had worked better with the various apps I would have continued to use that for longer. But I really do like having the hr and cadence data available and being able to check all of that along with speed etc. while out on the bike is pretty good, I'm not sure I would ever have been comfortable with my phone mounted on the bike...

Andy

jamienorton

Gizmodo wrote:

I got the Garmin Edge 800 because it has the full maps and sat nav functions.

From what I can find there are 2 types of sat nav apps on mobile phones:
1. Like Google tracks or Endomondo will simply record where you've been so you can plot your route after a ride
2. Full sat nav apps that will direct you via the shortest route from point A to point B.

What I can't find is a mobile phone app that will do what the Garmin will do, that is follow a pre-determined route. So point A is my house, point B is my house and I want to plot and then follow a 40 mile route between them. I use http://ridewithgps.com/ to plot the route I want to follow and then upload it to my Garmin. The Garmin gives me turn by turn directions.

Try that on a smart phone sat nav app and it just tells me the shortest route from point A to point B is to go back in the house!

I had the same problem, wanting to follow gpx tracks from bikely ect. After abit of browsing i found Osmand for android, not sure if theres an iphone version. Lets me follow gpx routes, can also use offline maps so it doesnt use much data ect, turn by turn navigation. It also plots routes automatically for you if you like, not really used that option yet though, pretty sure it avoids motorways. Doesn't have the cycle computer funtions though, other than speed. Guess you could run endomondo/strada in the background. I had it running for about 2 hours yesterday and didnt notice much of a drop in battery life. Seems good.

pipipi

I have an iPhone 3GS in my back pocket.I previously ran run keeper but have been using Strava for the last month or so ( and I much prefer Strava to see how I'm getting on at particular hills etc).

Battery life is a problem if it's more than 3 hours but I've just got myself a 5600 battery that I'm going to use whilst I'm out on a long ride.

The iPhone has been great at showing me where I am when I get unsure about which junction to take.

If I could rewind time and buy a cheap phone and then a garmin then I probably would. But maybe not the £300+ version! But I have a smartphone and I want to make it work as well as possible. I'd like to get a heart rate monitor for the iPhone but that's another story.

TrickyGB

Is it possible on the edge 500 to plot a route using the PC and download to the edge 500 and follow turn by turn directions?

Is this easy to do or time consuming? Garmins and similar products interest me as I want to try out new routes but am a little worried about getting lost, having this functionality would ease my concerns, however, the only one I'm 100% sure offers this is the Edge 800 which is well out of my budget range

Gizmodo

Yes it can be done, should be easy, draw the route using a web site like [url]Http://ridewithgps.com[/url] and save the file to the Garmin - instructions are included on the web site under Export. For what it looks like on the unit see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAEM26w0bgg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

TrickyGB

@gizmodo - thanks for the info. It's not a super clear map like the 800 but would certainly be enough to not get lost and see which direction I'd need to turn. Do you know if you can customise the screen to show current speed as well as this course function?

Gizmodo

TrickyGB wrote:

@gizmodo - thanks for the info. It's not a super clear map like the 800 but would certainly be enough to not get lost and see which direction I'd need to turn. Do you know if you can customise the screen to show current speed as well as this course function?

Sorry I don't know, I have he Garmin 800 :oops:

TrickyGB

Very nice, they look brilliant but I don't do enough riding to warrant the expense, I may convince myself to one of the cheaper models though. If I lived in southport or London a 605 could be had very cheap which would suit my needs I think!

Bozman

Cyclemeter on my Iphone does me for now, a great app to run with my cateye which gives me my marker, battery life is not an issue, 4hrs today and 76% left on the iphone 4.
Personally i can't justify £400 at the moment, but if i had the money lying around i would buy a garmin 800, it'd probably be a waste of money but... why not, then again i feel that the money would be better spent elsewhere.

TrickyGB

I've used cyclometer too but as soon as I get away from the city and out into the sticks I lose coverage and it is almost useless. Clocked a 74mph average over 13 miles the other week as so much of the course had no coverage. It is good to keep a map on for a back up though just in case

Bozman

TrickyGB wrote:

I've used cyclometer too but as soon as I get away from the city and out into the sticks I lose coverage and it is almost useless. Clocked a 74mph average over 13 miles the other week as so much of the course had no coverage. It is good to keep a map on for a back up though just in case

I've never had that problem with cyclemeter, I live in the sticks and spend most of my time cycling in the sticks, my mates use it too and we share ride info, we've yet to have a failure. A top app for a few quid.

DylanM

Bozman wrote:

Cyclemeter on my Iphone does me for now, a great app to run with my cateye which gives me my marker, battery life is not an issue, 4hrs today and 76% left on the iphone 4.
Personally i can't justify £400 at the moment, but if i had the money lying around i would buy a garmin 800, it'd probably be a waste of money but... why not, then again i feel that the money would be better spent elsewhere.

Can you use Cyclemeter to follow a pre-loaded map? What I mean by this is one of the online routes you can download for a gps device. I wondered if there was a way of loading them onto the iPhone to follow on Cyclemeter.

Bozman

DylanM wrote:

Bozman wrote:

Cyclemeter on my Iphone does me for now, a great app to run with my cateye which gives me my marker, battery life is not an issue, 4hrs today and 76% left on the iphone 4.
Personally i can't justify £400 at the moment, but if i had the money lying around i would buy a garmin 800, it'd probably be a waste of money but... why not, then again i feel that the money would be better spent elsewhere.

Can you use Cyclemeter to follow a pre-loaded map? What I mean by this is one of the online routes you can download for a gps device. I wondered if there was a way of loading them onto the iPhone to follow on Cyclemeter.

Sorry but i don't know the answer to that one, i probably just scrape the edges of its capability, alot of folk use it so i'm sure somebody out there will be able to answer your question.
I just start it and put it in my back pocket, i either have a set route or a rough idea of a route in my head, if i deviate from a route i just end up creating a new route and i never get lost for long, if i thought that i needed sat nav then garmin would be the way to go. This app stores all the routes and data i need and the cateye helps me maintain my speed if the mind wanders.

TrickyGB

DylanM wrote:

Bozman wrote:

Cyclemeter on my Iphone does me for now, a great app to run with my cateye which gives me my marker, battery life is not an issue, 4hrs today and 76% left on the iphone 4.
Personally i can't justify £400 at the moment, but if i had the money lying around i would buy a garmin 800, it'd probably be a waste of money but... why not, then again i feel that the money would be better spent elsewhere.

Can you use Cyclemeter to follow a pre-loaded map? What I mean by this is one of the online routes you can download for a gps device. I wondered if there was a way of loading them onto the iPhone to follow on Cyclemeter.

you can pre-load GPX files on to cyclemeter. I'm sure there are easy ways to do this but I couldn't really find one, so I opted to email myself a GPX file, I then opened the email on the iphone and you can choose to open the attachment in Cyclemeter - it then loads the map and details to the phone. This will only provide a route though and not turn by turn directions

When I create my own route i use 'http://www.gmap-pedometer.com/', I then open the following site (which I stored in my favourites)

javascript:(function(){var script=document.createElement('script');script.src='http://www.elsewhere.org/GMapToGPX/gmaptogpx.js';document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(script);})()

This switches everything into text format, you then copy the text into notepad and save the file with .gpx on the end. Bit of a long winded way of getting maps onto the phone but once you've got the hang of it it's dead easy