Breast implants: taxpayer problem

morstar

Why is it a government problem?
Surely the responsibility lies with the butchers that indulge these stupid women. They can then counter claim against the manufacturer at their leisure.
Unless the medical practice has ceased to exist, the government has no responsibility beyond kicking the butchers up the arse.
No?

redvee

Is this a situation that has gone tits-up ?

rick_chasey

morstar wrote:

Why is it a government problem?
Surely the responsibility lies with the butchers that indulge these stupid women. They can then counter claim against the manufacturer at their leisure.
Unless the medical practice has ceased to exist, the government has no responsibility beyond kicking the butchers up the ars*.
No?

If you have an NHS, then of course.

If it saves lives or improves health.

pst88

Deleted

verylonglegs

The company that made them has gone bust which is why the NHS may pick up the tab.

lostboysaint

verylonglegs wrote:

The company that made them has gone bust which is why the NHS may pick up the tab.

Not relevant unless the procedure was carried out by the NHS using those products.

ilm_zero7

morstar wrote:

Why is it a government problem?
Surely the responsibility lies with the butchers that indulge these stupid women. They can then counter claim against the manufacturer at their leisure.
Unless the medical practice has ceased to exist, the government has no responsibility beyond kicking the butchers up the ars*.
No?

agree - simple answer - the French government are paying for the removal, we are EU citizens so tell the UK women to go to France and demand the free operation - its about time the French got the rap for Euro-unity laws which have compromised the UK for so long.

In fact if I were Cameron I would fund a Eurostar ticket for each breast - outbound ticket left breast, return right breast

finchy

ILM Zero7 wrote:

In fact if I were Cameron I would fund a Eurostar ticket for each breast - outbound ticket left breast, return right breast

And if I were Cameron I'd demand to see each and every breast personally to make sure there is no fraud.

Can't be too careful, y'know.

rick_chasey

If you take the attitude that the NHS shouldn't have to deal with it, since, y'know, it's their fault and self inflicted, then there won't be much the NHS will do.

amaferanga

No different really to the NHS picking up the tab to treat all the other self-inflicted conditions such as obesity, some cancers, pissed up tossers with broken noses, etc.

lostboysaint

Rick Chasey wrote:

If you take the attitude that the NHS shouldn't have to deal with it, since, y'know, it's their fault and self inflicted, then there won't be much the NHS will do.

Yep. But the fact is that anyone that chooses to physically abuse their body directly, whether it be implants, smoking, obesity etc., should struggle to get NHS treatment. If you fall off your bike, slip off of a kerb, get a disease that ISN'T attributable to one of the above then you shouldn't.

It's called the NHS for a reason, but that reason seems to have been lost on most people who simply seem to view it as a "service centre" for when their body rebels against stuff that they know that they've been doing wrong for years! It tries hard to educate but has found an unwilling audience so perhaps nows the time to focus the minds of the audience/clientele and perhaps get a win/win out of it!

rick_chasey

lostboysaint wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

If you take the attitude that the NHS shouldn't have to deal with it, since, y'know, it's their fault and self inflicted, then there won't be much the NHS will do.

Yep. But the fact is that anyone that chooses to physically abuse their body directly, whether it be implants, smoking, obesity etc., should struggle to get NHS treatment. If you fall off your bike, slip off of a kerb, get a disease that ISN'T attributable to one of the above then you shouldn't.

It's called the NHS for a reason, but that reason seems to have been lost on most people who simply seem to view it as a "service centre" for when their body rebels against stuff that they know that they've been doing wrong for years! It tries hard to educate but has found an unwilling audience so perhaps nows the time to focus the minds of the audience/clientele and perhaps get a win/win out of it!

Breast implants are given on the NHS - as far as I understand mainly for women who have come out the other side of breast cancer to make them even or as they were.

And I totally disagree with the above...

We're heading into the 19th Century with chat like this.

martinwitnam

The majority of breast implants that have been done on the NHS are due to breast cancer, totally un-even breasts, etc.
So what is the difference between that and your broken collar bone, scaphoid fracture, etc?

pb21

If you get hit by a car you shouldn’t have been near a road in the first place, no NHS treatment for you, go and sue the car manufacture for treatment.

Pep

Sad but true... smoking, drinking, obesity, drug, ... they all give self inflicted problem then treated at taxpayer cost.
Should the NHS refuse treatement?

I had a sport injury for which I needed an operation. Without operation, I could have continued a normal life, but could no longer play sport. NHS told me they won't treat me because they are not there to "waste" money on sport.

Had I suffered from alcoholism or drugs or obesity or smoking instead of sport injury, they would have treated me, probably at much higher cost.

rick_chasey

Pep wrote:

Sad but true... smoking, drinking, obesity, drug, ... they all give self inflicted problem then treated at taxpayer cost.
Should the NHS refuse treatement?

I had a sport injury for which I needed an operation. Without operation, I could have continued a normal life, but could no longer play sport. NHS told me they won't treat me because they are not there to "waste" money on sport.

Had I suffered from alcoholism or drugs or obesity or smoking instead of sport injury, they would have treated me, probably at much higher cost.

If it was up to me they'd have treated you for your injury AND the alcoholism etc.

lostboysaint

Rick Chasey wrote:

lostboysaint wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

If you take the attitude that the NHS shouldn't have to deal with it, since, y'know, it's their fault and self inflicted, then there won't be much the NHS will do.

Yep. But the fact is that anyone that chooses to physically abuse their body directly, whether it be implants, smoking, obesity etc., should struggle to get NHS treatment. If you fall off your bike, slip off of a kerb, get a disease that ISN'T attributable to one of the above then you shouldn't.

It's called the NHS for a reason, but that reason seems to have been lost on most people who simply seem to view it as a "service centre" for when their body rebels against stuff that they know that they've been doing wrong for years! It tries hard to educate but has found an unwilling audience so perhaps nows the time to focus the minds of the audience/clientele and perhaps get a win/win out of it!

Breast implants are given on the NHS - as far as I understand mainly for women who have come out the other side of breast cancer to make them even or as they were.

And I totally disagree with the above...

We're heading into the 19th Century with chat like this.

If you're going to try and argue like a grown up then you need to look at the original post and remember that I suggested that the NHS should not be liable IF THEY HADN'T CARRIED OUT THE OPERATION AND USED THOSE PRODUCTS!

There's a very clear distinction between what I said and the situation that is under discussion.

My argument is that life is about risks and it's about managing those and taking the punishment/treatment if you fuck up.

Yours is that you can do what the fuck you like and someone else will pick up the bill regardless of the complete disregard you've have had for yourself and those around you.

Mmmmm, I know where I'll stay thanks.

rick_chasey

lostboysaint wrote:

Yours is that you can do what the fark you like and someone else will pick up the bill regardless of the complete disregard you've have had for yourself and those around you.

Mmmmm, I know where I'll stay thanks.

More or less.

We all pay tax. We all get the same rights.

What's the problem?

At least no-one gets left out.

rick_chasey

Money isn't the be all and end all.

Why potentially prevent someone from getting healthcare because you're a cheapskate and don't want to pay more tax?

pb21

What level of risk is acceptable for treatment on the NHS before its not acceptable?

Mr_Cellophane

As there is a small risk to health, the NHS should pay to remove them, but not replace them. If these women want fake tits, then they should pay.

GiantMike

Pep wrote:

I had a sport injury for which I needed an operation. Without operation, I could have continued a normal life, but could no longer play sport. NHS told me they won't treat me because they are not there to "waste" money on sport.

Sorry to pry, but are you willing to tell us the nature of the injury? Did they actually say it would be a 'waste' of money?

Ron Stuart

We should be treating the cause of why perfectly healthy young women are made to feel they need to have fake tits at a risk to their health both financially and physically.
It's some women’s heads that need upgrading not their chests.
Why like Americans are we as a nation so insecure about ourselves, is it the marketing turning us all into wanabes?
We should only be talking about genuine reconstructive surgery for good medical reasons and the NHS should be playing its part as it was formed to do.

pb21

Ron Stuart wrote:

We should be treating the cause of why perfectly healthy young women are made to feel they need to have fake tits at a risk to their health both financially and physically.
It's some women’s heads that need upgrading not their chests.
Why like Americans are we as a nation so insecure about ourselves, is it the marketing turning us all into wanabes?
We should only be talking about genuine reconstructive surgery for good medical reasons and the NHS should be playing its part as it was formed to do.

Women and men want to look attractive, always have done, always will.

I thinks it’s true that there is a lot of media pressure exploiting this fact though.

rick_chasey

pb21 wrote:

Ron Stuart wrote:

We should be treating the cause of why perfectly healthy young women are made to feel they need to have fake tits at a risk to their health both financially and physically.
It's some women’s heads that need upgrading not their chests.
Why like Americans are we as a nation so insecure about ourselves, is it the marketing turning us all into wanabes?
We should only be talking about genuine reconstructive surgery for good medical reasons and the NHS should be playing its part as it was formed to do.

Women and men want to look attractive, always have done, always will.

I thinks it’s true that there is a lot of media pressure exploiting this fact though.

The same paper who has topless models on page 3 I take it?

GiantMike

Assuming the implants present a risk to health (and at the moment I don't think they have been officially determined as dangerous in the UK, there is a review going on and will report soon).....

If the work was done by a private clinic the private clinic should remove/replace them.

If the private clinic is no longer around then the NHS should be prepared to remove/replace them at public expense.

If the work was done by the NHS then the NHS should be prepared to remove/replace them at public expense.

Please don't think this issue is just about Jordan style plastic surgery (for vanity purposes). A lot of it is plastic surgery which enhances the self-esteem of women who will benefit greatly by having their body turned/returned into what 'us men' consider a 'normal shape'.

Mr_Cellophane

GiantMike wrote:

Please don't think this issue is just about Jordan style plastic surgery (for vanity purposes). A lot of it is plastic surgery which enhances the self-esteem of women who will benefit greatly by having their body turned/returned into what 'us men' consider a 'normal shape'.

But surveys have shown that most men prefer natural breasts.
It amazes me that fashion models are skinny and almost flat chested, but some women still think that large chests are an asset.

rick_chasey

Mr_Cellophane wrote:

GiantMike wrote:

Please don't think this issue is just about Jordan style plastic surgery (for vanity purposes). A lot of it is plastic surgery which enhances the self-esteem of women who will benefit greatly by having their body turned/returned into what 'us men' consider a 'normal shape'.

But surveys have shown that most men prefer natural breasts.
It amazes me that fashion models are skinny and almost flat chested, but some women still think that large chests are an asset.

Did that survey also ask what size men prefer?

pb21

Rick Chasey wrote:

Mr_Cellophane wrote:

GiantMike wrote:

Please don't think this issue is just about Jordan style plastic surgery (for vanity purposes). A lot of it is plastic surgery which enhances the self-esteem of women who will benefit greatly by having their body turned/returned into what 'us men' consider a 'normal shape'.

But surveys have shown that most men prefer natural breasts.
It amazes me that fashion models are skinny and almost flat chested, but some women still think that large chests are an asset.

Did that survey also ask what size men prefer?

Exactly, most men don’t prefer small breasts.

martinwitnam

Well prior to every operation that I've been a part of, the doctor has told the patient that there is a risk that they may die! Is that a big enough risk for you?

pb21

Anyway if the NHS does decide to remove these breast implants it will only be because it has been considered the most cost effective course of action for the taxpayer, i.e. it’s cheaper to operate now than treat however many people some time down the line for cancer.