Disabled badges - should they be graded?

clarkey cat

What about mental disability?

I suffer from SAD* - should I be allowed to invoke the benefit of my pass during the summer months?

*I don't really. Nor does anyone else.

mrc1

There was a phone in about disabled toilets/parking spaces on the Jeremy Vine show on Radio 2 a few months ago.

Sticks in my mind as the debate quickly became farcical - disabled badges for parents of kids with behaviour problems was being suggested by one caller!

The toilets access appeared to be a pretty major issue as well.

meanredspider

I have to say - as someone who has had a temporary exposure to the whole disability thing, it really opens your eyes to the issues. I'd love to see a judge hand out a sentence of being forced to use a wheelchair for a month to anyone fraudulently using a disabled badge. As usual, it's the situations where the PC-gone-mad world has distorted people's views of these issues. But just try out being disabled for a week and you'll quickly pick up the issues involved: some things are excellent (we took the train to Glasgow and, pre-booking wheelchair access, it was superb), but also tried buying cinema tickets on-line which was hopeless - either everyone was disabled or nobody was.

rjsterry

davmaggs wrote:

The scheme is slowly sinking under the weight of fraud. I'd like to see the army of traffic wardens really up their revenue stream by checking them now and again and issuing £1,000 fines for those using one without the badge holder being present.

Almost by definition, a parked car will not have the badge holder (or anyone else) present. Unless wardens are going to start hanging around for a couple of hours by every badged car, I don't see how this could work. This is not to say that the system shouldn't be enforced somehow, I just don't see how without completely changing the system.

bails87

mrc1 wrote:

Sticks in my mind as the debate quickly became farcical - disabled badges for parents of kids with behaviour problems was being suggested by one caller!.

Hmm, I remember the Daily Mail did some lying about parents of kids/kids with ADHD receiving 'free' cars. Unsupridingly it isn't true but I wonder if it was anything to do with that.

Surely you only get a blue badge if it affects your mobility.

The Rookie

Most car parks these days are private, as such the disabled spaces are at best a request for non badge holders not to park there, they have no legal standing and are unenforceable in law.

Traffic wardens? Most areas have 'Civil Enforcement Officers' these days.......

My wife was on crutches/in a wheelchair (depending on how long/far she'd be walking) for the last 7 weeks after a foot operation we managed perfectly well without a blue badge, we only used disabled spaces in private car parks where there was no stipulation for 'blue badge holders only' despite her clearly being more disabled than many with a BB.

Simon

velocestrapture

My dad (recently diagnosed with Parkinson's) has a blue badge. You may see him walking reasonably well into the supermarket, but unless you hung around outside you wouldn't know that just 20 minutes later he would be so exhausted he would be struggling to put one foot in front of another. The last time he spent too long walking around a supermarket because they had changed the layout and he couldn't find his favourite coffee, he fell and broke his hip.

You might also see my mum pull up in a disabled space, and walk briskly but with a pronounced limp into the supermarket. You would be right that she doesn't need a blue badge, but often she will drop dad at the shop, go off to run an errand, and then come back to collect him from the cafe where he is waiting.

Basically, there are many legitimate uses of a blue badge that aren't immediately obvious. Who set you up as judge and juror to say when they should or shouldn't be used. Mind your own business and hope that karma does get those who abuse the system.

Also, the badges are not easy to get. My dad had been refused one only about a month before he had his fall because due to sheer determination he was usually capable of walking for more than the required time and distance.

SimonAH

Easy now Veloces - nobody is suggesting that your parents shouldn't have access to disabled parking, as clearly it is needed.

My only argument is that there is a different requirement for someone who needs the space to get into a wheelchair or get out a walking frame to someone who does not (but still could benefit by proximity to the destination).

rick_chasey

Simon - I think you're doing an apple.

Trying to create a market for something that isn't there. In this case, differentiated disabled parking.

SimonAH

Rick Chasey wrote:

Simon - I think you're doing an apple.

Trying to create a market for something that isn't there. In this case, differentiated disabled parking.

You could be right, but I can't help but think that the poor guy who turns up with the wheelchair in the car and can't get a disabled space with room to get into his chair is way more buggered that the guy who's tottery on his legs and has to use a normal parking space a bit further from the building because all the disabled Grade2 spaces are full.

.....anyway, Apple are doing alright aren't they?

Dougal_bug

The problem for those with disabled badges that visbily having no walking issues, is that they may have issues that are not visible, such as can only walk for a said period.

My in laws applied for a disabled badge becuase there son has Cerebal palsy, and although over time his walkng has improved, almost to a point that as a parent holding his hand, you wouldn't know (he is aged 4 now), he cannot walk for more than 5 mins at a time like that, after that he starts to go back to his old wobble styles, or needs his walker, but as they have been told to try and encourage him to do more walking becuas eit will help, they try to leave the walker at home.

They weren't even aware that they could apply until they were told by a charity about a year ago. When they applied for the blue badge they were told that they would have to re-apply every X years, so assesments could be made, don't know if that is different as you get older.

I think grading would be very difficult, and that there are two issues around blue badges.

The first is those, that take their elderly relatives to the shops, to use the blue badge and leave the elderly relative for whom it has been issued in the car for 30-40 mins - and yes, I have seen this done on a regular basis at my local tesco, why should that give the able bodied person the right to use the disabled badge.

The other is the ratio of disabled bays to non-disabled bays, there are times when they are all in use, but in some locations, I would be surpised in the porportion used exceeds 30%.

And before anyone goes at me, I think that those who truly need to use a blue badge should have the right to them and the relative access it gives them, I just get frustrated with some of the rules and mis-use of the blue badge that you see. Places like tesco's cannot ticket cars in disabled bays if they are showing a valid badge, even in the above example

spen666

meanredspider wrote:

Don't need grading but they do need enforcement to check that the "Badge holder" is actually in the vehicle. .....

Then you'd get complaints from the disabled thet they are being harassed and asked to prove their entitlement to use the badge

meanredspider

spen666 wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

Don't need grading but they do need enforcement to check that the "Badge holder" is actually in the vehicle. .....

Then you'd get complaints from the disabled thet they are being harassed and asked to prove their entitlement to use the badge

Actually I don't think you would. I bet there's plenty out there who, like me, get really pi55ed off when you can't find a spot and there are cars full of seemingly able-bodied people using the spaces.

clarkey cat

I once saw a family of four absolute chubsters crammed into a Ford Sierra at Fleet services sat in a disabled parking space. The dad had waddled in, bought 4 bargain buckets and then they were all sat there stuffing their faces. They were so fat that each family member was touching flesh with every other family member. It was grotesque.

No point to the story. Just a little anecdote.

spen666

meanredspider wrote:

spen666 wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

Don't need grading but they do need enforcement to check that the "Badge holder" is actually in the vehicle. .....

Then you'd get complaints from the disabled thet they are being harassed and asked to prove their entitlement to use the badge

Actually I don't think you would. I bet there's plenty out there who, like me, get really pi55ed off when you can't find a spot and there are cars full of seemingly able-bodied people using the spaces.

You've not thought that through have you.

To enforce this you would have to check people frequently parking in disabled spots and those people who were entitled to park there would soon get p*ssed off having to prove their entitlement before being allowed to leave their car- especially when they may be in a relative hurry.
The checks would fall on those who use the disabled spaces - namely in the main the disabled.

velocestrapture

It would be completely unworkable to split disabled people into different categories. A woman I used to work with who was paralysed from the waist down but takes part is wheelchair racing would actually be fine parked over the far side of the carpark, provided that she has a big space to get her chair out, she can wheel herself for miles (you should see her car- it has a box with a go-go gadget mechanical arm in it that with a press of a button comes down and hoists her chair into the box).

My dad, on the other hand, needs to be both close to the entry to the shop and to have space to open the car door fully, as he has to pull on it to get himself out of the seat. My mum's friend who had muscular distrophy also needed to have a large space close to the entrance as she could not wheel her chair very far.

It would be impossible to categorise people into neat little boxes of who would br grade 1 and who grade 2. Ridiculous.

meanredspider

spen666 wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

spen666 wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

Don't need grading but they do need enforcement to check that the "Badge holder" is actually in the vehicle. .....

Then you'd get complaints from the disabled thet they are being harassed and asked to prove their entitlement to use the badge

Actually I don't think you would. I bet there's plenty out there who, like me, get really pi55ed off when you can't find a spot and there are cars full of seemingly able-bodied people using the spaces.

You've not thought that through have you.

To enforce this you would have to check people frequently parking in disabled spots and those people who were entitled to park there would soon get p*ssed off having to prove their entitlement before being allowed to leave their car- especially when they may be in a relative hurry.
The checks would fall on those who use the disabled spaces - namely in the main the disabled.

Au contrare - I've spent a lot of time thinking this through as I've struggled to find a disabled spot for my son. It's not as if there's going to be many checks but I'm sure people park in those spaces because there are NO checks. Proving their entitlement is very very simple - hand over your badge with your name and photo on it. 30 secs? Do that once in a while is much easier than struggling to find somewhere to park miles away from where you need to be (when you ARE in a hurry)

thistle_

Blue badges need much better enforcement IMO but I can't see a way to do it easily unless you stick a load of police on the street checking people (I don't think the 'parking officers' have to power to do anything unless it's breaching a parking regulation).

Around the corner from where I work there is a furniture upholsterers, and their van driver has a blue badge. Seems suspicious to me that someone physically disabled can deliver furniture but maybe he has a helper each end and he only does the driving. Although most of the time the van is parked empty outside the shop.

Similarly they are used by some people as an excuse to park like a tw*t e.g. on double yellows at a junction rather than going 5m further along into an on street bay... :roll:

First.Aspect

There is already a grading system.

If you have difficulty walking or some other mobility related ailment, you use the disabled space.

If you are confused, distracted, have tunnel vision and/or cannot steer a vehicle or a shopping trolley accurately, you get to use the parent and child spaces.

plowmar

What they should have is a picture of the owner of the badge on the badge, that would stop the 'using' of badges. As I am not a doctor I accept that valid discs are valid. Any way cameron's sorting this out with independent doctors authorising disabilities and wether they should be out working, rather than the patients own doctor who may have known them for count less years.

roger_merriman

plowmar wrote:

What they should have is a picture of the owner of the badge on the badge, that would stop the 'using' of badges. As I am not a doctor I accept that valid discs are valid. Any way cameron's sorting this out with independent doctors authorising disabilities and wether they should be out working, rather than the patients own doctor who may have known them for count less years.

they do have photos and have done as far as i've known for years.