Single track riding: XC? Freeride? Trials? DH?

Lolage

Hi guys, I'm a little confused where single track riding comes under the different types of mountain biking...

As far as I'm aware-

XC: General long distance riding, off road, not too tricky, firetracks, canals etc?
Freeride: not a clue really what this is, but I'm guessing its DH+Jumping mixed up
Trials: I think this is street trials?
DH: Downhill...

Where does single track fall into these? Also, what type of bike will I need for single track? I have been looking on pinkbike and the only relative catagories really were XC and DH?

Anyone? :roll:

Pudseyp

Single track is what it is, small narrow trail that can be natural as in a forest or at a trail centre which again can be natural or also man made.

XC/trail is off road over mixed terrain...I would not class towpaths or firetracks as XC...
FR is on long travel bikes used at bike parks and some DH tracks this is more about jumps and drops sometime by adding tricks etc
Trials is on obsticles similar to motorbikes
Jump/dirt/play bikes are short travel hard tails used at bike parks etc to do jumps etc usually into a transition as they have no rear suspension....

variflex

Hi there,
A number of us had the same problem recently and a number of manufacturers are starting to develop more "trail" orientated bikes. In the past u had to sort of try and find a bike in the other categories that would suit your local rides.

Yeti for an example group their bikes including a trail recommendation. The ASR5.
Orange 5's are very good at trail by the looks of it. A friend of mine has just bought one and very happy with its ability to climb well, fast across country and can handle fast downhills with precision.

Transition do a more trail orientated bike and Im sure there are more around.

Others on here will be able to recommend some makes/models.


Rgds

delcol

dh
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqrzcDzVppQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4TMSI2U5d0
trials
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj6ho1-G6tw

freride
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrxgTXfiA4k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3QQ7weVO6w

xc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMOVMuv3 ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/user/topasassin# ... FPJH4tfSJc

Orange 5's are very good at trail by the looks of it.

untill they crack....

ilovedirt

It's all manufacturer jargon. 'Trail' riding is just slightly more aggressive XC... though I'd just call it XC, you're just doing it with a slightly bigger bike.

Freeride is similar to downhill but is more about big drops, jumps and 'hucks', it started in canada, specifically on the north shore in vancouver.

There's slopestyle as well, which is sort of a mix between dirt jumping and freeride. REALLY big jumps and drops on short travel full sus bikes with really big tricks thrown in, pretty cool (check out videos for crankworx). Slopestyle is more competition based, whereas freeride is exactly what it says on the tin. Freeriders tend not to compete, and just ride for their love of riding.

Lolage

Fair enough, thanks for clearing this up guys! So basically I'll be wanting a nice full sus XC bike.

ilovedirt

get a full sus trail bike (something about 140mm travel front and rear), they're a little more of a slog on the ups, but generally more capable than a racey XC bike and more fun to ride

delcol

Lolage wrote:

Fair enough, thanks for clearing this up guys! So basically I'll be wanting a nice full sus XC bike.

or a nice hardtail.... something to hone your skills on without cheating and having suspension...

delcol turns and cowers behind chair for onslaught. :P

get a full sus trail bike (something about 140mm travel front and rear), they're a little more of a slog on the ups, but generally more capable than a racey XC bike and more fun to ride

or get something with 160mm and have even more fun especially when the going get teccy and points down...

ilovedirt

Yeah, a long travel (140-150mm ish) hardtail would be good too, I rode mine for the majority of this year before deciding I wanted to upgrade to full sus for XC.

delcol

i kinda of lucky i got all bases covered from a rigid road bike to full blown dh bike.

road bike
160 mm hardtail
160mm fullsuss trail bike
and dh/park bike.

i always seem to reach for my hardtail i prefare it.. well over here i do.

for trips abroad usually whislter i take my full susser/s

Lolage

What sort of hard tails should I be looking at then with 140(+)mm travel?

delcol

look through different manufactures i guess most will have them...

finding a160mm hardtail is limmited.
santacruz
cove
chromag
orange
pace
are few off the top of my head.

1mancity2

Lolage wrote:

What sort of hard tails should I be looking at then with 140(+)mm travel?

Loads, delcol as named some good ones but look at, on one, ragley, ns bikes and cotic

bails87

On One.

You don't need 140mm+ of suspension (I've got a 150mm HT btw). It can be nice, or more fun, or more forgiving, but you shouldn't only look at these bikes.

delcol

bails87 wrote:

On One.

You don't need 140mm+ of suspension (I've got a 150mm HT btw). It can be nice, or more fun, or more forgiving, but you shouldn't only look at these bikes.

true...

i think you need to figure out what style of riding you gonna be doing most often and were you gonna be riding most often.. then decide what bike would suite your style and places you plan riding...

DCR00

are you just starting to ride off road ? if so, i would start with a short travel HT, learn how to ride on that before you splash out on a 140mm trail bike, realising when you come to your first decent size drop off that you are way out of your depth and massively overbiked

whether you "need" a 140mm bike remains open for debate

IMO you dont "need" suspension at all, its more about the change in geometry that comes with the suspension that makes the bike more suited to more techincally demanding riding

wobbem

Then there is also "all mountain" ...............

Anonymous

Just labels really. Ultimately you can ride most stuff on most kinds of bikes if you want to.

Hell, I've seen a woman ride a folding bike down technical, bumpy and big bermed steepish single track, showing up everyone. Remember that people rode the same stuff we do now, decades ago but on less or even no suspension.

The labels manufacturers use indicate the intended use, but there's so much cross over and inconsistency. In general the design of the bike changes the feel and comfort for what you're doing and in some cases are maybe more robust for serious stuff.

I'd try some bikes first, ideally see if you can get to demo some on real trails, either from local shops that will do that or go to a demo day. Or try friend's bikes. Also see what other people ride where you want to ride, and think about what you might want to ride in the future.

Geometry, especially head angle is something I'd think about as a key thing. If you want to ride steep things you might want to go slacker on the head angle to not feel like you're going over the bars. If you want to ride flat or climbs mostly, then steeper head angle. Think what you may do in the future as you could start with a steep angle bike and start doing a few descents and realise that a slacker bike may have been better. But again, you can ride it all whatever the bike and just adjust your riding instead. The bike just makes it more comfortable.

supersonic

There is a lot of crossover, and more travel does not always equal a harder hitting bike. 15 years ago most hardtails were 'XC' bikes, and racy ones at that. Eventually the designers realised that not everyone who wanted a hardtail wanted a steep, twitchy race bike, so after the introduction of the 'hardcore hardtail' (think Saracen Zen in 2000, Chameleons, Zaskar X) we got what we now call a 'Trail Bike'. XC bikes remain, but people associate them more with the racy type of old. So to summarise, and very generally speaking:

XC - steep, racy bikes that generally have up to 4 inch of travel.

Trail - more relaxed bikes that tend to have a little more travel than XC bikes, and maybe a more sturdy components. 5 inches of travel or there abouts.

AM - takes the trail concept further and usually adds in wider bars and rims, bigger tyres, harder hitting parts and even more laid back geometry. 6 inch of travel or so.

Freeride and DH may have a 'light' version ie 7 inches or more of travel and single crown forks, while the full on big hitters get the works: dual crowns and the big weight.

However we must look at cost too. An expensive AM bike can weigh less than an entry level XC bike. Then we have all the names the manufacturers give them, plus one offs! But if we look at say Giant then:

XC - XTC series, Anthem X
Trail - Talon X, Trance
AM - Reign
Freeride 'lite' - Reign X
DH - Glory

louthepoo

I'm pretty new to mountainbiking and have gone for the short (80mm) travel hardtail, I'm looking at skilling up on it as I'm technically pretty poor. I'm getting better every time I go out and can see the difference! Its gonna be a long time before I think of changing the forks, I'm loving the bike though

Pudseyp

Personally I would recomend a 120 to 140mm full suspension...for XC and trail riding it would be the only bike you will ever need.

Lolage

delcol wrote:

bails87 wrote:

On One.

You don't need 140mm+ of suspension (I've got a 150mm HT btw). It can be nice, or more fun, or more forgiving, but you shouldn't only look at these bikes.

true...

i think you need to figure out what style of riding you gonna be doing most often and were you gonna be riding most often.. then decide what bike would suite your style and places you plan riding...

Well, its going to be used mostly for trial centres. Will also use it to blast through local woods/hills/canals but this wont really be the main use...

DCR00 wrote:

are you just starting to ride off road ? if so, i would start with a short travel HT, learn how to ride on that before you splash out on a 140mm trail bike, realising when you come to your first decent size drop off that you are way out of your depth and massively overbiked

whether you "need" a 140mm bike remains open for debate

IMO you dont "need" suspension at all, its more about the change in geometry that comes with the suspension that makes the bike more suited to more techincally demanding riding

I've been biking off road for about 10+ years. When I say off road I don't mean anything compared to the likes of llandegla but I've always been off road in woods, canals, and local single track stuff.


I think after reading this thread, I'm going to spend around £700 - maybe a bit more if needed and go for a full sus.

delcol

llandeglas not that hard theres nothing to hard there.. not been for ages..

best bet is see what demo bikes the shop have there at lladeg and try a few out... see what feels right for you...

bails87

louthepoo wrote:

I'm pretty new to mountainbiking and have gone for the short (80mm) travel hardtail, I'm looking at skilling up on it as I'm technically pretty poor.

I can recommend Chase Skills on (suprisingly!) Cannock Chase. I had a skills session there and it took a while for it all to sink in, but I'm getting more and more confident with each ride. I don't know if you've been round Follow The Dog and The Monkey, but I went from pooing myself just looking at the black rock sections to being able to do them all without dabbing a foot down.

delcol

bails87 wrote:

louthepoo wrote:

I'm pretty new to mountainbiking and have gone for the short (80mm) travel hardtail, I'm looking at skilling up on it as I'm technically pretty poor.

I can recommend Chase Skills on (suprisingly!) Cannock Chase. I had a skills session there and it took a while for it all to sink in, but I'm getting more and more confident with each ride. I don't know if you've been round Follow The Dog and The Monkey, but I went from pooing myself just looking at the black rock sections to being able to do them all without dabbing a foot down.

best advice yet...

people overlook paying for some coaching but a decent skills coach is well worth it.. it will be the best upgrade you ever get,...

i would definatley not be were i am ability wise without the coaching i had in whistler..
the confidence you will get is well worth the small price for a few hours with a skills coach....

cough cough. jedi cough cough.. is the man to speak to...

louthepoo

bails87 wrote:

louthepoo wrote:

I'm pretty new to mountainbiking and have gone for the short (80mm) travel hardtail, I'm looking at skilling up on it as I'm technically pretty poor.

I can recommend Chase Skills on (suprisingly!) Cannock Chase. I had a skills session there and it took a while for it all to sink in, but I'm getting more and more confident with each ride. I don't know if you've been round Follow The Dog and The Monkey, but I went from pooing myself just looking at the black rock sections to being able to do them all without dabbing a foot down.

I have thought about it actually, how much does it cost?

I've done the dog but not the monkey yet. I tend to just randomly ride around choosing any gaps in the trees for the single track stuff.

Pudseyp

delcol wrote:

llandeglas not that hard theres nothing to hard there.. not been for ages..

best bet is see what demo bikes the shop have there at lladeg and try a few out... see what feels right for you...

So you haven't ridden the new black and reds then.....so how do you know how hard it is....

If I had the choice of only one bike it would take a FS all day long.

bails87

louthepoo wrote:

bails87 wrote:

louthepoo wrote:

I'm pretty new to mountainbiking and have gone for the short (80mm) travel hardtail, I'm looking at skilling up on it as I'm technically pretty poor.

I can recommend Chase Skills on (suprisingly!) Cannock Chase. I had a skills session there and it took a while for it all to sink in, but I'm getting more and more confident with each ride. I don't know if you've been round Follow The Dog and The Monkey, but I went from pooing myself just looking at the black rock sections to being able to do them all without dabbing a foot down.

I have thought about it actually, how much does it cost?

I've done the dog but not the monkey yet. I tend to just randomly ride around choosing any gaps in the trees for the single track stuff.

Mine was about £50 I think, but I did the advanced one.

Look online: http://www.chaseskills.co.uk/

For the price of a pair of tyres, or a pair of shorts, it's well worth it.

There are other coaches available, obviously, and I've heard excellent things about Jedi, but I used Craig/Chase Skills and I'm pleased with the results.

delcol

Pudseyp wrote:

delcol wrote:

llandeglas not that hard theres nothing to hard there.. not been for ages..

best bet is see what demo bikes the shop have there at lladeg and try a few out... see what feels right for you...

So you haven't ridden the new black and reds then.....so how do you know how hard it is....

If I had the choice of only one bike it would take a FS all day long.

youtube videos my friend... none of the new stuff looks that challenging on them....

Jedi

thanks for the recommend