How do people cope with badly behaved drivers?

alidaf

I started road biking in May and slowly built up to commuting twice a week (15miles each way) and riding up to about 30 miles on the weekend. Almost immediately I became acutely aware of the threats that drivers often pose to a point, now, when I just explode every time it happens. I have decided to take a break because I am too terrified. Not of being knocked off, but of my reaction.

I was nearly sideswiped on Saturday by a driver that had earlier forced me to filter by wedging me to the kerb. On the other side of the roundabout he came so close I punched his window. I caught up with him and completely lost it. He sped off and I caught up with him again. When I got home I was more upset by what I did than what he did. Earlier, I nearly got taken out by a van so I was already stressed. It happens far too often but I have seen videos of other cyclists just taking it in their stride. How do others cope? Is there some strategy or have I just become too reactive due to pre-ride fear that something will inevitably happen? I post on Stop SMIDSY and upload video clips of some near-misses to YouTube but that just seems to fuel my frustration because nothing actively makes these drivers aware of how they drive. Then you get the idiots that know they have done something stupid and spit venom anyway. I just don't understand it. It's so bloody depressing.

Tom Butcher

Difficult one. I think if you've been cut up or whatever you've got a perfect right to react, to post clips on youtube, to shout at the driver etc etc. BUT just because you have a right to doesn't mean you have to. Personally I tend to let things ride - I might shout at the driver but it's normally a kind of "hey careful" kind of way rather than "Im going to rip your f'ing head off if I catch up with you".

Certainly if you find it getting to you I think you need to take the approach that just because there is a problem with the way some motorists treat cyclists - it isn't necessarily your responsibility to solve it.

teulk

Sometimes i just let it go and sometimes i let rip and shout abuse and make gestures towards the offending driver. I know it not really the best thing to do but it really depends what mood im in. I am though a lot more tollerant than what i used to be.

kurako

It takes effort but you need to learn to control your emotions. Provocation can lead to disastrous consequences. You are on a bike and they have a couple of tonnes of metal. It only takes on nutter behind the wheel to screw your life up.

In terms of what I rely on most I would say:

1. Puzzled look. Especially good at pinch points. "Really, you're going to try to squeeze through there?"

2. Laughing at them. Not openlly. Just like, you know, look at that loser getting all worked up to get to the next red light.

3. Not making eye contact (especially at side roads). People seem to think if they make eye contact the driver will wait. Drivers seem to think if you make eye contact its ok to pull out. Just pretend like you haven't seen them. Pay attention to the car not the driver.

4. A bad driver is better off in front. If someone has shown bad driving skills it's better to have them in front of you. It's tempting to go in front to 'teach them a lesson' but you're much safer behind (unless they reverse, naturally).

5. Don't feel like you need to move forward at all times. What do you gain from making that risky gap? Is it worth it in the grand scheme of things.

Try to enjoy it. Motorists are generally miserable and try to bring you down to your level. Don't let them.

bails87

A bad driver is better off in front

This is what I'm trying to remember. It just pops into my head and I think "just leave it, let him go".

Also, I keep my remonstrations limited to a "whoa" (normally just a reflex when something comes flying past too close) and a shake of the head or a wag of my finger if it's really bad.


Also, buy and read Cyclecraft if you haven't already.

CarlosDSanchez

Learn to ride defensivley. You have to work out quickly if traffic is going to do numpty things and then avoid it. Accept that most traffic will treat you like a second class road user and expect you to give way/get out of their way.

You just have to let it go sometimes and not think to hard about some of the near misses you have due to poor driving. I used to get worked up and rant, but you stop enjoying the ride. These days I just give them a "cheers mate!!" or thumbs up sign when anyone does anything particularly stupid.

DrLex

Excellent advice there, Kurako!
When approaching a pinch point and i can sense a vehicle attempting to overtake, I will put out my right hand low with palm facing back to warn and then wave thanks after.

Origamist

I think you have to try and change your mindset - difficult I know, particularly if you have anger management issues (not that I am suggesting you have!).

When I cycle I expect to encounter poor behaviour from other road users from time to time and I have calibrated my responses accordingly - crap happens on the roads. However, I also know that the overwhelming majority of interactions with other road users are positive or neutral. If someone makes a mistake I find it better to move on; dwell on the positive (I make a point of being courteous to other road users at every opportunity and I love riding my bike) as my experience of "educational" conversations with fellow road users is nearly always dispiriting. If someone's behaviour strikes me a vindictive and/or life-threatening, I report them to the police or their company. In this way, I still feel that people can and should be held accountable for their actions.

kr1s

Kurako wrote:

Try to enjoy it. Motorists are generally miserable and try to bring you down to your level. Don't let them.

Nicely put, motorists arnt stuck in traffic, they are traffic

millimole

I'd agree with most of all of the above.
Defensive riding will help you avoid most (certainly not all) 'situations' that might occur, and a regular route will help you be able to anticipate the likely stretches, junctions, or crossings where these occur.
You have to learn to 'just chill' - in truth very few drivers are malignant B*sat*rds, most are stupid or asleep or both. You alone are not going to cure their stupidity, and defensive riding helps to defend against sleep deprived fools.
You need to develop a belief in karma. When they cut you up - their boss will sh*t on them later in the day, when they pull out in front of you - their boyfriend will dump them that evening etc etc.
Equally you are not perfect (honest). When you jump that red light and just miss the ped who had the right of way, you will find that a car door opens just in time to make you swerve. etc etc.
Chill. karma, it's the zen of cycling......

HebdenBiker

Kurako wrote:

It takes effort but you need to learn to control your emotions. Provocation can lead to disastrous consequences. You are on a bike and they have a couple of tonnes of metal. It only takes on nutter behind the wheel to screw your life up.

In terms of what I rely on most I would say:

1. Puzzled look. Especially good at pinch points. "Really, you're going to try to squeeze through there?"

2. Laughing at them. Not openlly. Just like, you know, look at that loser getting all worked up to get to the next red light.

3. Not making eye contact (especially at side roads). People seem to think if they make eye contact the driver will wait. Drivers seem to think if you make eye contact its ok to pull out. Just pretend like you haven't seen them. Pay attention to the car not the driver.

4. A bad driver is better off in front. If someone has shown bad driving skills it's better to have them in front of you. It's tempting to go in front to 'teach them a lesson' but you're much safer behind (unless they reverse, naturally).

5. Don't feel like you need to move forward at all times. What do you gain from making that risky gap? Is it worth it in the grand scheme of things.

Try to enjoy it. Motorists are generally miserable and try to bring you down to your level. Don't let them.

+1 to this, especially numbers 2 and 4

HebdenBiker

Another thing. Reading threads on the internet about bad drivers, cyclist deaths, incidents caught on headcam, etc, can really make you anxious on the road, and this will not help your (our) blood pressure, or your (our) responses to drivers

I have been cycling on roads for 30 years and have never considered it dangerous and never had a serious incident involving a car. For me, cycling was a safe, relaxing activity, and most drivers were courteous enough, and the handful of idiots were easy to brush off. BUT over the last year or so, I've been reading commuting threads and subscribing to helmet cam users on YouTube. I've started worrying about stuff I've never worried about before, started getting angry with drivers over stuff that wouldn't otherwise have bothered me, and generally enjoyed my road cycling less. I've started doing more MTBing, and I think part of the reason is to get away from traffic.

I'm trying to coach myself to be rational about it. There are a lot of cycle commuters out there, and the only time they post online is when they've had a dangerous incident. This means that internet forums paint a very black picture of cycling safety. Furthermore, this forum has several very militant riders who (quite rightly and legally) assert cyclist's rights on the road by frequently "taking primary", and using other assertive cycling techniques. These riders frequently find themselves in conflict with simpletons in motorized vehicles. I have never "taken primary", but then, nor have I ever had anyone try to use their car as a weapon against me. So I have to keep reminding myself that my fairly passive riding style has kept me out of trouble for 30 years, and I don't need to change to a more assertive style now.

I have now banned myself from looking at helmet cam videos.

cooldad

Expect idiots, anticipate problems. Chill.

Initialised

It does get better, every time you ride a route at roughly the same time of day you notice the same cars and gradually you educate them to be aware of you. Also you get more tuned to where, what and when conflicts happen so the anticipation helps you deal with and avoid them better.

Drysuitdiver

i just shake my head now. after i nearly lobbed a dlock into the windscreen of one car i decided i really shouldn't getb that wound up. i ty and remember the really bad ones and roadsafe report them .

mrtuk

cooldad wrote:

Expect idiots, anticipate problems. Chill.

+1 ... I used to get wound up, but it's not worth it. Anything you can do to anticipate problems and avoid is worth it rather than doing anything after the event. Keep calm and chill (although easier said than done sometimes!)

estampida

I find out / follow where they live

then I put plenty of dog s h 1 t under the door handles

clanton

When I was a newbie commuter I went through a "road warrior" phase where I was aggressive and "fought for my rights" and got worked up over every near miss. Eventually I realised that it was not changing anything, was ruining my ride and quite likely actually bad for my health.

Reading stuff on here and thinking about it and getting more used to the commuting eventually lead my to adopt a lower key and more Zen-like approach to my riding. As a result I enjoy it much more and I have fewer incidents. I do ride in a visible manner, I position myself appropriately (as I see it) for the circumstances so as to let cars through at times, other times I position myself so they can't squeeze by - but only for as long as needed. My impression is also that car drivers, on my routes anyway - are getting more used to and more tolerant of, and careful towards, cyclists.

That said there are still numptoies out there. And occasionally icidents DO get to me. Once recently I was provoked by a near miss into giving chase down a road where I knew I would catch the driver due to the speed bumps. I had planned on a firm but polite rebuke but when faced with the dozy, arrogant uncracing fat cowlike face that I found I exploded into a tirade of filth and fury - I was ashamed afterwards. So strive for the Zen approach, but forgive yourself if it doesn't always happen!
!

alidaf

Thanks everyone. I have reflected a lot on all of your comments and while most days I do behave, that particular day was bad for me. So, what I got from this thread was to forget that incident, move on, have zen! Plus, plenty of specific ways to behave, but generally, have zen.

I'll be back on the bike next week but I'll give that particular journey a rest for a while. It's only a 5 miler into town for my Kung Fu class and then back. The 15 mile commute to work isn't too bad but the journey home is a bit worse. And there's always a nice Sunday ride to chill out on. Plenty of good advice here so thanks all for chiming in. Hopefully this will be of some help to others too.

@clanton - sounds very much like my phase!
@HebdenBiker - sounds familiar to me too. I spend a lot of time looking at clips of near misses. Obviously a bit too much time!
@millimole - nice philosophy but I want to be around when their bad karma kicks in! :twisted:
@Kurako - It takes a lot of effort, especially in the heat of the moment and after simmering following an earlier incident. Point 2 is important. I imagine most drivers drive that way because it is their commute and they didn't get up early enough, van drivers trying to stick to strict scheduling, etc. But basically, as you said, worked up trying to get to the next red light! Lol!
@Tom Butcher - you are correct that it isn't necessarily our responsibility as individuals but that leads to a feeling of complete impotence unless there is something more collective we can do. What can we do? How about creating a database of bad drivers for insurance companies to review. Slap these drivers with increased premiums!
@others - thanks to everyone.

gilesjuk

Carry a stinger?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spike_strip

akcc05

WTF? That just makes things worse. I do absolutely nothing, I don't even stare at the driver or anything. I am usually very good at anticipating bad driving behaviour so I am rarely in trouble but that's not the point.

Rather than schizing when things go wrong, I always wave to say thanks when drivers don't cut me off on a left turn and slow down to wait until I have left the intersection. Or those who slow down to wait for a safe spot for passing, joining into a lane etc. True, that's what they should be doing by law but if every rider were to do the same, drivers will actually begin to understand that bike riders are good and reasonable people. Relationships between riders and motorists doesn't need to get any worse than it already is.

If you punch the window of a car that has driven too close to you and the driver in the car behind (or other motorists) saw that, whose side is he/she going to be on? No one likes to have their car panel, side mirror punched by a cyclist. Motorist are not stupid, they can see what bad driving is like and judge for themselves and hopefully learn from their own or others' mistakes.

Even if it is really bad, what good is going nuts going to do for you? Get all fired up at home 5 hours after the incident? Or have some chavs get out of their car to fist fight with you when you are already knacked?

dilemna

Kurako wrote:

Motorists are generally miserable and try to bring you down to your level. Don't let them.

Errrrr........ no they are not. I'm not and don't.

jomoj

clanton is spot on about the 'road warrior' phase and I'm afraid it's just one of those things that marks one out as a bit of a newbie . When I started regularly commuting back in my london days (late 90s-00s) I would get wound up and made aggressive by bad driving or even just the thought that someone might cut me up but really it gets you nowhere and is more likely to make you do something rash or dangerous. So I'll basically just echo all the advice about anticipation, assertiveness, keeping cool, acting like a responsible road user.

...having said all that, I actually lost my cool for the first time in a long, long time earlier this week when someone cut me up pretty badly on a roundabout. Chased them for about 2 miles with the intention of having a word but perhaps fortunately didn't catch them.

Still, it left me pretty wound up for the rest of the day. Mostly through their actions but also because it's a junction I ride everyday and I didn't take command of the lane like I normally do and the nob in question overtook then cut me up on the apex of the exit - it's a fast road and was doing about 17mph at the time so he had no reason not to wait until we were clear of the roundabout.

finally - there's a lot to be said for making sure that drivers recognise you as a fellow human, not just an obstruction they can ignore - eye contact, acknowledgement of considerate drving and if you ever come to exchange words, keep cool and treat them as an equal, not a scumbag. Even if they are...

alidaf

@akcc05 - I think you missed the intent of my post. I know what I did was foolish and I suffered as a result. I wanted to know how others deal with incidents to avoid a similar issue in the future. I've had lots of good advice, but better still, it seems that so many are like me or have been through a period of acting the way I did. Its good to know that it is an experience that most of us have felt at some point, and even also responded in an atypical manner. I learned that I am human after all and with the support of others with similar experience I can change my behaviour for the better and enjoy again what I once did.

BTW, I nearly always acknowledge good behaviour with a nod or wave to any motorist that cares to acknowledge my presence and act respectfully and responsibly. I even sometimes get a wave back.

Origamist

Alidaf, - stop watching my Youtube Vids!

shouldbeinbed

It costs nothing to show a bit of courtesy or good grace, its just as easy to raise a hand to say thanks/well done to a driver that does wait to pass or doesn't cut you up to get out of a junction as it does to wave your fists and yell at the ones that don't. Lots of drivers are probably going to be regulars on your commute, you can get yourself a good reputation by the odd nod or wave which will get you the benefit of the doubt when it is you that is a couple of minutes late and horsing it or momentarily distracted and not riding to your usual high standard. Trouble is it's far harder to get and keep a good rep than it is to get a bad one by getting all frothy mouthed and fist wavy.

also if you're getting worked up and stressed whilst they're merrily sailing off into the distance listening to Chris Evans, who is the one hurting ? why give them the power to make you stressed and angry? frankly f**k em, they ain't worth the headache or heart attack and in all likliehood won't have realised they've been that close or unsporting and won't understand (or in some cases care) why you're shaking your fists and mouthing obscenities in their rear view mirror.

Good point on the perception the internet and helmet cam videos gives of the roads being like dodge city -if we all posted our commute footage every day it would be a very very boring watch for months on end interspersed with blink and you miss it flashes of incident.

Its got a bit worse over the last few years but I can still count on my fingers the total number of genuinely frightening near misses and collisions I've had in over 20 years.

solsurf

I used to go mad, but it never solved anything, I think my attitude has basically changed, I make sure I thank courteous drivers and just try to ignore the bad drivers. Although there are times that really scare me and can shake me up for a couple of days.

One thing to remember there is only going to be one winner between a car and a bike no matter who is in the right. Keep safe!

alidaf

Origamist wrote:

Alidaf, - stop watching my Youtube Vids!

Lol. I think I've watched 'em all post event. I like them and I love the sound of your bike and shifters. Quite a sweet 'chirping' sound and very smooth shifting. Giz it!

dave2041

alidaf wrote:

Origamist wrote:

Alidaf, - stop watching my Youtube Vids!

Lol. I think I've watched 'em all post event. I like them and I love the sound of your bike and shifters. Quite a sweet 'chirping' sound and very smooth shifting. Giz it!

link me i wanna see ! :P

Origamist

dave2041 wrote:

alidaf wrote:

Origamist wrote:

Alidaf, - stop watching my Youtube Vids!

Lol. I think I've watched 'em all post event. I like them and I love the sound of your bike and shifters. Quite a sweet 'chirping' sound and very smooth shifting. Giz it!

link me i wanna see ! :P

There's quite a few more under my username:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gY2A69JSLk

kurako

dilemna wrote:

Kurako wrote:

Motorists are generally miserable and try to bring you down to your level. Don't let them.

Errrrr........ no they are not. I'm not and don't.

I disagree. All motorists are sociopaths who would run over there own granny to get somewhere a split second earlier.

In other news.. 100% of people like to generalise.