Crashed Again ! Advice needed !

coldemm

Just in from short spin on wet roads,I was slowly turning into tight left bend and lost the front wheel and went down,this is the third time in 2 years its happened! I breaked before the bend and not in it and took the bend as wide as possible. I am running conti gp4000s at 100 psi ,I had standard conti grand prix on previous crashes.I am 95kg
I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

STEFANOS4784

probably going round corners to quickly. Roads are more slippery after a dry period and then rain than they are if it's been pouring for a while, or obviously, if it's dry. Or so I think from what I've read on here. I always sh1t it in the wet and almost get off and walk round the corners Well i used to when i cycled more regularly....Must get back into it.....

ddraver

Sorry, 3rd time in 2 years?

Count yourself lucky!!

thescouselander

Exactly how fast is slowly? Its difficult to guess what happened without knowing the exact circumstances. I suppose option 3 is the most likely possibility but sometimes the road is just so slippy you're going down no matter what.

Did you notice any contamination on the road such as diesel?

coldemm

Thanks for reply , Tarmac was semi smooth no diesel obvious ! Must be an age thing cant remember being on the deck as much in my younger days !

I just dont bounce anymore, might go back to touring bike if its fairly normal to crash in wet !

rozzer32

I agree with draver. 3 accidents in 9 months for me. Although 2 of them were down to stupid drivers.

STEFANOS4784

Well you're sh1t then and going to fast. It is not normal to be rolling around in the road constantly IMO.

andrewjoseph

Get out mountain biking, it's normal to crash every ride, or at least once a week.



i had a bad crash last sept, off the bike for nearly 9 months, still much more nervous on the road bike in any conditions than out on my mountain bike.

STEFANOS4784

Yeh but do you end up in a road with the risk of being then squished by a motorist

andrewjoseph

STEFANOS4784 wrote:

Yeh but do you end up in a road with the risk of being then squished by a motorist

yes, that does add another dimension to my nervousness.

Dmak

Clearly, slow down a bit.

Besides the obvious I will add that locking up the back wheel momentarily can give you an idea of the traction available.

Experience goes a long way too, just keep riding

peter101cycle

coldemm wrote:

Just in from short spin on wet roads,I was slowly turning into tight left bend and lost the front wheel and went down,this is the third time in 2 years its happened! I breaked before the bend and not in it and took the bend as wide as possible. I am running conti gp4000s at 100 psi ,I had standard conti grand prix on previous crashes.I am 95kg
I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

One thing I would certainly consider changing is your Tyre pressures, as I would suggest you are under inflating them. I weight around 12 stone and run Schwalbe tyres at 110psi.

So, theory is that you should run yours slightly higher still, as you are heavier. Try experimenting.

The heavier you are the more you will deform the tyres especially when cornering and putting the tyres at an angle with the road.

Monty Dog

What size is the tyre is it a 23mm? If you're not running 25mm then you should as it puts a lot more rubber on the road and gives far more progressive grip. Try and keep your turn radius constant, or go in tight and you can run wider if needed - if you go in too wide and they try and tighten the turn you'll overload the front wheel.

markos1963

peter101cycle wrote:

coldemm wrote:

Just in from short spin on wet roads,I was slowly turning into tight left bend and lost the front wheel and went down,this is the third time in 2 years its happened! I breaked before the bend and not in it and took the bend as wide as possible. I am running conti gp4000s at 100 psi ,I had standard conti grand prix on previous crashes.I am 95kg
I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

One thing I would certainly consider changing is your Tyre pressures, as I would suggest you are under inflating them. I weight around 12 stone and run Schwalbe tyres at 110psi.

So, theory is that you should run yours slightly higher still, as you are heavier. Try experimenting.

The heavier you are the more you will deform the tyres especially when cornering and putting the tyres at an angle with the road.

Errr no, if the OP increases the pressure in his tyres he'll decrease the contact patch probably leading to more crashes. 100psi at his weight is fine, maybe even going down to 95psi.
OP if you are only losing the front end each time then it's telling you something, either you are dragging the front brake, putting your weight too far back unloading the front tyre or have your weight distributed wrongly ie leaning to the wrong side of the bike. Of course if it's none of that then you are just unlucky.

fizz

coldemm wrote:

Your advice would be welcome !

Erh, stop crashing

Seriously, sounds like poor bike handling maybe, perhaps combined with to much speed and not giving yourself enough time to react when the road is slippy. Also watch what your riding over manhole covers, white lines etc all give no grip on a wet road and you'll be on your arse before you realise it.

Maybe you tightened your line to much and the front tucked so thing about your corner line and remember to look where you want the bike to go when you are cornering.

I run the same tyres and never had any problems in the wet with grip even when using them in the winter over country road surface flooded with water. I run the front a little higher PSI wise at 110psi.

Although I know alot of people who drop the pressure when the roads wet...

( apologies if the above is teaching you to suck eggs )

peter101cycle

markos1963 wrote:

peter101cycle wrote:

coldemm wrote:

Just in from short spin on wet roads,I was slowly turning into tight left bend and lost the front wheel and went down,this is the third time in 2 years its happened! I breaked before the bend and not in it and took the bend as wide as possible. I am running conti gp4000s at 100 psi ,I had standard conti grand prix on previous crashes.I am 95kg
I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

One thing I would certainly consider changing is your Tyre pressures, as I would suggest you are under inflating them. I weight around 12 stone and run Schwalbe tyres at 110psi.

So, theory is that you should run yours slightly higher still, as you are heavier. Try experimenting.

The heavier you are the more you will deform the tyres especially when cornering and putting the tyres at an angle with the road.

Errr no, if the OP increases the pressure in his tyres he'll decrease the contact patch probably leading to more crashes. 100psi at his weight is fine, maybe even going down to 95psi.
OP if you are only losing the front end each time then it's telling you something, either you are dragging the front brake, putting your weight too far back unloading the front tyre or have your weight distributed wrongly ie leaning to the wrong side of the bike. Of course if it's none of that then you are just unlucky.

Error, maybe not

Tyre pressures are debatable I know and check out this Sheldon Brown articlehttp://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html.

Good article and there is also a linked article on the subject. The OP should certainly reconsider handling on wet roads round corners, with Tyre pressures possibly. Still sounds a little underinflated in my experience.

markos1963

peter101cycle wrote:

markos1963 wrote:

peter101cycle wrote:

coldemm wrote:

Just in from short spin on wet roads,I was slowly turning into tight left bend and lost the front wheel and went down,this is the third time in 2 years its happened! I breaked before the bend and not in it and took the bend as wide as possible. I am running conti gp4000s at 100 psi ,I had standard conti grand prix on previous crashes.I am 95kg
I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

One thing I would certainly consider changing is your Tyre pressures, as I would suggest you are under inflating them. I weight around 12 stone and run Schwalbe tyres at 110psi.

So, theory is that you should run yours slightly higher still, as you are heavier. Try experimenting.

The heavier you are the more you will deform the tyres especially when cornering and putting the tyres at an angle with the road.

Errr no, if the OP increases the pressure in his tyres he'll decrease the contact patch probably leading to more crashes. 100psi at his weight is fine, maybe even going down to 95psi.
OP if you are only losing the front end each time then it's telling you something, either you are dragging the front brake, putting your weight too far back unloading the front tyre or have your weight distributed wrongly ie leaning to the wrong side of the bike. Of course if it's none of that then you are just unlucky.

Error, maybe not

Tyre pressures are debatable I know and check out this Sheldon Brown articlehttp://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html.

Good article and there is also a linked article on the subject. The OP should certainly reconsider handling on wet roads round corners, with Tyre pressures possibly. Still sounds a little underinflated in my experience.

Unfortunatly your link didn't work but that might be my PC. I race crits on both clinchers and tubs and don't have any problems and I'd like to think that I was a hard rider through the bends(it's the only place I seem to have any advantage!) I weigh the same as the OP and I use 100psi on the front using either type of tyre hence why I think your original advise might be wrong. Surely upping the pressure not only decreases contatct area but also doesn't allow the tyre to deform over bumps and ripples causing pattering and loss of contact with the road surface.

peter101cycle

Ah sorry, try this link http://sheldonbrown.com/tires.html

Also, I thought tubs run at lower pressures as I have read but I have never used them myself.

desweller

You'll get more traction with lower pressures as the surface of the tyre can deflect more; you get more surface area contact with the road as a result = more grip.

I'm 92kg and I run 100/110 F/R so I'd say your tyres are correctly inflated. You'll get a substantial reduction in ride quality if you run them any harder.

The tip about leading with the back brake on wet roads is a good one, particularly on new tarmac; it can stay quite slippery for a few months after it's initially layed.

But, fundamentally, it sounds like you went into the corner too fast! So I'm going for #6...

markos1963

peter101cycle wrote:

Ah sorry, try this link http://sheldonbrown.com/tires.html

Also, I thought tubs run at lower pressures as I have read but I have never used them myself.

Yes you can run tubs at lower pressures, I run my front at 95psi

Reading through the link I found this:

The part of the tire that is actually touching the ground at any moment is called the "contact patch." Generally, the area of the contact patch will be directly proportional to the weight load on the tire, and inversely proportional to the inflation pressure. For instance, if the rear tire of a bike is supporting a load of 100 lbs, and the tire is inflated to 100 PSI (pounds per square inch) the contact area of the tire will be roughly one square inch. If the pressure is reduced to 50 PSI, the tire will squish out until the contact patch has become 2 square inches (or until the rim bottoms out against the tire.)

So I'm not sure where you are coming from regarding upping pressure

OwenB

I feel your pain mate, I'm literally just in from having my first road crash ever. Totally my fault, coming up to a junction after a bend, going a bit too quick used the back brake first then let on the front but put on too much lost the front end on the leaves that covered the road then just as I thought I had got it back under control the front hit a nice smooth metal manhole cover and bang!

Managed to finish my ride slowly, but my elbow is cut up and my knee looks like a squashed pack of corned beef! Other than that I'm fine. Once I've had a brew I'm going to go out and check the bike over, the levers both bent inwards but I guess you expect that.

Fingers crossed its ok.

ddraver

Bad luck dude! Wrt Levers, Yes that's right, tighten them up so they don't move in normal use but so they do move in a crash - better they move than they break!!

MattC59

Stabilizers ?

dilemna

+1. Stabilisers, elbow and knee pads are in order.

Muffintop

I always sh1t it in the wet and almost get off and walk round the corners

a

Glad I'm not the only one who does this! I'm generally sh!t at cornering. I never feel like I've got enough room and even though I see the exit my arms don't want to turn the headset that way, I usually end up in a ditch, being gummed at by cows.

racingcondor

coldemm wrote:

I was wondering is my problem one of these:

1) tyre selection
2) rider weight
3)Bike handling
4)Tyre pressure
5)Age(see 2+3)
6)Normal occurance

Your advice would be welcome !

I've crashed twice in 6 years and one of those was caused by a pedestrian who thought it would be clever to cross the road between two parked busses. Last winter I crashed the same way you have.

In my opinion -
1) GP4000S grip better in the wet than pretty much anything else,
2) May have an impact but only as part of other factors. It may help you to run 25mm GP4000S though so you can drop the pressure a little.
3) I'm pretty sure you're cornering too fast on wet / leafy roads (I was),
4) See 2,
5) Just means you remember it more vividly! I remember the days when I bounced off things, unfortunately I'm passed them too,
6) If I can race at 3rd Cat and crash once avoidably in 50,000+ miles anyone can. Crashes will happen but to pretend it's not avoidable is foolish. Crash, yeah sure but learn from the mistake that caused it.

Heal up and take it easy for a while. You'll soon be back at it.